Hopefully constructive criticism regarding the current state of FFXIV

[Voryn]

That's what they want you to believe, in my opinion. I've played since HW and support jobs didn't use to be the brainless slop they are today, and people were doing fine.
…
I'd even dare and say that the less we confront players with some responsibilities per role, the more clueless they'll be whenever one crops up right in front of them.

HW was before my time (I started shortly before EW released) but I’m of a similar mindset that there’s a situation now that causes problems: players do not need to learn to play their role/job (or at least not past a very minimal degree for tanks and healers) to complete normal difficulty content. If someone isn’t interested in learning that much about how to play the game well, the game still appeals to them, but now normal difficulty content “needs” to be simple so they can do roulettes.

I personally would appreciate it if the game asked for more from the players when doing dungeons and other normal difficulty encounters, so it would be more fun for people like us who enjoy more challenge. But the game has two audiences, and to me it seems this is partially responsible for the criticism that there’s a lack of content. If someone likes easier games, what do they do now after the msq if there’s no new casual content yet? The recent patches haven’t given us many significant things to do other than FRU and Chaotic, which isn’t what they’re here for. The game has drawn in this audience but doesn’t meet their needs at the moment.

[Valence]

The reason for why people got through dungeons just fine before even though we could have some failures here and there was precisely because the system back then wasn't all about DDR binary mechanics, where you either fail a mechanic individually and die, or don't. If the mechanic is too punishing it becomes closer to savage and challenging optional content, and if it isn't, then it will probably not kill you anyway, and you end up with big snoozefest dungeons because nothing can truly happen to you, which removed all the friction and stress and people complained last expansion, especially when tank can't die anymore from being hit or standing bad stuff.

Now they decided to reintroduced stress in Yoshida's words, but of course by doubling down on their obsession with more DDR, faster paced mechanics that are overall more punishing to players again, the result being, you end up in dungeons like the Cenote where the healer or tank keep dying at every pushback because they're overwhelmed and you can't do jackshit about it. Tanks and healers can actually die from certain things now, because they added actual, instant kill mechanics if failed where even invincible jobs can fall. The devs have been literally playing with two ends of the same stick where one ends tries to prevent party wipes with the ShB/EW model by making tanks unkillable and healers irrelevant, and the other end with the DT model where some casual DDR mechanics will actually oneshot or twoshot you (even a tank) precisely to overcome that safety net they introduced before. It really feels like to me that they're doing some kind of arms race with themselves where safety becomes too predominant, instead of dialing it down, will instead buff lethality until it goes through again. This is also seen in higher end content by the way, with the uncontrolled spread of body checks everywhere after they removed most points of failure not attached to encounter mechanics (jobs, battle system, non DDR mechanics like in coils or HW), because those are the only remaining things that can still act as a true hurdle.

So we're back to square one with dungeons that can actually generate friction and failure (and player frustration) like Cenote with its end boss, but with a crappy lopsided system where tanks are invincible, healers useless, trash packs still asinine, and bosses more homogenized than ever. I don't think it's rocket science to see which model is superior, when in the past you could actually overcome the struggles of your party especially as a healer or tank (but even as a DPS by just nuking out of the threats faster), precisely because not everything was about binary DDR mechanics almost exclusively relying on individual execution. Tank wasn't positioning mobs properly in HW and was taking a crapton of crits from the back? Time for you as a healer to show your skills and keep them alive in spite of it. Tank kept losing aggro left and right? Healer could do something about it, DPS could also use their defensives to survive a little. Healer was out of mana because the DPS were taking ages to kill the mob packs (and probably running out of TP as well)? Time for you as a tank to play conservatively and show your skills in survival.

Good luck doing that when the tank keeps getting pushed off the platform those days. And those changes were supposed to alleviate tanxiety?

As for dungeon creativity, why can't we have epic and engaging story reversal and setbacks? You come across a bridge but it's lifted, NPCs keep fighting at the edge to keep it clear from a horde of pursuing enemies, while they yell at the party to climb up that tower and make a way through the enemies inside so the party can unlock the bridge mechanics at the top before moving on? They could do so many epic things like this... you know, it doesn't belong just in tabletop roleplaying games? Like, actual RPG video games do it very well too?

[Nero-Voidstails]

I think the dungeon should have more to explore I hate and loved the thousand maws of toto-Rak because you could get lost yes it was annoying but it felt like a dungeon.

or make a multi path dungeon with harder trash mobs like legit if you could give them more power like a boss without being one would be nice clashing aoes or tiny mechanics could be interesting or a overworld interaction make us do something not just being a visual story or well stabbing thing

[Basteala]

Honestly, for the casual fanbase, I think we really need to see a return of optional dungeons--with an appropriate award that would appeal to those players as well, and the MSQ needs more solo duties. I'm redoing DT's MSQ on one of my RP alts now and man--no one mentions it but even at the very beginning with the storm on the ship, that would have been a fun duty in ye olde times.

Optional dungeons also lets people ramp up the difficulty a little more without having to worry about every faceroller getting stuck in the MSQ because they can't handle something other than the box standard two tickle damage mobs.

Also, screaming hot take: ability prune. Healers and tanks both badly need it. Healers need more of a swap, some DPS abilities, less redundant healing CDs (both to make core healer job mechanics actually mean something and not to overwhelm newbies) and tanks need like...way less mit. Maybe it's different for the 1% in Ultimates, but you can cheese so much as a tank it makes things borderline braindead for tanks AND healers. And simply upping the damage just makes it unpleasant in the other direction if your tank or healer isn't as familiar with their job.

[Jeeqbit]

Honestly, for the casual fanbase, I think we really need to see a return of optional dungeons--with an appropriate award that would appeal to those players as well

But then if you think about it, we do get 3 optional dungeons: variant dungeons. The issue is hiding them away not even in a roulette and the NPC guide taking ages to appreciate the surroundings. And there are potential issues with how difficult they can make them when a DPS has to be able to tank them solo, although the last bosses were usually decently tough.

the MSQ needs more solo duties.

One thing I've thought is that, maybe due to the technology and graphics update, they haven't needed solo duties as much. Now that we can see NPCs follow us and we can follow them in the open world, it means we no longer need solo duties to achieve that.

The main benefit of solo duties now is if we are entering a special area we normally can't, or if the NPCs will be helping us fight, or if the enemy will have dungeon-like mechanics. But these things do make it more interesting than open world mobs.

[Basteala]

But then if you think about it, we do get 3 optional dungeons: variant dungeons. The issue is hiding them away not even in a roulette and the NPC guide taking ages to appreciate the surroundings. And there are potential issues with how difficult they can make them when a DPS has to be able to tank them solo, although the last bosses were usually decently tough.
One thing I've thought is that, maybe due to the technology and graphics update, they haven't needed solo duties as much. Now that we can see NPCs follow us and we can follow them in the open world, it means we no longer need solo duties to achieve that.

The main benefit of solo duties now is if we are entering a special area we normally can't, or if the NPCs will be helping us fight, or if the enemy will have dungeon-like mechanics. But these things do make it more interesting than open world mobs.

And I love variant dungeons, but accessibility is a thing, and as you said--they can't be readily accessed by roulette. And for tome grinding, they give out less, which people are going to care about as well.

Also where DT is concerned...where are they? I would be all over a variant dungeon if we had one by now.

The thing with Solo Duties for me is that it was a way to let players experience the story rather than have it all be passively observed through cutscenes. In a weird way, the over reliance on cutscenes to tell the story creates a "tell not show" dynamic with the stakes. "The storm was terrible, the battle against the Alexandrians in Tullyolall was a brutal one, take our word for it" kind of thing. It creates, I feel, a disconnect between the narrative and the player.

They could do that in the overworld with NPCs following us--that would be fine. But they need to....actually do that.

I think there was also the additional benefit in solo duties in having to do the content alone, and there's a sense of immersion from that. And--like you said--the enemies could have dungeon like mechanics. I think for me that's the key thing. The solo dungeons weren't *hard*, but they weren't absolutely braindead like overworld content is.

[Mikey_R]

The thing with Solo Duties for me is that it was a way to let players experience the story rather than have it all be passively observed through cutscenes. In a weird way, the over reliance on cutscenes to tell the story creates a "tell not show" dynamic with the stakes. "The storm was terrible, the battle against the Alexandrians in Tullyolall was a brutal one, take our word for it" kind of thing. It creates, I feel, a disconnect between the narrative and the player.

This was such an annoying thing in DT. The amount of times I was hyped up for a potential solo duty, only for it to be a cutscene. The absolute biggest offender is the attack on Tuliyollal. Going through the city to save citizens, just to be called to the palace to finish it up with a fight against Zoraal Ja. Up to this point, I don't think people of the New World really know how strong the Warrior of Light actually is, this would be a fight to show Zoraal Ja just how strong we really are.

So many moments ruined because we didn't participate.

[Basteala]

This was such an annoying thing in DT. The amount of times I was hyped up for a potential solo duty, only for it to be a cutscene. The absolute biggest offender is the attack on Tuliyollal. Going through the city to save citizens, just to be called to the palace to finish it up with a fight against Zoraal Ja. Up to this point, I don't think people of the New World really know how strong the Warrior of Light actually is, this would be a fight to show Zoraal Ja just how strong we really are.

So many moments ruined because we didn't participate.

Yeah. This is a thing I was thinking about with the PeluPelu quest when we're basically holding all the quest items when Wuk Lamat does all the work, but I really feel that--despite people's inability to voice it, it's not just that we're not the main character in DT--in EW Post we were arguably a supporting character too--but in DT it really feels like we're on hireling duty. NPC Duty.

[CidHeiral]

The dungeon bosses are better than ever but the space between the bosses could definitely use some work. The "pull two packs, AOE, pull two more packs, AOE, boss" formula is beyond stale.

[Valence]

Dungeons bosses are better? What changed?