Re: Regarding the Use of Third-Party Programs and Player Safety

[ExcellusUltimus]

So they think they can send account IDs to every client, so long as they don't show them in-game, and blame plugins?

What is this alternative reality I haven't heard of, in which the only programmers in existence are working for SE?

If you leave your keys in the car, and the car unlocked we generally still arrest the car-thief that steals it.

[Espon]

If you leave your keys in the car, and the car unlocked we generally still arrest the car-thief that steals it.

Arresting the thief afterwards does not prevent your car from being stolen in the first place.

You shouldn't focus on just punishing those that break the rules, you prevent them from breaking the rules in the first place. Anti-cheat does not fix the underlying problem which is the fact that AccountIDs are being given to the client.

[VerdeLuck]

Arresting the thief afterwards does not prevent your car from being stolen in the first place.

You shouldn't focus on just punishing those that break the rules, you prevent them from breaking the rules in the first place. Anti-cheat does not fix the underlying problem which is the fact that AccountIDs are being given to the client.

Anticheat fixes the underlying issue that the game's memory is entirely unsecured and able to be easily read and tampered with. This would not be as big of an issue for sure if there was more security preventing mods and plugins in this game.

[Chaincat]

Anticheat fixes the underlying issue that the game's memory is entirely unsecured and able to be easily read and tampered with. This would not be as big of an issue for sure if there was more security preventing mods and plugins in this game.

Anticheat does nothing to encrypt or secure the game's memory. It just prevents you from tampering with it as easily as we currently can.

[VerdeLuck]

Anticheat does nothing to encrypt or secure the game's memory. It just prevents you from tampering with it as easily as we currently can.

Lmao what do you think anticheat does? it scans for files and memory that's been tampered with and checks if anything other than the ffxiv program is accessing the memory allocated to ffxiv.
Securing the memory is like 99% of what anticheat does.

[Rehayem]

Lmao what do you think anticheat does? it scans for files and memory that's been tampered with and checks if anything other than the ffxiv program is accessing the memory allocated to ffxiv.
Securing the memory is like 99% of what anticheat does.

The current issue with the ID's placed on account is being sent through network to your client, meaning anti-cheat wouldn't prevent someone from making a standalone app to harvest the data.

[ExcellusUltimus]

Lmao what do you think anticheat does? it scans for files and memory that's been tampered with and checks if anything other than the ffxiv program is accessing the memory allocated to ffxiv.
Securing the memory is like 99% of what anticheat does.

It would appear we're discussing this with people who third party programs and are unwilling to stop.

[Chaincat]

It would appear we're discussing this with people who third party programs and are unwilling to stop.

I want the issue solved as well. Adding an anti-cheat doesn't solve the problem. Cracking down on a single plugin doesn't solve the problem. Not sharing the information with the client solves the problem.

[VeyaAkemi]

It would appear we're discussing this with people who third party programs and are unwilling to stop.

This post has the same energy as "the only reason to not let the cops search your house whenever they want is if you are a criminal"...

The point that you are ignoring is that there are many examples of how bad anti-cheat is at stopping actual cheating, the people who care about cheating will just figure out a workaround, and it becomes an arms race between cheaters and devs, which devs invariably lose because there is a limit to how much they can do without heavily inconveniencing their actual costumer base, the person you'd hit with an anti-cheat is the guy who wants his Hrothgar to stand upright, the guy who wants his Viera to wear a hat, and yes, even the modbeast who wants their Miqo'te to have a futa shlong longer than her torso, which regardless what pearl-clutching puritans will say, is completely harmless, nothing substantive will be gained, and the game will lose a sizeable chunk of revenue, that's what anti-cheats do, not what you want them to do.

[tank2fish]

Anticheat fixes the underlying issue that the game's memory is entirely unsecured and able to be easily read and tampered with. This would not be as big of an issue for sure if there was more security preventing mods and plugins in this game.

As numerous people have already said, adding kernel-level anticheat does nothing. The game's network traffic gives out the IDs. Whatever people use to grab them doesn't interact with the game data or files, or even memory. It interacts with the network traffic. Further, this can be done even if you play on console. Run whatever program they use to grab the data on your PC in the same WLAN and you have it. All the plugin does is make it easier for the vast majority of people to grab it, but it is literally trivial to access that data without plugins. This is not a defense of plugins, mind you, I am trying to emphasize this point because everyone is so focused on plugins and missing the core point.

SE needs to change things so account IDs are not easily plucked out of network traffic. So many people in this thread are more concerned with kicking off people who use third party plugins, and forgive me for being rude but it is the stalking and player safety that's a way bigger issue here. It just seems to me that that core problem is not at all being taken seriously, and instead we're cutting off our noses to spite our face. Something as invasive as kernel-level anticheats are not something anyone should want on their system, whether to play this game or any other, but so many people in here are demanding it when it, again, does not address the issue.

You argue that it raises the barrier to entry but I argue it doesn't. There are always bad actors out there, and at the bare minimum no one should be sending data to the client that they cannot trust the client to have.