fflogs and privacy

[Aravell]

I don't get why people always say stuff like this doesn't work if you have an opt-in system, it's very easy to just mark everyone that didn't opt-in as anonymous.

The data will all be there and you can use it just fine, you just will not be able to look up someone and stalk their logs if they don't opt-in.

[CaedemSanguis]

Well it's very usefull to see someone's background for high end pve stuff (and in game harassment is forbidden anyway)

if it bothers you that much, just sign in and hide your logs (but again hiding logs is also an information)

[Saraide]

As you may know fflogs doesn't work on an opt-in model: you have to actually register to opt-out and have your pages set to private, and in fact data about your character and performance is stored and displayed publicly without any consent for everyone unregistered. After seeing that fiasco with that third party mod exploiting the blacklist system, and fflogs also working on a similar opt-in model, this reminded me that I've always found this a little concerning in the first place.

I know SE has little control over external websites, but I do think they still hold some modicum of power into what that can declare "cool" or "not cool".

I'd respectfully ask SE if we can finally have a piece of their mind on this. Thanks.

I thought you just needed to put -fflogs-hidden- or something like that in on your lodestone.

[AnnRam]

Rofl.

SE allows people to basically modify(pay mods also) the entire game and ALSO synchronize it with other people in real time + RMT+Botting since years and you expect to do something about external websites.

[technole]

It's an MMO, your character name and origin is in the network logs if you play with anyone. The only way to avoid is not play with anyone if we really want to honest. If anyone harasses you about such things here on the OF or in-game, it is reportable and it will be dealt with.

Many players also find logs useful because it can prove their progression point for when they want to join a clear group for example, as they can be uploaded even if you wipe or don't clear content.

[AmiableApkallu]

I thought you just needed to put -fflogs-hidden- or something like that in on your lodestone.

That is correct:

To hide your character on FFLogs, you don't even have to make an account. Simply log in to your character on Lodestone. In the Profile section of your character add the following code: fflogs-hidden.

This doesn't address the primary concern of opt-in vs. opt-out, but at least you don't have to register for yet another account on yet another website if you don't want to.

[Exmo]

It's an MMO, your character name and origin is in the network logs if you play with anyone. The only way to avoid is not play with anyone if we really want to honest. If anyone harasses you about such things here on the OF or in-game, it is reportable and it will be dealt with.

This is all true regarding the stalker plugin too. It's fair to say the community has a double standard as to which invasive data collection they find acceptable.

[VeyaAkemi]

It's fair to say the community has a double standard as to which invasive data collection they find acceptable.

The stalker plogon has no excuse other than stalking, FFLogs has a more explicit, purposeful use, in the end most people are pragmatic, and care not for what is being done, only for what it is being done for.

[ForteNightshade]

As you may know fflogs doesn't work on an opt-in model: you have to actually register to opt-out and have your pages set to private, and in fact data about your character and performance is stored and displayed publicly without any consent for everyone unregistered. After seeing that fiasco with that third party mod exploiting the blacklist system, and fflogs also working on a similar opt-in model, this reminded me that I've always found this a little concerning in the first place.

You're trying to conflate two very difference circumstances here.

Your performance in a raid isn't private information nor do you own it. FFlogs simply takes numbers, calculates them and gives a percentile based on the results. The plugin you're trying to compare this with hitching onto your unique ID to find all retainer information, alts and essentially exposes information for the sole purpose of revealing your in-game identity. Bluntly stated, FFlogs is utilitarian in what it aims to accomplish, especially in a game so driven by DPS. Whereas the plugin is potentially insidious and serves little practical purpose beyond that.

well, I am sure that they dont get the information out of the aether, so that means that they are accessing FFXIV information from the servers.

SE, since they are THEIR servers could close that loophole.

they dont need to control the external website at all... they need to control their own information on their own servers

As others have said, all ACT does is take the mess that is our battle log, which is client side and regurgitate that data into a readable format. FFlogs takes it a step further by breaking everything down. The only way SE could stop this would be encrypting encounter data so it no longer is sent client side, but then ACT would simply be updated to get around that. In other words, it'll turn into an arms' race SE won't ever win.

[TaleraRistain]

I don't get why people always say stuff like this doesn't work if you have an opt-in system, it's very easy to just mark everyone that didn't opt-in as anonymous.

The data will all be there and you can use it just fine, you just will not be able to look up someone and stalk their logs if they don't opt-in.

Yeah this the way they should have done it. It should be an active choice to expose your logs and just have the data anonymous for anyone who doesn't need to. It is a useful tool and we as a community should be pushing them and creators of other tools we deem useful to be something that players opt-in to use.

To the OP, this is really a community issue that we have to solve ourselves. SE has no say over external websites. And even though Yoshi-P knows they're out there any official acknowledgement could be misconstrued as allowing the add-on that gets the information. So this is an instance where we need to clean up our own house.