Thread: The issue with Dawntrail and importance of 8.0

Originally Posted by Exmo

That's not remotely what I said but thank you for trying, I appreciate the effort.

It pretty much is what you said though.

Originally Posted by Clockworks

It pretty much is what you said though.

Woosh the point right above your head

Originally Posted by Exmo

For fun I did a super quick check for steam reviews of FFXIV

DT = 4300 reviews, slightly less than half liked it (ie 2k)
EW = 1300 reviews, most liked it
ShB = 800 reviews, most liked it

Don't you think it's odd how the count for DT is three times more than that of EW? That's such a suspicious uptick.

The fact that DT has double the number of positive reviews as EW is also notable and funny, as if people go out of their way to counter negative reviews which go out of their way to counter positive reviews. This whole thing seems manufactured as sin. I don't know how anyone can look at the state of this and think it's organic.

People are more likely to express their discontent than the other way around, it's as simple as that.

Like it or not, but Dawntrail is the first time that much people have been disappointed, that much being probably the majority of players, so it's the first time so many expressed their disappointment. And I'm not saying that the majority thought of Dawntrail as bad as a whole, that's probably not the case (it's not for me for example), but disappointed, that I'm sure of it.

Every metric is showing that, press scores at it's lowest since Realm Reborn, user scores, content creators, even reddit is no longer a place where it's nearly impossible to say anything bad about the game - a think I would have thought impossible a few months ago.

I will not pretend that there isn't some fake reviews in those user scores, but trust me as someone who is a fan of Bioware and who liked Veilguard, Dawntrail isn't even close to have been a target of "raid of false reviews for bad reasons (politics, griters & co)".

I would say even worse for Dawntrail, Steam is a proof that it's not that easy to do it, since even Veilguard that is the target of an insane amount hate is above Dawntrail in user score.

Originally Posted by Zackneifein

People are more likely to express their discontent than the other way around, it's as simple as that.

Like it or not, but Dawntrail is the first time that much people have been disappointed, that much being probably the majority of players, so it's the first time so many expressed their disappointment. And I'm not saying that the majority thought of Dawntrail as bad as a whole, that's probably not the case (it's not for me for example), but disappointed, that I'm sure of it.

Every metric is showing that, press scores at it's lowest since Realm Reborn, user scores, content creators, even reddit is no longer a place where it's nearly impossible to say anything bad about the game - a think I would have thought impossible a few months ago.

I will not pretend that there isn't some fake reviews in those user scores, but trust me as someone who is a fan of Bioware and who liked Veilguard, Dawntrail isn't even close to have been a target of "raid of false reviews for bad reasons (politics, griters & co)".

I would say even worse for Dawntrail, Steam is a proof that it's not that easy to do it, since even Veilguard that is the target of an insane amount hate is above Dawntrail in user score.

We're getting a bit off topic here but my impression was the hate against Veilguard was a flash in the pan whereas the hate for DT has been more sustained. That could be for a number of reasons, eg Veilguard is not a live game, Veilguard fizzled out of the news cycle very quickly, Dragon Age has a long history of LGBTQ+, the wrong people found Veilguard a less appealing vector for their little crusade, Veilguard has more popular appeal to a wider audience than the latest expansion of a MMO JRPG so hits a different audience (its steam review count dwarfs that of DT) etc. But this is just a general impression of the hate campaign against Veilguard, it's not like I have numbers or reports to back it up, so we might just agree to disagree on that point.

Regarding press scores, ARR has a metacritic score of 86, DT of 79. It's lower but still "generally favorable" and supports the argument that the vast majority enjoyed it. (Caveat about using Metacritic scores as a signifier of anything other than an aggregation of certain numbers arrived at by corporate press, yadda yadda.)

Originally Posted by Clockworks

You keep talking about steam reviews but also chose to ignore the fact that the steam population for FFXIV has dwindled by almost a third. Proven by actual numbers.

Make it make sense.

Hi, it should be clear by now that I don't engage in bad faith discussions so sorry, not going to do that. There are other threads in this forum where that topic is discussed. You might find your answers there.

Originally Posted by Exmo

Hi, it should be clear by now that I don't engage in bad faith discussions so sorry, not going to do that. There are other threads in this forum where that topic is discussed. You might find your answers there.

So you only pick the conversations you want and then refuse any other conversation that doesnt apply (in your mind), basically you want an echo chamber.

Noted.

Originally Posted by Clockworks

So you only pick the conversations you want and then refuse any other conversation that doesnt apply (in your mind), basically you want an echo chamber.

Noted.

That's not what an echo chamber is. I'm happy to have conversations with people whose opinion I disagree with, as evidenced just a few messages ago. But yes, I won't have a conversation with someone who, for example, is repeatedly aggravating, hostile, mocking, disingenuous, as that would be a waste of time (sometimes fun but let's be real here).

Once again, Dawntrail was a lot of fun and is a pretty smart game in some respects. It has flaws but overall I enjoyed much of its storytelling. I hope people here can react to this opinion in a normal way that doesn't make this place look like an echo chamber.

Originally Posted by Clockworks

So you only pick the conversations you want and then refuse any other conversation that doesnt apply (in your mind), basically you want an echo chamber.

Noted.

Pretty much the forums. It's one big echo chamber. Are you new here?