Chaotic Alliance Raid: More Content for Professional Gamers

[BristolRuss]

Is your source "trust me bro"? why should your percentage be believed over Hastatus's?

https://luckybancho.ldblog.jp/wsurvey.htm?world=Global

The latest Lucky Bancho survey includes data up to Christmas Eve this year. It shows that the latest Savage mount is the 158th most popular mount and has been acquired by 15% of the active population (defined below). Please note that not everybody who has cleared the fight will have the mount, so the percentage who have cleared the latest Savage is higher than 15%.

Active population defined as:

"In the following survey, unless otherwise noted, character data was collected from the list of characters who are level 70 or above or belong to a FC in the search results obtained from the character search on the official website as of December 24, 2024. Characters who are level 70 or above (excluding those exactly at 70) whose HP, experience points, number of owned minions, and number of owned mounts have changed since the previous survey on November 4, 2024 are considered to be active characters, and the data was collected by narrowing it down to characters with one or more acquired mounts to exclude bot characters. "

[Jeeqbit]

Looking at the Achievement seems the less indirect way?

Yes, that's why I bother to get it. I didn't really notice a way to see that on FFXIVCollect before.

The ratio of clearing M4 to M4S doesn't say much because then you'd have to correct for the casuals that already consider current extremes a high-end content that they do not engage with, so that number is skewed by the very phenomenon that you're trying to figure out.

Nothing needs correcting. It's a pretty good stat because:

• Everyone who cleared the Normal mode is someone who could potentially have tried the Savage version.
• Those who didn't even set foot in the Savage version are at least active enough at the endgame to have done the Normal version. If they didn't, then what are they doing? As everyone says, it's done-in-a-day content so if they're so casual they didn't do it, then they're not worth including in the stats.
• It's not fair to count people who didn't engage with the Normal version, who didn't beat Dawntrail MSQ or who are on the Free Trial, because they can't possibly clear it and including those players is just a way for people to argue it's only a fraction of players clearing. Not really fair to include people who are incapable of it due to not beating MSQ.

If it is against people registered with FFXIVCollections, then it would introduce a whole new skew which is that only the non-casuals are on that site in the first place.

It's people with achievements enabled, for the achievement stat. The mount/minion comparison does not require achievements enabled. Also, Lucky Bancho has similar overall stats which just compare Savage cleared to overall Active Characters (people who are beyond Free Trial status) and it's similar.

Actually, when Lucky Bancho compares Savage vs Normal clears, it's as high as a 50% rate in JP, but dwindles to 30% on Aether.

https://livedoor.blogimg.jp/luckyban...f/bf3752c9.png

(The first % is comparing Savage to Active Characters (>free trial) clears, and the second % is comparing Savage vs Normal clears)

Any way we calculate this it's way higher than 1%, even on Dynamis and Materia.

[Hastatus]

Sorry. I'm not trying to be a statistician. I was trying to use fewer characters (i.e. words). "The one percent" is a frequent literary idiom referencing an older (but still relevant) idea where the top one percentage of society has the money, power and influence over "the 99%" which are the ordinary people. It doesn't have to mathematically mean exactly 1%. It's a figurative way of expressing a power dynamic differentiating a minority and a majority within a population. I think you could call this an idiomatic moniker or idiomatic epithet? I was also alluding to the happiness of social media influencers who would have content to use on their platforms, some of whom will use it to reenforce their status as "the one percent" of the player base. I am not a big fan of social media influencers because they can make or break content and many followers will accept those views. Chaotic is currently great content for them so they are very likely to hype and praise it but viewers/followers have to be excessively critical of how the level of difficulty is interpreted and transmitted by those influencers who go into these raids like it is a job, which it is. One way of bragging is to say that something is easier than it is.

I am perturbed by the idea that happiness and completion of content seem so tightly bound. I've heard many people who completed content say 'happy that it is over' and 'never again'. I don't consider these people to necessarily be happy with the content they had just completed.

I'm happy that there are probably way more than 1% (numerical) of players who are happy with this Chaotic. I am happy that it exists. I would be even happier if there were a simultaneously-existing, less-difficult, but still-challenging version that would make more people happy.

[Lilapop]

https://luckybancho.ldblog.jp/wsurvey.htm?world=Global

The latest Lucky Bancho survey includes data up to Christmas Eve this year. It shows that the latest Savage mount is the 158th most popular mount and has been acquired by 15% of the active population (defined below). Please note that not everybody who has cleared the fight will have the mount, so the percentage who have cleared the latest Savage is higher than 15%.

Active population defined as:

"In the following survey, unless otherwise noted, character data was collected from the list of characters who are level 70 or above or belong to a FC in the search results obtained from the character search on the official website as of December 24, 2024. Characters who are level 70 or above (excluding those exactly at 70) whose HP, experience points, number of owned minions, and number of owned mounts have changed since the previous survey on November 4, 2024 are considered to be active characters, and the data was collected by narrowing it down to characters with one or more acquired mounts to exclude bot characters. "

Happy at least someone provided some type of statistics.

[AllenThyl]

Sorry. I'm not trying to be a statistician. I was trying to use fewer characters (i.e. words). "The one percent" is a frequent literary idiom referencing an older (but still relevant) idea where the top one percentage of society has the money, power and influence over "the 99%" which are the ordinary people. It doesn't have to mathematically mean exactly 1%. It's a figurative way of expressing a power dynamic differentiating a minority and a majority within a population. I think you could call this an idiomatic moniker or idiomatic epithet? I was also alluding to the happiness of social media influencers who would have content to use on their platforms, some of whom will use it to reenforce their status as "the one percent" of the player base. I am not a big fan of social media influencers because they can make or break content and many followers will accept those views. Chaotic is currently great content for them so they are very likely to hype and praise it but viewers/followers have to be excessively critical of how the level of difficulty is interpreted and transmitted by those influencers who go into these raids like it is a job, which it is. One way of bragging is to say that something is easier than it is.

But that is precisely the point with this kind of rhetoric and hyperbole, it doesn't accurately describe the player base. And that's not only about the numbers, but also about the implications as if the playerbase that engages in this kind of content is some kind of evil conspiratory cabal instead of just ... people playing the game. Especially when the whole genre of combat oriented MMORPGs traditionally featured difficult combat content at whatever the current endgame is, which for a lot of people is the whole argument for buying into such a game in the first place!

It's okay to find this content not to one's liking, or have issues with the difficulty, or wanting it to be different, or any of that. But what isn't acceptable is to just slag on a whole chunk of the playerbase, like they aren't people themselves. Another thread had "do raiders even care about hairstyles?" as a legit statement. The same is true for misrepresenting the social dynamic in PF when people make groups with whatever rules they want to do. It's worrying how many people see others minding their own business as "exclusion" and "discrimination". If a sports team wants to organize and train to participate in some tournament, then they don't just take any random person along for the last team slot just because. Why is it only in video games that's such a hard concept to grasp and understand, because people pay for it?

[Eyrilona]

Especially when the whole genre of combat oriented MMORPGs traditionally featured difficult combat content at whatever the current endgame is, which for a lot of people is the whole argument for buying into such a game in the first place!

Since when was FFXIV a combat oriented MMORPG though? Last time I checked, it was established as a title in the famous Storytelling JRPG game series Final Fantasy, but with MMO features.

[Mawlzy]

Since when was FFXIV a combat oriented MMORPG though? Last time I checked, it was established as a title in the famous Storytelling JRPG game series Final Fantasy, but with MMO features.

There's a subset of contributors here who like to redefine what FF14 is so it better aligns with their prejudices and preferences.

I'd suggest a more productive approach to these discussions is that there are many ways to play FF14, and among those multiple playstyles, one is currently getting far more content than all the others.

[AllenThyl]

Since when was FFXIV a combat oriented MMORPG though? Last time I checked, it was established as a title in the famous Storytelling JRPG game series Final Fantasy, but with MMO features.

Please, that argument is just as dishonest as the "1%" one. Which classes are you progressing the story on? Combat classes. You don't even have a choice, the game forces you. It also forces you reach certain level and gear milestones to progress. It forces you to choose a starting combat class when you create a character, and forces you to play only on that class, doing combat activities like killing enemies for quite a while as well. Unlocking non-combat activities except for "standing around in the starter cities" is also locked behind reaching certain levels with at least one combat class or MSQ progression. Yes, this is first and foremost, a combat MMORPG. And we are talking about a combat duty here. And not just any duty, but one for endgame characters. When a new major patch releases, it also always features new combat content first and foremost, everything else comes secondary.

Edit: I mean, it's no surprise when a large number of the community feels categorically disappointed every patch by the released combat content, when they don't even think that combat is the main activity of this game in the first place. I mean, that is literally the going to McDonalds and ordering a BigMac meme right here. Just as you don't get seafood in a shop for hiking gear. At some point, expectations have to be managed.

[Eyrilona]

Please, that argument is just as dishonest as the "1%" one. Which classes are you progressing the story on? Combat classes. You don't even have a choice, the game forces you. It also forces you reach certain level and gear milestones to progress. It forces you to choose a starting combat class when you create a character, and forces you to play only on that class, doing combat activities like killing enemies for quite a while as well. Unlocking non-combat activities except for "standing around in the starter cities" is also locked behind reaching certain levels with at least one combat class or MSQ progression. Yes, this is first and foremost, a combat MMORPG. And we are talking about a combat duty here. And not just any duty, but one for endgame characters. When a new major patch releases, it also always features new combat content first and foremost, everything else comes secondary.

The core of FFXIV upon release was to play through the narrative. It didn't even have a Savage mode or an Ultimate yet, those were game modes tacked on later after some experimentation just as a thing to see how far they could push it, but in the entire Final Fantasy series such special optional battles have always been entirely optional side content, often located on isolated islands on the world that could only be visited in the very last chapters of the game. This game was not sold as a combat-first game. The goal of the game was to experience the adventure of getting to explore Eorzea and repel the threat of the Garlemald Empire. It was never about defeating the Ultima Weapon at its highest possible difficulty.

That lately we have only received some very underwhelming narrative, no exploration, and nothing really to do outside of raiding, is a sign that this high-end combat side content has hijacked the entire direction of the game, but it does NOT make it mean that we all opted in for that when we bought what you now want to call a primarily "combat oriented" game.

For your "Combat oriented", I will raise you a "Storytelling oriented", an "Exploration oriented", a "Community oriented", even a "Best online Mahjong simulator around", and a lot of other things that could make equal claim to being the soul of FFXIV.

[Mawlzy]

For your "Combat oriented", I will raise you a "Storytelling oriented", an "Exploration oriented", a "Community oriented", even a "Best online Mahjong simulator around", and a lot of other things that could make equal claim to being the soul of FFXIV.

*cough* Mahjong might be pushing it a bit, but gave me a chuckle. But you're absolutely correct. There are many players in this game who regard the required combat content as an unfortunate and unwanted impediment to playing the game the way they choose.

And ironically, I imagine those who do see this as a combat-oriented game would argue MSQ combat barely rises to the level of combat at all, on the grounds it only requires "two braincells."