Thread: 7.15 Patch Notes - PvP

Originally Posted by Mawlzy

On Aether I've been in multiple matches not only with no DRKs, but also with no tanks at all. SE sure has some novel ideas about balance.

It's almost like the balance of the jobs isn't taking Frontlines into account.
EDIT: Let's hope whatever role actions they are cooking up are actually going to help.

Paladin seem strong on paper, until you hit the diamond/crystal queue and cover targets at 0MP that do not want to use elixir to be full again. And with no chat available, you can't tell them either.
Quality of player would probably rise if they are allowed to talk with each other...Just warn and ban them if they are too toxic...But with the current playerbase, I don't think that would even be a thing.

That's super odd, I've rarely seen people not immediately pop elixirs when being covered past plat/diamond...

Originally Posted by Commander_Justitia

Paladin seem strong on paper, until you hit the diamond/crystal queue and cover targets at 0MP that do not want to use elixir to be full again. And with no chat available, you can't tell them either.
Quality of player would probably rise if they are allowed to talk with each other...Just warn and ban them if they are too toxic...But with the current playerbase, I don't think that would even be a thing.

A lot of issues could be fixed with proper moderation. I have next to no trust in the current system they have due Season 2 having an obvious wintrader and it took them 2 weeks with reports from 30+ people to actually take an action. So many games ruined and the perperator only got a slap on wrist with their points removed as they were back in queue (this time without their trader friend) in less than week.

Originally Posted by Aidorouge

Yeah, though I can't imagine MCH doing much better in Crystalline Conflict when it's easier to zero in and burst down a job that can't really defend its self with no escapes (and teammates are not there to peel or heal, it's every man for themselves), or that being ranged relies on enemies keeping their distance/being unaware of your presence in a mode where everyone is gathered at one relatively small spot at all times.

Though I guess the Drill damage might help in securing a kill in said close-space where all it takes is a little more damage to deny someone a medicine kit, or one death to start the respawn conga line.
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The thing is, I really hate that they've gone hard on the meme of making Wildfire a large part of our damage because I've yet to reliably kill anyone with that either because most jobs can take all the shots/explosion and still walk it off (and the movement speed boost means nothing when it's not on-command and every kind of CC will stop you cold anyway).

It's like the problem MCH has in PVE (subpar damage, zero utility) has come full-circle to PVP, but while I don't care about being "competitive" in PVE as I don't do hardcore content, I DO care about that here in PVP where the only reason we're not the worst DPS is because we're not melee, but at the same time our shortest range skills are some of the worst not just because of an increased inability to use them with all the ranged jobs staying away, but even when you CAN use them, Bioblaster is a dud (even with Analysis) and knockback doesn't help when they can still reach you anyway.

The lack of melee, especially tanks, just makes it more obvious we have virtually nothing to save ourselves in a jam, and my DPS is at the whim of hard-rotation while other ranged jobs can just spam all day and then skip away.

I main MCH and even in crystal it's fine. It feels more survivable than last expansion with the HP increases, and the LB can still be used as a punitive tool (or just stun into LB, this is still a good combination to burst). It has more constraints than it used to, but it's still lethal. The WF burst is quite more lethal on the other hand, and probably the highest burst in the game even though WF still acts as a red flag for a knowledgeable opponent. If anything, it will enable a guard check which isn't a loss. The amount of AoE pressure the job has gained is pretty crazy as well. I have yet to try with the Drill buff but I don't think this is going to change that much but sometimes a 2k difference can be the difference between a live target and a dead target.

This is a team game, you're not supposed to solo kill people. WF burst is still imo the biggest alpha burst in pvp right now (some other jobs sequences may be higher on a sustained level but that's completely different and not a burst per se, and MCH is also pretty decent at sustained damage with FMF/blazing shot spamm or double hit scatter). It also possible to line up absolutely wild damage alphas with just analyzed chainsaw into WF LB which can oneshot almost every job without mitigation in the game but tanks.

Saying that MCH has no utility in pvp is weird to me. Analyzed Chainsaw is a thing, Anchor (analyzed or not) is a thing, and bishop is also a thing (and a pretty damn good one at that). Obviously in FL it will differ, the turret is not as good, although anchor no matter how used, is absolutely lethal in a mode where the smallest delay can mean that the angry enemy blob will catch you and murder you, and analyzed chainsaw I guess is... very dependent on how it gets used and who actually profits out of it or not. I do feel that the LB in FL is still as good or close to it as like before it asks you to farm your BH up enough so that you can actually do decent damage with it, but you have a lot more AoE tools to leech on assists everywhere with notably FMF from afar which should mean getting high BH provided you don't die, should be easier. Stun anchor into LB and delete ranged squishies or punish them. Since it's a ranged meta, I'd say that current MCH LB plays pretty well into it, because melees have always been an absolute pain to even harm with it anyway.

Originally Posted by pecorino

From the Frontline perspective, it's fantastic to see AST's continued fall from grace. They've been running this game mode for years and it's about time that ends.

I'm a bit perplexed by the Pictomancer buffs, though. PCT is already really strong in this mode because it has incredible AoE burst damage, which includes an AoE bind, and yet they receive buffs in every patch. If this keeps up, look forward to DRK/PCT dominance in future seasons.

Oh my sides, thanks for the good laugh, ASTs have been running the game mode for years?

And, no, not surprised that PCT got some buffs, - and no, they didn't get buffed initially, the devs waited to buff them, as a new job, that made sense.

Originally Posted by Valence

That's super odd, I've rarely seen people not immediately pop elixirs when being covered past plat/diamond...

I guess if you queue midnight to early morning it is often PvP players who know what to do. Before that you get newbies that want to try how far they can get in their first season (Spoiler: Crystal). And then it becomes a game of "Why should I cover this player, I better save it for someone who uses elixir" and at that point knowledge about individual players becomes more important than skill. Fighting the matchmaking over skill. Absurdity.

I always queue between mid afternoon to mid evening. I have no idea how EU is in the middle of the night. Queues already seem to peter out past eleven or so...

Originally Posted by Commander_Justitia

Paladin seem strong on paper, until you hit the diamond/crystal queue and cover targets at 0MP that do not want to use elixir to be full again. And with no chat available, you can't tell them either.
Quality of player would probably rise if they are allowed to talk with each other...Just warn and ban them if they are too toxic...But with the current playerbase, I don't think that would even be a thing.

I am playing NA ranked at diamond+ on paladin and get overall good return on investment on my covers. Got to say my experience is radically different.

I do occasionally cover people who are clueless but you'll always get people who get into the higher ranks who are still learning (like yours truly).