Request for HC characters

[Amarande]

When the tank mistimes the tank LB...

Yeah, raids in general don't really fit well with the "hardcore character" design idea.

Even in WoW Classic, it's only really viable because

a) raiding is the actual END of the game: the big thing in Vanilla was the journey from 1 to 60 with raiding being basically add-on content for people afterwards, unlike the modern MMO paradigm where raiding is usually considered the main oeuvre and everything before it as an extended tutorial, a chore to complain to the devs for shortening, or heck, sometimes both. This puts it a significant degree closer to Diablo's idea

b) fiddly mechanics were quite a bit less common even at endgame. I seem to remember it wasn't really till BWL that anything not really "ordinary" was attempted (although that's already the beginning of the end of "HC" because of Vaelestrasz in particular). It works poorly with modern raiding because so much is now based on trial and error and fail it till you make it design (I have mulled this over a fair bit. Pretty sure it is in fact to increase the amount of time needed to clear because farm time is so abbreviated now with smaller groups and more generous loot)

c) it's not actually permadeath, as dead WoW HC characters instead are simply forced to make a (free) retirement transfer to a regular Classic Era server.

[EddardStark]

Those are all really good points. I started hardcore in diablo 2 back in the day, all the way up to honor mode bg3, divinity 2, wow, minecraft... so that's my basis for the question. I didn't really see the risk of dungeons and raids being a problem... just part of the fun.

But all things considered, I see how many of the points would be valid to most of the playerbase.

[Mercury_Grey]

I just ahve to say that would most likely destroy FFXIV if they make a hardcore version, or made it so your character is deleted. for example what if you get the BiS at 100 from the last raid of arcadia. But your character dies due to sudden lag. You lose months or even a year or 2 of progress

[Reimmi]

You legit just suggested perma death in an mmo? No, the end. This is such a bad idea on so many surface level obvious ways it isn't even worth responding to almost. There are mmo's that have this, and they are beyond niche with extremely tiny player bases. There is a lot of reasons for that.

If SE wants "harder content" all they need to do is add optional modes for some content that force the minimum I level while maybe also adding extra or harder mechanics. Which they wont, because they tried harder content in Endwalker and no one played it.

It would be optional lol
i don't think it'd fit this game though because the game is piss easy unless you're doing savage raids and stuff. you will never die in the open world unless a hunt mob decides to kill you

[Asako]

I don't understand, we already can do this, if you die log out and create new character. Nothing stopping you.

[VeyaAkemi]

If someone was really inclined for this, they'd be better off making it a self-imposed challenge rather than Square spending resources towards a system that very, very few people would actually try. This game just wasn't intended for any kind of hardcore perma-death options.

There have been similar challenges before, I know back during the EW lull period, someone did a "ARR to EW without teleport" challenge, the answer is that, technically no, because after the initial trip to Thavnair, you are forced to teleport out of there since you don't have access to Radz-at-Han yet to take the Airship out, but outside of that precise circumstance, you can complete the 5 expansions worth of story without ever teleporting around, and I imagine DT would qualify too, I can't remember a single instance where I *had* to teleport during DT.

[ArchlordPie]

There have been similar challenges before, I know back during the EW lull period, someone did a "ARR to EW without teleport" challenge, the answer is that, technically no, because after the initial trip to Thavnair, you are forced to teleport out of there since you don't have access to Radz-at-Han yet to take the Airship out, but outside of that precise circumstance, you can complete the 5 expansions worth of story without ever teleporting around, and I imagine DT would qualify too, I can't remember a single instance where I *had* to teleport during DT.

Can't you just take the boat back to Sharlayan or Limsa or wherever? Or was that "that ONE zone" where you had to get there via Estinien teleporting you or something?

[VeyaAkemi]

Can't you just take the boat back to Sharlayan or Limsa or wherever? Or was that "that ONE zone" where you had to get there via Estinien teleporting you or something?

Yeah the first half, you use an experimental Aetheryte to get there, and this does not break the rules because it's beyond player action plus the game has a lot of instances where it just moves you, but then since you, story-wise, teleported in, the game expects you to teleport out, and that breaks the rule because even if you don't have the choice it's still a player action. Technically you can avoid using an actual teleport by dying and reviving at wherever your respawn point is, assuming you didn't set it to be Yedlihmad/The Great Work, but that breaks the rule in spirit, and it's like, if that's a self-enforced challenge, rule lawyering it like this is pointless, right?

I have a silly self-enforced challenge myself, where I will occasionally, at least once a week but also whenever I am feeling it, I will que for M2N, and play up a WWF-style rivalry between myself and Honey, if I ever get a Vul stack, she wins the match, if I get none, I win, and if I get to 3 hearts and become mesmerized, she takes it all, with some clauses to account for becoming mesmerized due to not being my mistake, but party failure, it's a silly RP thing but it amuses me enough.