Still no auto-combo for 123 on old jobs.

[BigCheez]

The problem is that a lot of people want to turn jobs into other jobs in some attempt to chase this ever elusive "complexity".

There's people that want to turn NIN into a Dex-using SAM complete with castbars. There's people that want to turn SMN & RDM into no-rez, slow-cast boomy casters like BLM. There's people that want to turn MCH into a "hundred spinning plates support job" like BRD, and each and every time they say the same thing about "friction" to justify wanting such changes all while not realizing that they're basically asking for the dreaded "homogenization" they complain about, except they're fine when it caters to *THEIR* way of playing with little to no regard to others. (I for one would absolutely hate if NIN/MCH/SMN/RDM changed in those ways, but then get called "brainless" when I don't want them that way.)

Who? What? Where? When? You're arguing against points that people who don't exist never made.

- Had to cut the rest of your post for character limit -

How about we design the combat system for people who enjoy and engage with the combat system and design other aspects for the people who enjoy those instead? Trying to dumb down the combat system to the point that people who have no interest in engaging with it can play their jobs well is how you design a boring game.

Trying to counteract boring job design by putting all of your eggs in the fight design basket doesn't work either because:

a) Now the fights have incredibly limited replay value because they're near identical if you change job or role.
b) Every fight is just stack/spread, in/out, limit cut and curtain call anyway. We need (and aren't getting) more unique mechanics for this to even be worth thinking about.

You simply can't design a feature to cater to everyone without making so many compromises that it doesn't actually appeal to anyone.

If someone doesn't enjoy battle content and doesn't want to learn how to play their job well, that's fine. Casual content in XIV is easy enough that it doesn't matter anyway. Just make the jobs more interesting, let the people who enjoy battle content enjoy them and the people who are bad now will still be bad and that's fine.

[Canadane]

I'm tired of people asking for less buttons to press.
I want more buttons to press.
Load me up on maximum hotbars, SE.

[BigCheez]

They certainly exist (not in this topic per say), and they're just some examples of how some people want jobs to go in one direction but only if its to their personal preference regarding rotation demand (in this case more of it). It's also why I'm not any more inclined to agree with those wanting harder jobs as I do wanting simpler ones, because while I don't like being left bored (as VPR and PCT did) I don't like getting "skilled out" even more than I already am. I only really play 7 jobs as-is because I don't like jumping through the flaming hoops of the rest because it's not satisfying even when I do it correctly.

Though it's all a moot point anyway, since apparently job changes have been done with the mobile version in mind this whole time, so auto-combos are more a matter of "when" not "if", or how my beloved NIN is probably going to lose its Mudras/prep work any patch now because for some reason the PC version has to accommodate for the mobile version and hitting your jutsu correctly sounds like it would be agony on a touchscreen.

Hell, that might be part of why NIN wasn't included for its initial release, because they haven't figured out how to properly gut it first.

I think you've misread the statement that Yoshi-P made about the mobile version of XIV. He said that the game had to be simplified as part of the process of translating it to a mobile game so that things could be done more quickly and casually. He did not say that the design of actual FFXIV was informed by the decision to make a mobile game.

They're completely separate games developed by completely separate companies in completely separate countries. CBU3 have nothing to do with the mobile version of FFXIV. It's being developed by the Tencent studio who made the mobile version of PUBG. It's literally just a cash grab with the FFXIV brand name slapped on it.

[BabyYoda]

I have an unpopular opinion.. but hear me out,

1- 123 should be removed for all jobs and make it like auto attack.
2- by reducing number of filler buttons now jobs can have room for other skills that could be unique.
3- remove filler combo will give room for players to focus on actual fight instead of focusing on 123.

This is my opinion

[Enjuden]

If you want to remove 123, just get the mod and figure out yourself why it's bad. It's a 'convenience' that is sweet poison since you would be an idiot to not have it. 'Just make it an option' is a bad faith argument and you know damn well that having it as an option is entirely useless when it will either be entirely useless due to it not being 'optimal', or it will be optimal then the option is redundant anyway.

Look at DRG and how that is met with immediate backlash, but the players say 'Hurr it's still not good enough'.

Well play a different job then. There's 21 of them. If you can't find one, how about not playing the game in the first place until something comes out that you can be happy with?

Removing 123 won't make you better or somehow make you able to concentrate on the fight, because you are incapable of doing it in the first place. You and the Timmy's have other things going on or have other crap playing in your browser and go 'Wow, I couldn't see it' when it's literally plastered on the screen for six seconds. Even if you could concentrate on the fight, they'll still find a way to screw up. Why? Because they didn't bother to actually put in the work to learn. You have literally hundreds of hours to figure it out, and the people wanting it easier still can't do basic rotation.

Maybe stop pretending you are good and actually try to be good at rotation before wanting changes. That is what people should be doing.

[Basteala]

I've seen a lot of people complain about adding that, saying it would make the game too easy and simplify gameplay, yadda yadda.
So there's been push back from players who can't accept that basic 123 combos aren't hard.

I rest my case lmao

To play devil's advocate, the only thing melee has to worry about now *is* button bloat. Although if they removed button bloat and made positionals actually relevant I would be really happy.

RDM really needs that melee combo put together though. It's by far one of the most annoying things about setting up its bars. Especially since it kinda already has it with the Resolution combo. It's inconsistent.

[Valence]

If you want to remove 123, just get the mod and figure out yourself why it's bad. It's a 'convenience' that is sweet poison since you would be an idiot to not have it. 'Just make it an option' is a bad faith argument and you know damn well that having it as an option is entirely useless when it will either be entirely useless due to it not being 'optimal', or it will be optimal then the option is redundant anyway.

Look at DRG and how that is met with immediate backlash, but the players say 'Hurr it's still not good enough'.

Well play a different job then. There's 21 of them. If you can't find one, how about not playing the game in the first place until something comes out that you can be happy with?

Removing 123 won't make you better or somehow make you able to concentrate on the fight, because you are incapable of doing it in the first place. You and the Timmy's have other things going on or have other crap playing in your browser and go 'Wow, I couldn't see it' when it's literally plastered on the screen for six seconds. Even if you could concentrate on the fight, they'll still find a way to screw up. Why? Because they didn't bother to actually put in the work to learn. You have literally hundreds of hours to figure it out, and the people wanting it easier still can't do basic rotation.

Maybe stop pretending you are good and actually try to be good at rotation before wanting changes. That is what people should be doing.

Imagine thinking that aligning 3 glowy buttons in the correct order when they light up is being good at a rotation..

[undull1]

If you want to remove 123, just get the mod and figure out yourself why it's bad. It's a 'convenience' that is sweet poison since you would be an idiot to not have it. 'Just make it an option' is a bad faith argument and you know damn well that having it as an option is entirely useless when it will either be entirely useless due to it not being 'optimal', or it will be optimal then the option is redundant anyway.

Look at DRG and how that is met with immediate backlash, but the players say 'Hurr it's still not good enough'.

Well play a different job then. There's 21 of them. If you can't find one, how about not playing the game in the first place until something comes out that you can be happy with?

Removing 123 won't make you better or somehow make you able to concentrate on the fight, because you are incapable of doing it in the first place. You and the Timmy's have other things going on or have other crap playing in your browser and go 'Wow, I couldn't see it' when it's literally plastered on the screen for six seconds. Even if you could concentrate on the fight, they'll still find a way to screw up. Why? Because they didn't bother to actually put in the work to learn. You have literally hundreds of hours to figure it out, and the people wanting it easier still can't do basic rotation.

Maybe stop pretending you are good and actually try to be good at rotation before wanting changes. That is what people should be doing.

So convenience is a bad evil thing that should be punished? Am I a lesser player for using a more comfortable PS5 controller instead of a Wii remote? Are you really genuinely against OPTIONAL QOL CHANGES?

I find controllers more comfortable, controllers cannot easily fit all buttons on so you have to use toggles to swap between different sets of buttons.
Having condensed combos means more free space to help create a more comfortable cross-hotbar. The action condensing so far for me has only been a positive and is also ABSOLUTELY OPTIONAL.

Condensed combos also seem to be the perfect everybody wins fix to the current button bloat issue where job design is stagnating from Devs unwilling to add more buttons onto most jobs incase it bloats controller players hotbars.

[TomsYoungerBro]

Condensed combos also seem to be the perfect everybody wins fix to the current button bloat issue where job design is stagnating from Devs unwilling to add more buttons onto most jobs incase it bloats controller players hotbars.

When has square enix ever added complexity or improved job design after removing buttons?

[BigCheez]

Imagine thinking that aligning 3 glowy buttons in the correct order when they light up is being good at a rotation..

I'd recommend reading any one of the 500 posts that have already addressed this point.