Allagans in Tural?

[No_Nick_Needed]

For the first time in a while, I replayed Syrcus Tower and was rather surprised to notice that in the mob before Amon, the dragon is accompanied by several Mamool Ja.

Considering how they fought Meracydia (and how they had spaceships) it's clear that Tural was definitely in range for them, but do we know if they ever went there? The Mamool Ja could have wandered over the Salt like their mercenaries do in the current astral era, so them being in the Crystal Tower in and off itself proofes nothing.

Did anyone come across any information about Allag in Tural?

[Anonymoose]

There are a few hints here and there that we might eventually stumble over something of Allag in the New World...but nothing too substantial just yet.

Off the top of my head the most explicit thing I remember is that in the weapons section of the Encyclopaedia Eorzea II, it explicitly says that Allag "conquered most of the Three Great Continents as well as portions of the New World".

As you suggested, it'd be weirder if they had never set foot there at all, so I imagine there are a few hooks to hang things on later if needed.

[MikkoAkure]

I was under the impression that the Mamool Ja-looking mobs in the Crystal Tower were more of an analogue to the "Thor" and "Haokah" palette-swapped monsters that were present in and around the Crystal Tower in FFIII rather than a representation of actual Mamool Ja.

But I guess anything is possible.

[No_Nick_Needed]

They are called Haokah, so that's a likely possibility, but it would be far from the first time, that things were adapted into being something other than what they originally were meant to be and fit pretty seamlessly into the story, as if they were always meant to be the new thing. Just look at what they did with Answers in Endwalker. ^^

[Rosenstrauch]

As a neat bit of trivia and happy coincidences, the name Haokah is derived from "Heyoka": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heyoka. Though from a culture significantly further north than the Mamool Ja, it's possible the FF14 Haokah are their distant ancestors. The "Thor" enemies in the World of Darkness... possibly less so. They're the only yellow Mamool Ja we ever see—voidsent-possessed, perhaps? Or a Thirteenth equivalent, maybe?

[Cleretic]

I was under the impression that the Mamool Ja-looking mobs in the Crystal Tower were more of an analogue to the "Thor" and "Haokah" palette-swapped monsters that were present in and around the Crystal Tower in FFIII rather than a representation of actual Mamool Ja.

But I guess anything is possible.

Yeah, a very quiet joke in Syrcus Tower that's almost completely lost on the international audience is that every single trash spawn is directly pulled from an FFIII random encounter formation. I believe specifically the NES and Pixel Remaster version of III, too, the 3D version had smaller encounters.

Personally I kinda hope we don't see Allagans in Tural, because I think Dawntrail works well with a certain clarity of history; that because the only external presences in Tural are very specific and very quantifiable--basically Ketenramm, Koana's imports, and Alexandria--it's a very contained setting where there's not really extra factors muddying things; it's as clean a break from the existing stories of FFXIV as you can reasonably get without going too weird. And in this particular case, Allag not being around mostly helps Alexandria's story; not only does the distance help make it clear that Alexandria's entirely their own thing (which they need the help with, because some of their tech looks fairly Allagan), but them being the only source of supertech in the continent helps them stand as a presence; they wouldn't feel as unique and scary if there was Allagan stuff lying around.

[Iscah]

While I would lean towards the Haokahs in Syrcus Tower just being repurposed models with no deeper purpose, the thought struck me today that:

1. Mamool Ja are somewhat like dinosaurs

2. Birds are naturally modified dinosaurs

3. The Allagans created bird-like Iksalions, presumably by modifying something that already existed...

[WhiteArchmage]

I'd also like to point out that Noah in the post-floor 30 Eureka Orthos cutscene mentions that it was not the only such Allagan facility, which while out-of-universe is an open excuse to have another Deep Dungeon, it does open the possibility of one such facility being somewhere in Tural. Especially since the previously cited part of EE2 mentions they did conquer "portions" of it.

I've said it before (and I'll keep saying it), that I long for the day we're done with Allag, but the team has been very poignant about keeping that door open should they wish to use them again.

[Cleretic]

I've said it before (and I'll keep saying it), that I long for the day we're done with Allag, but the team has been very poignant about keeping that door open should they wish to use them again.

An interesting element of Allag compared to other dead civilizations is that they don't necessarily have a story they're chained to. Amaurot, Mhach, Nym, theoretically Amdapor if they ever get anything, they're all inextricably linked to a singular story, one event and its surroundings. Allag, surprisingly, isn't; it's more a setting than a story. That means I've got the capacity to be more excited about them than I am about any other dead civilizations they've overused (which is basically just Amaurot; all the rest I'm interested in).

That still means there's places where it's not welcome. And that if we see another Allagan ruin it probably shouldn't be 'secret Crimes Against Nature research facility' again.

[Iscah]

That still means there's places where it's not welcome. And that if we see another Allagan ruin it probably shouldn't be 'secret Crimes Against Nature research facility' again.

Unfortunately Allag gets treated like that is its story – the whole thousand years of its history revolving around being an evil empire from start to finish.