Order of the Blue Garter: Open Recruitment Season

[Ikkenoe]

I quit a while ago, but have recently been trying to keep up with Square's efforts to rejuvenate the game. Even I've heard of a windower app with several plugins for the XIV client. Those are third party tools. Log/data parsers are third party tools. Recording software like fraps is a third party tool. One could even argue something like Photoshop is a third party tool.

A question is evidence of nothing. It does not even signify intent. For all you know, it could be weeding out applicants who assume it is referring to bots or hacks and have no problem employing them. You're taking what you see and inventing your own context, based on your own assumptions.

One can argue that it would be natural for some people to arrive at those assumptions, and that much is true. But again- this proves nothing. And why should they answer to your unsubstantiated accusations when it clearly will do nothing to change your mind?

As for the XI version of the LS hacking, do you have evidence of that? Whether it was considered to be widely accepted public knowledge or not, that isn't proof. And if you do have proof of the XI linkshell hacking, how does this automatically implicate the XIV linkshell? Whether there is any association or not, it's a stretch. A particular incarnation of the Patriots football franchise cheated. Does this mean all Patriots teams from now until the end of time are cheaters- especially without proof?

Whether you draw the association or not, whether you have difficulty shaking that association or not- it is fallacious. To take it one step further and post it publicly, attempting to posit that it is fact- slanderous.

[Delsus]

I quit a while ago, but have recently been trying to keep up with Square's efforts to rejuvenate the game. Even I've heard of a windower app with several plugins for the XIV client. Those are third party tools. Log/data parsers are third party tools. Recording software like fraps is a third party tool. One could even argue something like Photoshop is a third party tool.

A question is evidence of nothing. It does not even signify intent. For all you know, it could be weeding out applicants who assume it is referring to bots or hacks and have no problem employing them. You're taking what you see and inventing your own context, based on your own assumptions.

One can argue that it would be natural for some people to arrive at those assumptions, and that much is true. But again- this proves nothing. And why should they answer to your unsubstantiated accusations when it clearly will do nothing to change your mind?

As for the XI version of the LS hacking, do you have evidence of that? Whether it was considered to be widely accepted public knowledge or not, that isn't proof. And if you do have proof of the XI linkshell hacking, how does this automatically implicate the XIV linkshell? Whether there is any association or not, it's a stretch. A particular incarnation of the Patriots football franchise cheated. Does this mean all Patriots teams from now until the end of time are cheaters- especially without proof?

Whether you draw the association or not, whether you have difficulty shaking that association or not- it is fallacious. To take it one step further and post it publicly, attempting to posit that it is fact- slanderous.

I have already said that the term 3rd party tools is very wide, and yes it could just mean fraps, and a parser, Windower with plugins is a hack, it alters game balance, whether it shows the distance from a target, it means people using it know for example when they are in combo distance of a mob, this few seconds to reposition and get tp will lower dps and it could cause a wipe. It shows you instantly when you are out of range of AoEs but still in healing, AA, combo range etc where as people not using it may have to reposition, and ultimately get killed.

When I see this kind of question in an application it instantly brings memories of FFXI linkshells that do bot and have this question.

Also the FFXI BG site publicly posted hacks for everyone to use, these had to have been used and tested who would test them, perhaps BG themselves, they have a reputation, which through the FFXI players they brought to FFXIV, the only way to get rid of this reputation is to rename the LS. If someone comes in here and proves BG do not bot/hack and never will I will I will take back these allegations, but silence is just proving their guilt because these allegations can tarnish their LS, its within their interests to prover their innocence.

[Jennestia]

Yes a lot of stigma comes from the simple fact if you hop over the BG forums FFXI section, you see open discussion and support for Clipper and Plugins that give you an advantage in end-game -- while someone said "we have to use windower for basic ffxi features" I don't remember ever playing an MMO that allowed me to run through walls and use a 'fill mode' type system as a standard or even accepted additional feature unless it was a bug.

We're not talking about Drawdistance or Tparty, so I guess the line between "shady 3rd party" and "standard 3rd party" has been heavily blurred in recent years. Given the benefit of the doubt, Windows itself would be considered 3rd party program -- that's why it carries a certain weight when you ask a question like that.

[Churchill]

http://www.bluegartr.com/ has never hosted hacks for FFXI, lol.

[Jennestia]

http://www.bluegartr.com/ has never hosted hacks for FFXI, lol.

http://www.bluegartr.com/forums/53-F...e-New-Standard

Openly talks about using them however.

[Churchill]

http://www.bluegartr.com/forums/53-F...e-New-Standard

Openly talks about using them however.

So?

10chars

[Chardrizard]

So?

10chars

Spellcast triplecate your salvage drops.

[AsterBarnivere]

http://www.bluegartr.com/forums/53-F...e-New-Standard

Openly talks about using them however.

http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/110...July-28-2012)?

forgot that too..

and these:
http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/111....9.2-Released?

http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/109...resources-XML?

[Twentytwo]

We do not use or encourage bot use, the bot craze in 11 happened -after- we moved to WoW. The question on the app is referring to parsers/fraps/xsplit etc. Discussion over.

We also do not run, or have anything to do w/ any 11 bot discussion that may or may not happen on bluegartr.com We have been separated from them as a guild for years now and use our own site.