Out of touch? PLL

[Azurarok]

As far as I've checked the forum, nothing really. Think the only part that got any real buzz was the FFXI AR thread in more or less the same way the english thread did. I think they were expecting the usual PR given it was at TGS and knew it wasn't going to go over adjustments or system-level updates, which he did clarify will be in the next one.

[Supersnow845]

We had content that had the same popularity as the normal raid series and dumped it for content that so completely automates itself it’s arguable if it’s even content

[bp_isa_ff]

x.1s rarely have low-end content, right? Unreal trials and (maybe) Chaotic alliance raids serve as introductory high-end content. Even non-raiders gave Criterion a shot, I anticipate they'll give Chaotic a shot too, and if it's balanced well then those players will stay. If not, unsub until Shade's Triangle.

[Supersnow845]

It’s not condescending to tell people to use the system that’s there and that’s designed around compensating for solo play in a group situation

If you are on healer use aetherweaver as you can already sustain yourself, if you are struggling with incoming damage then use platebearer to psuedotank

If you are on tank you are already probably set with your sustain but if you aren’t feeling confident you can use bloodsucker for the extra sustain, if your inbuilt sustain is enough use maritalist

For DPS use bloodsucker

That’s an absolute barebones approach to sustaining solo fates, reraise is a good safety net, a lot of fates can be reflected and there is many combos you can built off of that

All the info on essences is out there and people will help you if you ask

[Banriikku]

Is Bozja or Eureka good because of participation? No. Amount of players in content does not equal fun or quality nor if the players want said content. Here is the context of the numbers missing. Also quality does not equal fun. It is often quality content (high production value, good writing, fun mechnic, etc.) that is fun but this does not mean that those things are a necessity to make a game or part of it fun. These numbers are useless because we dont have any idea what measurments, source or even method and so forth is used. Numbers without context are only used to gaslight or even outright lie to people. Example: We have now 10 % green energy.... in a closed environment and not the normal grid, only usable to certain people, not compared to the whole country because that would be less then 1%, not explained why this energy is even green - and with context this number is not so good anymore.

My point is Eureka/Bozja and even Island Sanctuary had rewards only obtainable through said content. So i say Eureka/Bozja was not loved or popular in regards of "we want that mechanic or playstyle" but "yeah FINALLY REWARDS!!!". That's where the problem lies: SE is very, very, very bad at giving rewards and how to structure them. Bozja wothout the relic and with a simple glow weapon on EX level and this content would be DEAD. And that for a good reason or reasons for that all matters. Eureka and Bozja have accessibility problems and difficulty spikes and last but not least a punishment mechanic that is there for the sake of it. There is no "risk and reward" there is simply do not die or get kupo-ed. Thats it. And that is bad game design. Next is repetition because certain things are only obtainable through 1 activity. Then we have obscure conditions for rewards/events without proper rewards. All these things as singular problems are not that big but together we have a very bad situation.

Is Eureka/Bozja a good idea ? Yes, but horrible executed.
SE has no clue about rewards or the structure of it.
Also gating a famous and unique item type behind it and saying "oh look soo many players" is intellectually dishonest and simply untrue.
The only reason we have so high numbers for Eureka and Bozja is this weapon. Take it off and many would not even touch that with a damn pole.
It could be good but SE does nothing with feedback. Same goes for Island Sanctuary - could be good but SE does not care.
At the moment i have the feeling we are at "Mama knows best"-phase and at least they hear our feedback but decide it is not good but we are closing in to Bethesda level of "gamers are dumb, ignore them".

[Supersnow845]

snip

By your logic literally nothing is good

The MSQ sucks I did it to get to endgame

Hildi sucks I did it to get the relic

Savage sucks I did it for gear

Ultimate sucks I did it for the weapon

Maps suck I did it for glam

Roulettes suck I did it for tomes

Fates suck i did it for mounts

In your opinion the structure of the content sucks, that’s not a universal opinion. Saying it was done for its rewards is a pointless statement because you can say that about anything

[Fatch38]

Saying it was done for its rewards is a pointless statement because you can say that about anything

how dare ppl seek for progress in a MMORPG. stop being hypocrite, you know she's telling a truth : when rewards sucks content dies almost instantly, look at criterion for example.

[Supersnow845]

how dare ppl seek for progress in a MMORPG. stop being hypocrite, you know she's telling a truth : when rewards sucks content dies almost instantly, look at criterion for example.

No she specifically said that field content is designed like trash and is saved by its rewards while otherwise nobody would touch it and acting like that’s just an accepted fact everyone agrees with which is why they constantly tie the relic to the field content.

The idea that field content only survives due to the relic because the content is inherently flawed makes no sense as an argument. How many people would do the MSQ if it was a giant side quest? How many people would do savage if it rewarded near nothing, we can’t know this so applying this as a flaw specifically to field content is just a nothing argument

@Supersnow845 How did you come to this conclusion? Weird....

SE uses the metric "oh look many players" to say good content but its untrue if you look up what that content contains and how you can get those rewards and how those rewards are viewed. Thats what i said AND EVEN gave a example why context of numbers is so important.
Most of the things you listed have their own problems but mostly through content that is used but not the concept itself. So no "i DID NOT SAY its bad buhu" what is said was "numbers without context are useless and Eureka and Bozja are played because of the weapon and not because that piece of content was loved, popular or of a certain quality".
Please dear lord, dont say, Eureka was good ? This piece of content has so many problems that it would take HOURs to count all of them. I had fun there too but was it good in terms of quality or mechanical fun ? NO. I still had fun but my friends and i created that fun SE did many things to kill said fun but we were stubborn and had fun regardless. Quality does not equal fun. Means it can be bad, really bad but you still have fun. It should be clear now, SE created content with an good idea and bad execution that needed and stilll needs better balancing, rewards and better mechanics. The engagement of the players came from is still comming from the relict and other players.

That’s just posting your personal opinion as hard design fact. You have zero idea if people actually by and large liked or disliked the content, in the absence of that retention metrics are the best gauge we have

I personally enjoyed eureka, it’s my favourite content in the game, I like it. I like the rewards and I like the way it’s balanced, presenting opinion as hard fact adds nothing

[Banriikku]

@Supersnow845 How did you come to this conclusion? Weird....

SE uses the metric "oh look many players" to say good content but its untrue if you look up what that content contains and how you can get those rewards and how those rewards are viewed. Thats what i said AND EVEN gave a example why context of numbers is so important.
Most of the things you listed have their own problems but mostly through content that is used but not the concept itself. So no "i DID NOT SAY its bad buhu" what is said was "numbers without context are useless and Eureka and Bozja are played because of the weapon and not because that piece of content was loved, popular or of a certain quality".
Please dear lord, dont say, Eureka was good ? This piece of content has so many problems that it would take HOURs to count all of them. I had fun there too but was it good in terms of quality or mechanical fun ? NO. I still had fun but my friends and i created that fun SE did many things to kill said fun but we were stubborn and had fun regardless. Quality does not equal fun. Means it can be bad, really bad but you still have fun. It should be clear now, SE created content with an good idea and bad execution that needed and stilll needs better balancing, rewards and better mechanics. The engagement of the players came from is still comming from the relict and other players.

[CuteBucket]

Is Bozja or Eureka good because of participation? No. Amount of players in content does not equal fun or quality nor if the players want said content.

Gonna stop you right there. What are you talking about? Why would people make themselves miserable participating for hours and hours in content they don't enjoy for a purely optional relic weapon that isn't even BiS until the very end, and which gets immediately outgeared? When I first started Bozja, I was still pretty new to the game and didn't even know relic weapons were part of it, I just enjoyed hopping in with my friends and playing it because I found it fun.

When content sucks and isn't fun, you know what I do?

I don't play it. I'll try it to see how I feel, but I won't keep playing if I don't like it.

Surely that is not some strange, anomalous reaction on my part?

I don't enjoy crafting, so I never did much in the Firmament/Diadem/Ishgard restoration stuff. I tried it and decided I didn't like it, and that was that. I don't particularly enjoy Triple Triad so I don't go out of my way to collect the cards. I have no interest in catching rare fish, or fishing in general, so I don't do it. I eventually level all the jobs over time to give them all a try, but there are some jobs I don't enjoy playing and never bring into endgame content. I found the first Criterion dungeon annoying and not fun, so I don't play them. I will do deep dungeons on occasion if the mood strikes me, but I tend to get frustrated with them easily and then don't touch them for months. Lately I don't much feel like doing my daily roulettes unless a friend wants company, so when I'm alone, I don't bother. Why would I make myself miserable in this game doing content I don't at least somewhat enjoy?

So yeah, I do think amount of players doing content can at least give some idea of how fun and enjoyable the content is. It's not a perfect 1:1 ratio, but it's a metric worth looking at.