Fixing Mch

[Jeeqbit]

the class is in a bad spot for what it's suppose to be

It's perfect in my opinion. It feels like a gun job that blasts gunshots. One of my favorite jobs really.

1-2-3 Combo: There's currently nothing fundamentally wrong with the 1-2-3 Combo, but it's pretty generic at this point.

Gives time to weave stuff and focus on mechanics though. I think it's good.

I think it would be interesting to pull it back to actually work with the heat system

The combo adds heat, and therefore interacts with the heat system.

If you mean how it used to work, the combo had boring animations compared to Bard until you got enough heat. That's why they made those animations permanent in the first place.

I would be much more interested in them reintroducing the bullet system.

I agree that was an interesting and logical way to try and make a gun job. Where you recharge your ammo. It just was kinda flat and boring compared to what Bard was doing, so they had to make it more exciting - which is why we got a job that uses machines of various types.

Maybe instead of making it a random chance, make the bullet buff the next shot in the combo.

Definitely think the random chance wouldn't work. It felt like "missed attacks" that we got due to lack of accuracy and still get due to level difference. It feels awful when your combo breaks due to this. Again, this fell flat when compared to Bard, so everyone just played Bard instead after its Stormblood revamp.

Wildfire: This should deal a % damage of the total amount of damage dealt by the MCH within the Wildfire window. Not just Weaponskills, and not based off the number of Weaponskills performed in the window.

That's how it used to be mostly but you know, the game has changed. To account for ping, they now use stacks, so there is a fixed number to make it fair for all.

Dismantle: This should be the debuff applied by the turrets to increase party damage. Personally I think it should increase party damage, and lower targets damage, but I don't know if that's just being unreasonable or not.

This was actually added back to the game because extra damage reduction or utility was needed for some reason or another to make MCH able to compete.

Flamethrower: This needs a complete overhaul. It's current state is because of how heat build up originally worked, but that's changed and the heat build up has been removed, so now it's a useless skill.

It works as an AoE. It ticks every second instead of every 3 seconds like everything else.

[Valence]

You had me at the ammo system being brought back to the fold. The filler of this job is utterly boring compared to how engaging it used to be with ammo and this also played into making the job engaging even during fillers outside of bursts, which a lot of jobs in the current job design fundamentally lack, turning them into resident sleeper rotations once the burst is done. Juggling with procs and triaging them was what made those fillers interesting in the case of MCH. And the job actually used to burst every minute on top of it. It's somewhat ironic that it currently has higher APM than it used to have but with twice less burst sequences.

Hypercharge is just mindless spamm. The only thing I appreciate with hypercharge is that I can decide when I want to use it, and them adding charges to Drill was the biggest change of this expansion in my opinion since it stops constraining where to use hypercharge so much.

The job lost its fundamental core identity that was the highest burst dps job in the game period when it got reworked. This was tied to WF compiling the whole damage done and it felt absolutely great when you got it right. It felt also great chasing after big numbers and constantly striving to achieve the biggest Wildfires possible. This has been axed from the job entirely. Now that we have stacks on hypercharge to alleviate ping problems I think it should be considered to bring it back somewhat.

The current Heat system is a boring, bland resource gauge no different from the others, when it used to be unique and involve very specific, flavorful mechanics proper to the job (barrel lockout, underheat, heat, and overheat), that not only interacted with the base combo, but also with other tools that actually reduced heat like reloads and cooldown (heat blast).

Current battery is excruciatingly boring and unsatisfying since it just fills up when using clean shot and some tools, and you just press it for bursts like an afterthought. Paradoxically, it currently proves a little more involved since the battery plans have become as lopsided as the heat plans and you generate more than 200 battery every 2min in DT now, which requires to use Queen twice in the filler at specific amounts/timings, all of them different per minute which means memorizing long tedious spreadsheets much like for when to hold heat or not before each burst. This needs to go honestly.

Bringing back the bishop turret found in its current pvp form would be a boon for the job and would not only refit it closer to the ranged physical stated purpose of "buffing support job" as described on the XIV job guide page, but also bring unique pulsing barriers to toy with for support tools.

Flamethrower is the elephant in the room and it's incredible that it's not been reviewed since ShB: it's barely competitive with the other AoE tools mathematically and only if you're not able to spend heat before the end (which, funnily enough in dungeons, the end is not the end of a pull, but the end of the dungeon...). It's quite obvious the devs have no idea what to do with it beyond a glorified emote, and it's a shame because the tool was actually a cornerstone of the job in SB (clunk or no clunk). In fact, in AoE it was used similarly to how Apokalypsis is used on BLU currently by snapshotting it at the end of the overheat window for a crazy amount of sustained damage. Compared to what we have now, it's incredibly depressing how much the job has lost with all those cuts. There has been many ideas advanced by people to fix FT, like for example detonating the bioblaster dot, or just generating heat gauge (tied to the amount of enemies hit), or actually consuming heat gauge for a big potency effect, or as a direct, more potent competitor to ACB but with mobility and range constraints. Possibilities are legion.

AoE overall is in an incomplete, weird state. Battery is still completely useless in this scenario and I actually expected Crown Collider when introduced in EW to address the issue, but apparently not, it was made single target. Not only that, but the introduction of Chainsaw actually generates battery and IS an AoE tool, battery that you can't really use for AoE beyond hitting a single target of the pack for little value, which feels frankly ass. Autocrossbow still doesn't recharge Double Check and Checkmate, which with the added potencies introduced for DT on Blazing Shot and those, makes the use of ACB incredibly less valuable comparatively and pushes it further down the line to 5+ targets now (equal at 4). The 2nd charge added to Bioblaster due to Drill changes feels underwhelming even if it does something.

Or perhaps pvp bishop could be summoned with a set amount of battery as well, used in AoE, but also for single target to trigger raid buffs (as old hypercharge did on the targets).

[elioaiko]

MCH is in a terrible position bc I feel like the devs look at phys ranged as a whole and say "ehh they have free movement and it's easier to play, so we can worry about that later".

I only play MCH in ST fights. It feels SO bad to use in AoE content. The rotation for AoE is awkward and unsatisfying.

Flamethrower is basically an emote and that fixes you in place. Why not just give us the option to place a flamethrowing turret down instead?

Auto Crossbow doesn't recharge the oGCDs which is weird in itself.

I honestly want them to make Wildfire be able to crit (no not auto crit) or just scrap it altogether.

I honestly think that the job gimmick should be piloting a mech to do enhanced abilities. Outside of the burst, you set up with machinery to power said burst.

It's stuck inbetween wanting to be a gunslinger and an engineer.

[Alchemii]

MCH is in a terrible position bc I feel like the devs look at phys ranged as a whole and say "ehh they have free movement and it's easier to play, so we can worry about that later".

I only play MCH in ST fights. It feels SO bad to use in AoE content. The rotation for AoE is awkward and unsatisfying.

Flamethrower is basically an emote and that fixes you in place. Why not just give us the option to place a flamethrowing turret down instead?

Auto Crossbow doesn't recharge the oGCDs which is weird in itself.

I honestly want them to make Wildfire be able to crit (no not auto crit) or just scrap it altogether.

I honestly think that the job gimmick should be piloting a mech to do enhanced abilities. Outside of the burst, you set up with machinery to power said burst.

It's stuck inbetween wanting to be a gunslinger and an engineer.

I don't think Mch being a Gunslinging Engineer is a bad thing. It's a pretty solid techno fantasy archetype, which is the place the genre that FFXIV falls into. Even during 1.0, that's to Garlemald being Garlemald, it's been a Techno Fantasy, and Mch leans more into the Tech than the Fantasy side of it. So using Gadgets and Guns kinda feels right for it. Even in the quests for the class we're advancing technology for defensive and offensive measures, mostly offensive.

That being said I do think we need more proper Tech based jobs. Right now we have Mch, and on a technicality Sge and Gnb. However, Sge is more fine tuned magic tools, and Gnb does really keep the TECH feel. So getting a proper tech job would probably help. I could see a Mech focused job as more of a Tank thing.

[Daralii]

MCH is in a terrible position bc I feel like the devs look at phys ranged as a whole and say "ehh they have free movement and it's easier to play, so we can worry about that later".

I only play MCH in ST fights. It feels SO bad to use in AoE content. The rotation for AoE is awkward and unsatisfying.

Flamethrower is basically an emote and that fixes you in place. Why not just give us the option to place a flamethrowing turret down instead?

Auto Crossbow doesn't recharge the oGCDs which is weird in itself.

I honestly want them to make Wildfire be able to crit (no not auto crit) or just scrap it altogether.

I honestly think that the job gimmick should be piloting a mech to do enhanced abilities. Outside of the burst, you set up with machinery to power said burst.

It's stuck inbetween wanting to be a gunslinger and an engineer.

I wish you could at least turn or move with a speed penalty(like Powerful Shot and Blast Charge in PvP) while channeling Flamethrower. The fact that any movement at all instantly cancels something on a 1-minute CD and is so awkward to use in a way that actually makes it worth using just makes me not bother with it.

[elioaiko]

So getting a proper tech job would probably help. I could see a Mech focused job as more of a Tank thing.

I think depending on the next phys ranged job, it just might be.

I do think they kind of messed up with MCH. I would have preferred a pet based type of engineer that upgrades his tools/mecha as the gimmick.

A proper gunslinger job should have been the new phys ranged job, focusing on using different guns.

Alas, another BRD/Ranger situation.

I don't mind the split between gunslinger and engineer fantasy, but I just wished they would lean more into the engineering aspect.

[Valence]

MCH used to have pets and COULD upgrade and tinker with them notably in HW with Turret Promotion (swapping damage to MP/TP party sustain) and old Hypercharge that was doubling damage or sustain depending on the turret's mode, and applying target vuln to targets (aka raid buffs). Now it's like a glorified modern summoner.

I do feel like not enough people realize how much has been lost on that job since ShB axed everything. I've raided savage with it for this tier, and I can confidently say that it still feels like a shit sandwich, and like for ShB where I dropped the job immediately after the first tier, I'm gonna do the same here. It's too bad, because I've always loved the aesthetic of the job.

[Azurarok]

from what I've heard of it, it seemed like MCH didn't have range tax before ShB and managed it by being much more complex to play? I do think it's acceptable for the job to do dps comparable to BLM/VPR/SAM if more gauge management and RNG were involved, diverting attention to your UIs more in exchange for less focus on positioning.

If the current playstyle should be kept for those who do enjoy it that should be moved to a new rphys job imo.

[Alchemii]

from what I've heard of it, it seemed like MCH didn't have range tax before ShB and managed it by being much more complex to play? I do think it's acceptable for the job to do dps comparable to BLM/VPR/SAM if more gauge management and RNG were involved, diverting attention to your UIs more in exchange for less focus on positioning.

If the current playstyle should be kept for those who do enjoy it that should be moved to a new rphys job imo.

There in lines the problem that triggered SE to change it in the first place. People that enjoyed Mch understood that and how the job played and could really get he damage out, the problem came to people that didn't understand it. A lot of them complained that the job was too "Clunky", and they couldn't figure out how to make it work. Every other job at the time had set rotations usually within a 1min window that they could line up with everyone else, but not mch. Mch you had to think about stuff like how long other classes had for their buffs to come up and weather it was worth holding a skill for it. Mch damage also confused the people that weren't well versed in MMO's at the time. Most experienced MMO players understood Mch was a burst DPS, so when they Bursted it was BIG numbers, but between bursts they did very little damage. So since many of them didn't know how to read DPS charts at the time, they thought Mch wasn't really doing that much damage, but in truth they were usually in the top 3 of overall damage.

[Valence]

from what I've heard of it, it seemed like MCH didn't have range tax before ShB and managed it by being much more complex to play? I do think it's acceptable for the job to do dps comparable to BLM/VPR/SAM if more gauge management and RNG were involved, diverting attention to your UIs more in exchange for less focus on positioning.

If the current playstyle should be kept for those who do enjoy it that should be moved to a new rphys job imo.

It had a ranged tax like Bard actually, and has had it since HW, but you could ignore it if you had a DRG that essentially gave to rphys jobs +10% damage from piercing synergy in HW, and +5% in SB, which was the way to offset or even outcome the ranged tax especially in HW where double rphys became very meta. The difference was that the party boni weren't handing 1% damage per role filled to everybody, but having a tank would give you VIT +5% (was it?), having a melee DPS STR +5%, having a rphys +5% DEX, etc, which was not doing much for parties where you had no DRG to help you.

Also yes, the rotations were infinitely more complex for Ranged Physical for sure, and there was other things to do besides it as well.