Idea for Savage Loot

[AgathaAllalong]

I have seen a lot of people who tend to drop out of Savage because the loot system is not really rewarding. You put a ton of hours in and even if you clear every fight in a lockout, there's a chance that you get nothing for all of the time you put into it that week. It's not really engaging and many players tend to lose interest unless if they're in a static. From what I understand, the current system is better than it was in the past. I don't think that's a valid argument against criticisms of how it currently works, because better than before doesn't mean it's good.

My idea is a bad luck protection system that encourages you to get as far in a tier as you can each week:

Each week that you clear your first fight, you receive a currency to spend on one guaranteed piece of loot from a vendor. The catch is that you can only spend it on something that would have dropped from the fights you have actually cleared that week.

For example, if you have cleared M2S this week, you can go to a vendor and choose one drop from M1S or M2S, but not M3S until you've cleared it for that week.

This would not only alleviate issues with players having bad luck and not getting any loot week after week of reclears, but it would also encourage players to actually finish the tier. Also it would be a nice change for people who don't just play one role or job.

[Jeeqbit]

Each week that you clear your first fight, you receive a currency to spend on one guaranteed piece of loot from a vendor. The catch is that you can only spend it on something that would have dropped from the fights you have actually cleared that week.

Well... you receive a book. If you keep at it for some weeks then you get the gear that you want.

The loot is not the intended way to actually get your gear. The books are. The loot is just a little bonus, and can help offset a few missed weeks.

Your mindset, on the other hand, is that the loot is the intended way to get the gear and that if people don't get lucky then they've "not been rewarded".

Usually in PF you will get loot pretty often honestly. I do. Most tiers I have looted a coffer for every single role of the fights that I've been doing, even for roles I don't play, because when it's 4 pieces of loot for example, it's a 50/50 chance of getting a drop per fight.

Actually, statics are worse (at least as a tank or healer). Because if you're trying to benefit the static and not just yourself, you'll usually yield the loot to the DPS first so that the boss/DPS checks can be defeated faster. After they are all geared up, the survival of the tanks is a "nice to have" so they can be lazier with mit plus they contribute the second most damage so they start getting the loot. Healers last.

Yet, if you PF the fights you can get the loot right away and are very likely to get some drops because of the 50/50 chance.

Alongside all of that, you are gearing up each week already due to the weekly tomestone gear.

If someone drops out on the basis of that, it makes me wonder if they really want to do the raids anyway? There are a lot of people these days doing older raids for fun because that is the type of content they enjoy just for the sake of enjoying it.

[CaedemSanguis]

1 book for access
2 book for left side
4 book for weap

900 tomes/week

ggwp

[Colt47]

The one constant truth that seems to have existed since WoW, is that end game in MMOs is completely broken. Like in FFXIV why do we even have gear advancement at end game to begin with? The entirety of the outdoor zones plus instanced areas are balanced around the initial end game iLvL, but then we get super shiny new gear at the first raid tier that is heads over heals better then the initial iLvL gear. And then at the .2 patch we get another brand new set of shiny gear that outpaces the old gear!

... but all the overworld zones are still set and balanced to a baseline that exists at the point the expansion releases. The only content that even demands the newer gear is content that is released in its own microcosm alongside the gear, so gradually everything else gets trivialized and people start getting sloppy because why try to do good dps and dodge things, when the character is a literal super tank or is able to kill things so fast they barely take damage? Yet at the same time, they have to add something to go after or everyone just quits and goes off to play other games until the next expansion comes out.

I was thinking about Skyrim like enemy scaling on this but then there is this weird problem. So lets say Little Jimmy just hit end game and has his relic gear, and enemies all scale to the highest iLvL of the person they are grouped with. Bob "I died a lot so you don't have to" high tier raider comes along in his end game super gear and the two group up to do content while little Jimmy is fighting some angry squirrels. After accepting the invite from his friend, the little angry squirrels drink monster power aid and little Jimmy is now fleeing from Squirrel Thor: Slaughterer of all noobs whose stats have been upscaled for Bob the high tier raider.

[FistoSupreme]

Well... you receive a book. If you keep at it for some weeks then you get the gear that you want.

The loot is not the intended way to actually get your gear. The books are. The loot is just a little bonus, and can help offset a few missed weeks.

Your mindset, on the other hand, is that the loot is the intended way to get the gear and that if people don't get lucky then they've "not been rewarded".

Usually in PF you will get loot pretty often honestly. I do. Most tiers I have looted a coffer for every single role of the fights that I've been doing, even for roles I don't play, because when it's 4 pieces of loot for example, it's a 50/50 chance of getting a drop per fight.

Actually, statics are worse (at least as a tank or healer). Because if you're trying to benefit the static and not just yourself, you'll usually yield the loot to the DPS first so that the boss/DPS checks can be defeated faster. After they are all geared up, the survival of the tanks is a "nice to have" so they can be lazier with mit plus they contribute the second most damage so they start getting the loot. Healers last.

Yet, if you PF the fights you can get the loot right away and are very likely to get some drops because of the 50/50 chance.

Alongside all of that, you are gearing up each week already due to the weekly tomestone gear.

If someone drops out on the basis of that, it makes me wonder if they really want to do the raids anyway? There are a lot of people these days doing older raids for fun because that is the type of content they enjoy just for the sake of enjoying it.

Worst case scenario, I need 17 M2S books to get bis. 17 weeks of no reward. Also what do you mean? The loot is the intended way to actually get gear, the books are the bad luck mechanic. I like the raids, but let's be honest, when you don't get anything it's kind of demotivating to keep on doing it. At least with extremes I can keep on running it until I get a mount.

[Tunda]

I mean we reach to the point that we are searching for something to do in the game lol

[Andevom]

Worst case scenario, I need 17 M2S books to get bis. 17 weeks of no reward.

Why would you wait until you have all 17 to start trading them in?

[Colt47]

Worst case scenario, I need 17 M2S books to get bis. 17 weeks of no reward. Also what do you mean? The loot is the intended way to actually get gear, the books are the bad luck mechanic. I like the raids, but let's be honest, when you don't get anything it's kind of demotivating to keep on doing it. At least with extremes I can keep on running it until I get a mount.

I agree with you Fisto on the way the loot works. The books are more of a fallback measure and always were that way.

[FistoSupreme]

Why would you wait until you have all 17 to start trading them in?

I meant "no reward" as in not getting loot from the loot table. Turning in books, however, still requires me to clear M2S for 4 weeks to get a headpiece. A month to get gear.

[dspguy]

Loot system is fine. There is no doubt that most savage content is difficult. So, the rewards (20 ilvl above easily obtainable crafted gear, 10 ilvl above tomestone gear) are very reasonable.

The "barriers for entry" to raiding are abysmally low.

Raid whenever you want.
No dungeon crawl to get there.
No farming other enemies to get the raid boss to spawn.
No exp penalty for death.
Negligible gil penalty for death (repair costs are low, food isn't lost)
Raid boss isn't contested.
Drops to the party are guaranteed (no boss is dropping nothing at all)
Every party member gets a token to pick what they want after X weeks.

Once a team gets the mechanics down, it is common to clear all 4 tiers in under an hour. Maybe two if there are some struggles. What more do you want? Welcome to a game where there are daily and weekly limitations: 9 different daily roulettes, 12 daily beast tribe quests, weekly Wondrous Tails, weekly tomestone caps, daily hunt marks, weekly hunt marks, daily maps, etc etc.

I've raided in various games. FFXIV is probably one of the least taxing of all of them. Sure, the content is hard... but quick. You could be an expert at some raid content in other games and still get nothing for two hours of your time.