Dark Knight TBN

[WeakestZenosEnjoyer]

It actually doesn't change the total mitigation at all, because flat shields are additive. What I've done is separate the 25% HP shield into two parts that overlap between 6-10 seconds to introduce a bit of timing to the effect. I've always thought it strange that they frontloaded mitigation, where you really want it backloaded if you want to test your timing. Granted, it probably would work a bit better with a paired %DR and a flat shield so that you don't lose shield to chip autos when you precast it.

The consequence of these overly bloated tooltips is being harder to tell what's even going on, I genuinely just didn't catch that.

I'm neutral on having layered defenses to "reward timing" but I honestly think TBN should continue to refund MP for a pop (having it be immediate instead of the stupid "5 edges in burst" proc might be an improvement though, have to do something about chaining it though) and the tooltip is just too long. With the layers, actually popping it expecially in dungeon bosses and the like becomes less of a problem in the first place.

Lore reference, for those in the know:

'In your darkest hour, in the blackest night... think of me... and I will be with you. Always. For where else could I go? Who else could I love but you?' - Myste, Our Compromise, Lv. 70.

That's where the action name comes from. And now you know.

That's very cool as a quote and utterly out of place on a short CD mitigation. Would fit far better as the Shadowed Vigil excog and is a smaller tooltip where the long name is less of a problem. Is your darkest hour" really roughly every 30s?

[Lyth]

...

The tooltip complexity that you see on these defensives is probably a reflection of how buffs are coded in this game. For example, you don't see dynamically changing buff effects. It either needs to expire and get replaced by a new buff, or you create the buff in two parts each with different timers. That's why they're all listed in parts. With that in mind, I'm not even sure if 'delayed buffs' can be done directly, strictly speaking. Chances are, you'd have to create a dummy countdown buff that counts down and expires, before being replaced by a second buff that provides the mitigation.

I think timing skill checks are sorely lacking in current mitigation. I remember fights like God Kefka where you would pre-pop Rampart 18 seconds in advance of a tankbuster so that you could reduce the effective cooldown and get it back in time for a later tankbuster, or Sword Oath Sheltron timings on A3S Fluid Swings without telegraphs. Even the original IB forced you to think about how tankbuster casts aligned with your GCD. Invulns are probably a big part of the problem, but there are smaller ways that we can introduce some of that timing element back into gameplay.

At the current rate of MP generation, I think you could probably even reduce the recast on TBN. One thing that nobody really mentions is that Holy Sheltron has a 5 second recast, lets you store enough resources for two charges, and doesn't penalize you for using it. TBN isn't even the shortest recast out of all of them. If there's going to be a proc benefit from breaking, a healing effect makes the most sense. That's how Arcane Crest works, for example. Always damage neutral, you don't get penalized for using it, but if it breaks, you get an extra heal out of it.

The name doesn't really matter. I just needed a place-holder for a multi-part timed buff.

[Lyth]

That's fine. 15% shield from 0-3 seconds, 25% shield from 3-7 seconds. This is not a fast game. If you still think that's too tough, then it's a you issue.

[Terhix]

That's fine. 15% shield from 0-3 seconds, 25% shield from 3-7 seconds. This is not a fast game. If you still think that's too tough, then it's a you issue.

During prog I do not have 7 seconds of clairvoyance nor am I in hivemind with the healers to know who is going to be low HP just before a hard-hitting mechanic goes off, I look at the party frames when it's about to go off to see if someone is dangerously low on HP only then do I TBN them and hopefully save their life.

[Lyth]

Don't worry, it's still darkness-flavored. By the way, the most popular suggestion in this thread was to increase the duration to 10 seconds, which would make said risk pretty much non-existent. Even your earlier suggestion was ultimately about making the shield easier to break. Not that I ever expected any sort of consistency in that response.

[Shurrikhan]

Even your earlier suggestion was ultimately about making the shield easier to break.

No, it was about making MP more than a mere charge counter. At present, that's all it is, after all, whereby our each 200 MP generated is basically just a 3s cooldown-reduction to a 3.33-charge 45s-recharge (reduced 3s at a time) Edge/Flood/TBN CD.

Its suggested max at 33.3% target eHP is not "easier to break" than 25% target eHP.

It also pushes conflict priorities between maximizing sustain and maximizing damage, something tanks used to have, even if in far from a balanced manner, before we replaced all such considerations with "Tank Mastery".

By the way, the most popular suggestion in this thread was to increase the duration to 10 seconds, which would make said risk pretty much non-existent.

It's a first-page post that references PvP. Most viewers are not going to look beyond the first page. That's hardly an indicator that most DRKs want to remove any and all unique constraints from TBN.

[Alice_Rivers]

An idea I had last night, with all the complaints I've seen of TBN not popping, is to make it so that it explodes if it times out. Said explosion would do damage both to the DRK and to any enemies within say 8y for an amount of damage that scales with the amount of shield remaining, thereby making it always good to use but also giving elements of risk/reward and unique flavour.

[Shurrikhan]

An idea I had last night, with all the complaints I've seen of TBN not popping, is to make it so that it explodes if it times out. Said explosion would do damage both to the DRK and to any enemies within say 8y for an amount of damage that scales with the amount of shield remaining, thereby making it always good to use but also giving elements of risk/reward and unique flavour.

The problem likely there is the same as for so much else with sustain vs. damage -- for the damage to the DRK to be of any "risk", you'd have to have an rDPS cost via sustain required (through healer offensive GCDs lost), which in turn means that sustain requirements would need to always exceed "free" sustain available. Yet, the developers seem absolutely insistent on ensuring that never happens.

Otherwise, you end up with TBN just hit on CD on or from the OT position whenever 25% the target's max HP exceeds 460 potency's damage... or nothing having changed.

[Carighan]

An idea I had last night, with all the complaints I've seen of TBN not popping, is to make it so that it explodes if it times out. Said explosion would do damage both to the DRK and to any enemies within say 8y for an amount of damage that scales with the amount of shield remaining, thereby making it always good to use but also giving elements of risk/reward and unique flavour.

Oh that'd be interesting. Hrm. Especially scaled off the remaining shield value.

[Alice_Rivers]

For DRK though that risk already exists, looking at numbers for dungeons, DRK HPS is about half of damage received, DRK's self sufficiency is already the lowest of the tanks and as a healer I think that's a good thing but it's also beside the point. Unlike WAR, DRK has to be concerned about all damage received, if TBN did damage for lets say whatever the value of the shield is when it expires, that's up to 25% of it's maximum HP as a worst case scenario, if it did the same damage to everything in range then there's ironically a reward for managing your HP and mits to keep that TBN up for the full seven seconds. Obviously that would be hilariously OP, I'd probably go for about 30% and buff the MP attacks TBN gives free when it pops to do a bit more so you still get rewarded better for having TBN pop but there's also a solid reward if you're skilled enough t use TBN itself as a weapon and you have to consider the damage you take if you use it badly. It's also then something the healer has to consider and a good DRK/Healer combo can really make the best of it either way.