Viper Changes Thread - Share your thoughts

[Zakon]

I'm a bit surprised people are actually upset about the loss of this thing. Maintaining it was the most annoying part of playing the job.

Noxious Gnash seemed totally at odds with the design of Viper, which is mechanically simple, but the challenge is the high APM required to play it. You frequently have to double weave OGCDs and failure to do so results in a substantial loss of DPS as you either *lose* one of the OGCDs or drift your GCD, both of which are really bad. Not hard to do on a target dummy but challenging to do while avoiding mechanics. Especially since Viper is a selfish DPS, so any loss of DPS is a big deal as you don't bring anything else to a party.

It was just this stupid debuff you had to make sure was applied before you did anything major, like spending Rattling Coil charges or going into a Reawaken combo.

im not a big fan. from the way its just pressing 111 222 111 222 over and over again now makes it feel so much worse than the alternating buttons. the dps diff between the debuff and the potency increace does not match up so it deals less dmg now.

probably the biggest gripe i have with the job rn is the fact that the thing that made it special is now gone. it really had a uniqe feeling that i didnt get from any other dps whilst scratching the itch that tanks couldnt help with.
i really looked forward doing EXs, savages and maybe even ultimates with this job but this patch really just killed that feeling for me. such a shame, one of the REALLY few good things that came out of Dawntrail and now its gone.

Maybe look at Reaper? They don't have the extremely high APM requirement, but if monitoring and maintaining a debuff on your targets is what you desire, they have Death's Design. It's also not nearly as clunky to maintain as Noxious Gnash was.

[Erwann]

the challenge is the high APM required to play it. You frequently have to double weave OGCDs and failure to do so results in a substantial loss of DPS as you either *lose* one of the OGCDs or drift your GCD, both of which are really bad. Not hard to do on a target dummy but challenging to do while avoiding mechanics. Especially since Viper is a selfish DPS, so any loss of DPS is a big deal as you don't bring anything else to a party.

It was just this stupid debuff you had to make sure was applied before you did anything major, like spending Rattling Coil charges or going into a Reawaken combo.

This right here is the reason for the complain.
Allowing the class to require at least a bit of brainpower in decision making.

[Zakon]

This right here is the reason for the complain.
Allowing the class to require at least a bit of brainpower in decision making.

Listen, if you're a gamer who is able to play Viper optimally without ever drifting your GCD or losing boss uptime while also perfectly dodging all mechanics in savage boss encounters, and you think it needs to be even MORE challenging by adding complexity to its rotation that requires pre-planning, I really am sorry that they did this to you.

But I suspect most people who are complaining about this aren't actually able to do that.

Viper is very much like Black Mage. The challenge isn't in the rotation, it's pretty easy to do on a targeting dummy. The challenge is doing the rotation with as little loss of uptime as possible, with the understanding that you don't bring anything except damage, so you have nothing to fall back on to contribute to the group if you play sub-optimally.

[OliverQ]

Feels even more braindead than it did before. Quite literally press the shiny buttons, then Reawaken when every one uses their 2 minute buffs. It's the Summoner of melee now - absolutely zero complexity whatsoever.

[Rhael]

But I suspect most people who are complaining about this aren't actually able to do that.

They always have the option of learning how to do that. The game shouldn't be changed because people don't want to engage with it.

[Zakon]

They always have the option of learning how to do that. The game shouldn't be changed because people don't want to engage with it.

I think you misunderstood what I was saying when I said that, since I was talking about the people who are complaining about this change.

[Elkanah]

All this hype up for Viper at Fanfest-- just to nuke the job skills and job identity in lore. But the devs have a long standing history of pissing all of their lore too (considering sch), so lol.

Meteion: "And when one asked: What was the point? There were no devs left to answer."

[KazumaFaemura]

Personally I'm with the Japanese players. I'm feeling very indifferent with the change. I did some runs with my Viper after the changes and it doesn't feel like it's really changed all that much from what we had just now we have an extra shiny button at the start of our 123 combo. I didn't really find NG to be all that hard to keep up unless I screwed up and or just didn't notice it was about expire, or any other number of things. It hasn't ruined the job for me but it was definitely an unnecessary change.

[Tamatsune]

Made an account to post my dislike for the changes to Viper. The idea behind Noxious Gnash had given it that little extra bit of edge to make the class one of the few in-game to have some slight complexity to its kit like Reaper. Of course, not many people will understand it from the get-go, but I think it should be known that that's okay. Having a class that takes some time to understand makes it more rewarding to play when players put the time in. But to then take the complexity away shows an unfortunate lack of confidence in its design and subsequently its players for trying to understand their vision for it. Please revert the changes.

[Kastiyana]

I setup my forum account just to post I absolutely hate this change to Viper. It feels much less engaging and makes the rotation feel mechanical in nature. The job hasn't even been played for a full patch cycle to warrant a complete revamp of the job. Please revert the change.