[Feedback] Forcing new abilities into combos w/ utility CDs is bad and unsustainable

[NegativeS]

I understand why they are doing this--we have tons of abilities as it is, and finding room for new ones is a challenge. However, with so many jobs being full of bloat buttons as it is, I would much rather they remove old garbage or try to fit these abilities into the job's existing gameplay loop than try to fit in new abilities as 'combos' that feel awful to use.

A few examples from classes I play often, from bad to worst:

AST:

Before DT: Divination was previously a reward for completing a card sign set, then was made into a standalone buff.
After DT: Still a standalone buff, but now combos into Oracle, a damage AoE of 860 potency.

Why this feels bad: In all honesty, Oracle did not need to exist, at all, and simply feels like padding they threw in to make sure every job had a lv 92 toy to play with. While some healers are clamoring for more DPS options, one button behind a 2m cooldown is probably not what they had in mind.

Suggested solution: Divination could be kept standalone and Oracle could be its own thing used as a reward for working your cards well... ah, they removed that part of AST. Honestly, AST is a disaster right now, and the last thing they need are worthless combos. In their attempt to make the cards intuitive, they removed all semblance of complexity from them. Oracle just feels like it exists as an obligation, to say "we haven't completely snubbed AST yet! see?! see?!". Get rid of it and I doubt anyone would miss it. Make sure the job is actually fun to play before layering garbage on top of it.

GNB:

Before DT: Was a 2m CD that was only used to refill the powder gauge.
After DT: Same effect, but now combos into Reign of Beasts -> Noble Blood -> Lion Heart for a total of 3,000 potency on a single target.

Why this feels bad: Bloodfest before was an easy way to chain together a ton of powder gauge combos, which were easy enough to weave with any needed mitigation. Now you have to account for the huge nuke in the middle, while being aware not to ruin the combo by doing anything else that starts one (Brutal Shell seething rn). Additionally, this is another case of '1 button spam combo' that afflicts some jobs, which does not feel good to play.

Suggested solution: The Reign of Beasts combo could have easily just been a Continuation chain with Double Down, similarly to how Gnashing Fang works. Not only does this free up use of Bloodfest, but it also fits better into GNB's general gameplay style. Lower the potency of the chain if needed to fit into Double Down's shorter cooldown, it would still be a sizable nuke.

Additionally, GNB is not dying for bar space, especially after they crammed Sonic Break into a combo with No Mercy (also a change I dislike, but another class has the same problem but worse later in this post). Of all the classes, it is one of the least in need of consolidation.

SCH:

Before DT: A debuff on a single target that makes crits 10% more likely against them.
After DT: Same effect, but now combos into Baneful Impaction, an AoE DoT.

Why this feels bad: Of all things to stick behind a 2m CD, an AoE DoT is one of the strangest. Chain Stratagem, being single target, was generally saved for boss encounters. Now, Scholars are looking for strange ways to fit it into trash pulls to get actually decent use out of Baneful Impaction. This can cause a cooldown desync where CS isn't ready for a boss encounter, which limits its usefulness as that is generally when people are dumping their nukes.

Suggested solution: Scholars have been asking for more DPS tools for years as their healing kit is generally very solid and leaves decent downtime. Just give them Baneful Impaction like you gave Sages Eukrasian Dyskrasia.
If not by itself (because SCH is a little tight for button space), then make it a combo behind Energy Drain. If that isn't good, then pehaps get rid of worse-than-trash Fey Blessing to make room for Baneful to be its own button.

SB's strict adherence to the 2-minute meta is starting to result in strange choices, as if whoever has their hands on class design thinks that jobs should only be able to be fun or impactful once every 2 minutes. Please note that every ability listed here with a combo added in DT has a 2-minute cooldown...

Is this where we're going in terms of job design? New abilities being relegated to odd positions hidden behind utility cooldowns? What's next? Presence of Mind comboing into Afflatus Obliteration?

Oh, wait, they already added that...

[ZephyrMenodora]

I honestly love Oracle and Baneful impaction and now actually look forward to buffing others every 2 minutes, since I get something fun too.

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Quote:
Why this feels bad: Of all things to stick behind a 2m CD, an AoE DoT is one of the strangest. Chain Stratagem, being single target, was generally saved for boss encounters. Now, Scholars are looking for strange ways to fit it into trash pulls to get actually decent use out of Baneful Impaction. This can cause a cooldown desync where CS isn't ready for a boss encounter, which limits its usefulness as that is generally when people are dumping their nukes.
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I mean, I use it when everyone else uses their 2 minute buffs on the first W2W trash pull, and it's usually up by the time we reach the boss again? Most people use their 2 minute CD buffs at the first W2W pull in dungeons and don't just save them for the boss. (At least I find this optimal when people don't "save" big buffs only for boss fights meaning they use it 3 times a run only).

[NegativeS]

I mean, I use it when everyone else uses their 2 minute buffs on the first W2W trash pull, and it's usually up by the time we reach the boss again? Most people use their 2 minute CD buffs at the first W2W pull in dungeons and don't just save them for the boss. (At least I find this optimal when people don't "save" big buffs only for boss fights meaning they use it 3 times a run only).

This depends on the group you play with, and is not always a guarantee. I have been doing this during my time leveling SCH, and not only does it feel awkward using CS on a single trash mob, but maybe 50% of the time CS was not ready by the start of the next boss, or expired by the time others started using their 2m cooldowns. Whether this is due to my own error or not, it does not feel good trying to sync up abilities this specific with randoms.

[faiarrow]

I think my favourite weird-proc-on-utility is Summoner.
You can only use Searing Flash if you've used Searing Light. Sure, fine in most 4-to-8 man content if you're the only fixed summoner. The minute you've got 2+ summoners who might stagger their Searing Light (if they use braincells and coordinate that is) for further buff uptime you're desyncing a pretty potent DPS hit out of your opener and re-open down the line.

The hilarious thing is that it really couldn't be attributed to button bloat for that job because we have so many open slots on SMN hotbars due to it's simplification. It could've been it's own button procing off of something else entirely in the 1-2-3 rotation of gemshines.

Baneful on SCH could've been an upgrade to AoW easily - would've been like the good ol' Miasma II days.

It's.. certainly a Design Choice.

[ZephyrMenodora]

This depends on the group you play with, and is not always a guarantee. I have been doing this during my time leveling SCH, and not only does it feel awkward using CS on a single trash mob, but maybe 50% of the time CS was not ready by the start of the next boss, or expired by the time others started using their 2m cooldowns. Whether this is due to my own error or not, it does not feel good trying to sync up abilities this specific with randoms.

Well before it made no sense wasting time using CS on a single trash mob, so before I did absolutely nothing until the boss with the skill. Now I have motivation to use it as the opener to the first big pack, like everyone else does, and then all of our buffs are up again at the same time for the boss.

[NegativeS]

Well before it made no sense wasting time using CS on a single trash mob, so before I did absolutely nothing until the boss with the skill. Now I have motivation to use it as the opener to the first big pack, like everyone else does, and then all of our buffs are up again at the same time for the boss.

It's okay for abilities to have niches, not everything on my bars needs to be squeezed out for only minor DPS increases. That dog at the start of Everkeep that was unlucky enough to be targeted with CS is still probably going to die in the same amount of GCDs as the DPS, because they're all vomiting AoEs anyway.

Maybe we have different opinions on how CS should be used, and that's okay. But there's still no point for Baneful to be locked behind CS when you could just perform the same interaction with them separate, with the freedom to use them in their own situations if you so wished.

[CaptainLagbeard]

Some of the new skills tied to CD actually make the Jobs slightly more awkward to play, especially when the new skills are on the GCD.
Some Jobs that got two such skills, they probably could move of the two into an oGCD ability instead.

And for ones stuck behind party-wide buffs, it's a disadvantage if you end in a group with the someone using the same Job as you can't stack buffs, so someone has to not use their new big attack in the intended burst window.