2 melee 2 ranged standard

[kurkee]

I mean, a cancelled cast is pretty catastrophic to any of the three casters (idk if that's what you meant). If you cancel one to slam a Holy/Xenoglossy/whatever, you already lost like 1/2s of uptime. Assuming that's what you meant.
But yes, I do think Smudge is the "secret ingredient" to deal with some annoying patterns. It's actually really good. I really just wish SE made Aetherial Manipulation work the same way.

I more mean you can cast smudge after any casted spell without clipping. I'm only talking about pictomancer, specifically in the case of how much leverage swiftcast+motif is and hammer's versatility. I don't really wanna speak on any other caster because my history with content doesn't cover it as thoroughly.

You are contesting an argument that doesn't exist. I believe you think Ggwppino said that keeping uptime on casters (or PCT if you prefer) is hard and complex so you chimed in to say "No, I think it's easy".

Thing is, that's not the point at all. You can't bring PCT to EX1, press skills in a random order every pull and expect to do completely fine every single time. You learn the fight and you adapt your rotation to the fight as needed. It's something that every non-phys ranged job has to do - to various degrees - because the whole point of (current) phys ranged design is that there is no friction at all in keeping 100% uptime (which is why their mobility tax exists).

It doesn't matter if you have found keeping uptime on PCT so far easy, hard, something in between, braindead or the hardest thing you have ever done in your life: you still had to take those decisions which is something a DNC, a BRD or a MCH don't need to do. And this isn't PCT-specific but it applies to every other job in the game (as I said, to various degrees).

Go do yourself a favour and go check some logs... Or a job guide

Feel free to take your own advice and check out mine: Kurkee Brakzz on Midgardsormr

I raided on dancer for the most recent tier. It was rough. I'd have traded mobility for the expectations of physical range locking in on procs and high APM sequences during challenging mechanics. Some of you really feel like you're hellbent gassing up your role like it's that much harder and I just wanted to lend my take since I found it kinda silly. There is friction on every DPS. Being compared to phys ranged isn't the end of the world. In fact, I think if you play SMN or PCT, you probably have it easier than phys ranged.

Do you earnestly believe that aiming doesn't make decisions? I think they do while having a tendency towards being the flex player in savage and ultimate content. BRD and DNC can have very involved burst sequences, particularly BRD.

[rewd]

I more mean you can cast smudge after any casted spell without clipping. I'm only talking about pictomancer, specifically in the case of how much leverage swiftcast+motif is and hammer's versatility. I don't really wanna speak on any other caster because my history with content doesn't cover it as thoroughly.




Feel free to take your own advice and check out mine: Kurkee Brakzz on Midgardsormr

I raided on dancer for the most recent tier. It was rough. I'd have traded mobility for the expectations of physical range locking in on procs and high APM sequences during challenging mechanics. Some of you really feel like you're hellbent gassing up your role like it's that much harder and I just wanted to lend my take since I found it kinda silly. There is friction on every DPS. Being compared to phys ranged isn't the end of the world. In fact, I think if you play SMN or PCT, you probably have it easier than phys ranged.

Do you earnestly believe that aiming doesn't make decisions? I think they do while having a tendency towards being the flex player in savage and ultimate content. BRD and DNC can have very involved burst sequences, particularly BRD.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I genuinely have zero interest in your logs. Or anyone's really, as I only mentioned logs before as a way to show instant GCDs which were relevant to the discussion we were having (but I reckon this was probably just a failed attempt at a snarky reply). Any relevant info I could find there you can put into words here if needed.

Anyway, how is any of what you said now relevant to what we were saying? kurkee, you really need to take a double and more careful look at the messages you have read before you tell other people that they are being silly. I don't know if you are misrepresenting on purpose (it's a common hobby here), but our messages have been very cleary and don't warrant such a big misinterpretation.

I never said "phys ranged have no friction", I am (we are) specifically talking about uptime. Different roles have different points of friction, otherwise they'd be the same role. Water is wet.
If you are playing phys ranged, you don't care about disengagement or movement like melee or caster (and by extension, tanks and healers). It's puzzling that we have to waste time explaining this.

If you have experienced the stigma that phys ranged are supposed to be the "braindead jobs", I'm sorry, but I have nothing to do with it and don't project that onto me. Please, keep focused on what is actually being said.

--

Anyway, I've reached my limit of the time and mental energy I'm willing to invest here, so good luck to those brave enough to keep going.

[kurkee]

You can't bring PCT to EX1, press skills in a random order every pull and expect to do completely fine every single time. You learn the fight and you adapt your rotation to the fight as needed. It's something that every non-phys ranged job has to do

Don't take this the wrong way, but I genuinely have zero interest in your logs. Or anyone's really.

Don't worry. I already sorta got that impression from what I've seen. I mostly mentioned mine to show a degree of expertise in what we were all discussing. Competence and experience can help build the foundation for why someone thinks or feels the way they do. And, don't take this the wrong way, but if someone has historically been an incompetent career caster, then it speaks volumes in much the same way.

I never said "phys ranged have no friction", I am (we are) specifically talking about uptime. Different roles have different points of friction, otherwise they'd be the same role. Water is wet.
If you are playing phys ranged, you don't care about disengagement or movement like melee or caster (and by extension, tanks and healers). It's puzzling that we have to waste time explaining this.

If you have experienced the stigma that phys ranged are supposed to be the "braindead jobs", I'm sorry, but I have nothing to do with it and don't project that onto me. Please, keep focused on what is actually being said.

Fair enough lol.

I mean, my initial point was that I think that caster players were making pictomancer sound so intense to plan around when it's not really that dramatically difficult and you can fall into a priority system, really. You talked about my point as if I was saying you "press skills in a random order," which is not really the case either. But yeah, I see where you're coming from. Phys ranged does have uptime. mb. However, there seems to be a lot of people that really detest the comparison of picto having essentially the same liberties as a physical ranged.

You can't bring PCT to EX1, press skills in a random order every pull and expect to do completely fine every single time. You learn the fight and you adapt your rotation to the fight as needed. It's something that every non-phys ranged job has to do

And I just find that funny. The confidence you try to wield while discussing this game is almost admirable.

Anyway, I've reached my limit of the time and mental energy I'm willing to invest here, so good luck to those brave enough to keep going.

bye

[Valence]

I've played that game and raided long enough to notice louts that overinflate their favorite job or role's difficulty out of personal insecurities and lash out at others that may contest that position.

You can quote as many logs or guide as you'd like, but simply counting the amount of "free casts" and comparing jobs based solely on this metric is already disingenuous enough to show a clear bias into trying to win internet points by any means.

[Supersnow845]

I've played that game and raided long enough to notice louts that overinflate their favorite job or role's difficulty out of personal insecurities and lash out at others that may contest that position.

You can quote as many logs or guide as you'd like, but simply counting the amount of "free casts" and comparing jobs based solely on this metric is already disingenuous enough to show a clear bias into trying to win internet points by any means.

It speaks volumes about this discussion that I literally have no idea which “side” you are taking if any

Are you saying “oh it has lots of free casts so therefore it’s super mobile” as a statement indicating the melee don’t know what they are talking about and over inflating their jobs difficulty to put PCT down or are you saying “obviously if you understood casters you’d realise that even if PCT has less free casts it can move them around more giving them more functional movement” as a knock against people who think PCT is difficult as a more “melee are harder” by association stance

I’ve found in the “should PCT be at the same level as the high melees” both sides tends to exaggerate the difficulty of their class (uptime for casters, melee range for melee) and diminish the difficulty of the other

[Valence]

It speaks volumes about this discussion that I literally have no idea which “side” you are taking if any

Are you saying “oh it has lots of free casts so therefore it’s super mobile” as a statement indicating the melee don’t know what they amean e talking about and over inflating their jobs difficulty to put PCT down or are you saying “obviously if you understood casters you’d realise that even if PCT has less free casts it can move them around more giving them more functional movement” as a knock against people who think PCT is difficult as a more “melee are harder” by association stance

I’ve found in the “should PCT be at the same level as the high melees” both sides tends to exaggerate the difficulty of their class (uptime for casters, melee range for melee) and diminish the difficulty of the other

I don't have a horse in this race. I exposed my feeling on how the difficulty PCT feels to me personally when playing it compared to other casters like BLM or even RDM, and got immediately attacked and made fun of by a certain someone that came up with half baked arguments and pseudo log analyses. I admitted that I got a fact wrong on insta casts, but the guy continued to dig himself a grave after that.

People do indeed like to inflate the difficulty of their jobs to find some illusory idea of superiority and how their job should be doing more damage than the others. Especially prevalent with a lot of melees and casters, as you can guess.