2 melee 2 ranged standard

[Ramiee]

I accidentally made another picto is op or SMN has too much instant casts thread again.

[W00by]

I wasn't trying to attack anyone, I just wish Rewd would back up his claims with evidence. I think it is fine to insinuate that PCT is very mobile, and therefore, Lyth's comment isn't nonsense, but all rewd did was just call his take crazy. I wanted evidence rather than attacks. Rewd was the one attacking someone, not me.

Obviously, I think SMN is basically a phys ranged already. If any of them are phys ranged, it's that one. But PCT undeniably has strong mobility tools. It's also worth contextually stating that in the past, rewd tends to attack me ad hominem rather than engage with my argument, so I wanted him to provide evidence-based analysis rather than just call someone crazy.

Point is, I was never trivializing anything, I just don't think you can actually make the claim that PCT isn't mobile just because that mobility isn't as automatic as something like a physranged. Mobility in this game isn't a constant -- tools are weighed by how well they can get you through mechanics. And PCT's tools are better at that than the other casters (except SMN, which is barely a caster as is constantly observed.)

[Ggwppino]

The PCT is not very mobile by default, but it allows planning margin.

And trivializing planning by comparing it to a macro category that has guaranteed uptime it's crazy.

[W00by]

I was comparing it to RDM in my post. . .? Not aiming?

[Ggwppino]

But you chose to attack the thread of the discussion from this nonsense, legitimizing it. You can have written anything you want, but it's crazy that you decided to look not at mobility, but at the tools that allow the PCT to be very mobile, after having practically trivialized its optimization.

The smn instead has problems with the drift of the buff when the fight is interrupted. The rdm has problems over long distances, we all noticed it in p7s and p8s p1, problems that it doesn't have when the mechanics don't require for this long distance. The PCT, on the other hand, will never have this problem, if, perhaps, he sacrifices some damage to use a hammer outside of burst. Maybe or maybe not. But it is, in fact, planning.

They designed better the PCT, is it a PCT fault?

[W00by]

I'm not attacking anyone. You're calling my points nonsense. That's way more of an attack. I'm just civilly disagreeing with the claim that PCT is fundamentally immobile.

Also, I fail to understand how "the tools that allow you to be mobile" and "its mobility" aren't the same thing...?

I'm the one who said casters have to plan, so obviously I'm not trivializing it. I raid on caster. At a pretty high level, too, if I do say so myself.

My point is and always has been that PCT has strong mobility tools that make it on the more mobile end of casters because of their flexibility. If you can disprove that PCT is mobile in the hands of a good player, feel free. But I'd appreciate not being called nonsense with no founding. And if you read my other posts, you'd know I said that PCT is really well designed. But it's really well designed ... and mobile. At the same time. Two things can be true.

[Ggwppino]

I'm attacking the nonsense written by Lyth, but I'm attacking the fact that you decided to take it at face value, when it's crazy.


Mobility arises, in fact, from the player's skill in planning.
I'm not saying that what you wrote next is wrong, I'm saying that a class is mobile and knowing how to get the right mobility from that class are two completely different things.
I repeat: The PCT is not very mobile by default

[W00by]

I'm not taking Lyth's comment at face value. I've provided substantial reasoning for why I believe PCT is a highly mobile class.

But your argument doesn't make much sense. "PCT is not very mobile if you don't use its mobility tools."

Okay, by that logic, DNC is not very mobile if I choose not to move. I totally could just stand still and never move. It's within my rights to play that way. But no, if I use the tools the job has, it's very mobile... right?

So if PCT uses its mobility tools, it's very mobile. "By default," no job in the game is mobile because they can't move without a human being to press WASD.

[Ggwppino]

I'm not taking Lyth's comment at face value. I've provided substantial reasoning for why I believe PCT is a highly mobile class.

But your argument doesn't make much sense. "PCT is not very mobile if you don't use its mobility tools."

Okay, by that logic, DNC is not very mobile if I choose not to move. I totally could just stand still and never move. It's within my rights to play that way. But no, if I use the tools the job has, it's very mobile... right?

So if PCT uses its mobility tools, it's very mobile. "By default," no job in the game is mobile because they can't move without a human being to press WASD.

Simple, simple. Because either you do it with examples or it's all rhetoric: I have to go from point A to point B.
I'm a dnc, what do I do? I continue with my rotation and move on.
I'm a PCT, what do I do? Have I planned for this movement? then I put myself in the situation of being able to move without losing uptime, Have I not planned? Oh shit.

[W00by]

But if you have planned, the job is mobile.

And you always have the ability to plan, so the job always has the ability to be mobile.

Therefore ... the job is mobile.