Warrior Rework to Balance the job

[RaevusAstra]

I really hope the devs don't listen to this stuff. Do people really want trash mobs to hit harder in a dungeon? Cause WAR has always been fine on bosses. They havent made trash interesting in casual content in any expansion, so what will this "nerf" accomplish? Just taking fun away from WAR players who like to feel invincible on the weakest enemies in the game.

[Lorika]

Do people realise that if you nerf WAR sustain, you can just scrap the job at this point?

[Alice_Rivers]

Do people really want trash mobs to hit harder in a dungeon? Cause WAR has always been fine on bosses. They havent made trash interesting in casual content in any expansion, so what will this "nerf" accomplish?

Yes, some of us do want trash mobs to hit harder, if we didn't do things because they were unprecedented we'd never have got out of caves.

Just taking fun away from WAR players who like to feel invincible on the weakest enemies in the game.

If people need to be immortal to have fun then I feel sorry for them, but to flip your logic on it's head - just taking fun away from healers who like to use their kits in the vast majority of content.

Do people realise that if you nerf WAR sustain, you can just scrap the job at this point?

If WAR has nothing but it's immortality then it's terribly designed. I don't believe that any job being immortal by it's own power is healthy for any MMO, much less one with a holy trinity, in that context WAR is literally game breaking. At the risk of repeating myself yet again, WAR being a heal tank is okay, using heals as mitigation is cool replacing an entire point of the holy trinity in multiple categories of content not okay or balanced and should be fixed.

[RaevusAstra]

Yes, some of us do want trash mobs to hit harder, if we didn't do things because they were unprecedented we'd never have got out of caves.



If people need to be immortal to have fun then I feel sorry for them, but to flip your logic on it's head - just taking fun away from healers who like to use their kits in the vast majority of content.



If WAR has nothing but it's immortality then it's terribly designed. I don't believe that any job being immortal by it's own power is healthy for any MMO, much less one with a holy trinity, in that context WAR is literally game breaking. At the risk of repeating myself yet again, WAR being a heal tank is okay, using heals as mitigation is cool replacing an entire point of the holy trinity in multiple categories of content not okay or balanced and should be fixed.

I'll get behind your sentiment of "balance" when trash mobs stop becoming hp sponges.

Otherwise I think this complaint is barking up the wrong tree.

[Ramiee]

Ideally trash wouldn't take long to kill but adversely wouldn't also take long to kill you, no one likes sponges, tanks and DPS don't like mobs that never die while healers don't like party members that never die. Both need to be addressed.

[Alice_Rivers]

That's a separate issue, it is an issue, especially when dps players are bad at their jobs. If trash mobs did more damage and actually had interesting engagement then there would be no justification for their sponginess. This should not be a chicken or egg situation.

Ideally trash wouldn't take long to kill but adversely wouldn't also take long to kill you, no one likes sponges, tanks and DPS don't like mobs that never die while healers don't like party members that never die. Both need to be addressed.

^Exactly this.^

[RaevusAstra]

The chicken needs to be addressed with the egg. FFXIV has a bad habit of taking away things that are perceived to be problems while giving nothing to compensate, which makes the problem worse overall. It's the state we see time and time again with stuff like Jobs, relic weapons, and so much content in the game.

If we start balancing trash and make them mechanically interesting, we can talk about how jobs stack up and are balanced vs trash.

[Alice_Rivers]

So we should be in agreement that, as I put forward two pages ago, the jobs (the chicken) and content (the egg) need rebalancing to involve all members of the party in the ways they are meant to be involved. CKNovel has come around on the latter part with a reasonable suggestion that could be carried forward, I don't think it fixes either problem on it's own and we still don't see eye to eye on tank/healer balance but any step towards a solution is better than none.

[RaevusAstra]

Agreed. Honestly, I do hope for the game to be as engaging to everyone as possible. I think healers need more things to do than just heal and press damage buttons — they'd have so much value if there were mechanics that could not be handled by tanks or dps, and esuna/cleansing is horribly underutilized. I would probably start there, on "how can we inflict status effects on party members that no one but healers can deal with?" Then they could add those things to trash mobs to keep everyone engaged.

[aiqa]

I'll get behind your sentiment of "balance" when trash mobs stop becoming hp sponges.

Otherwise I think this complaint is barking up the wrong tree.

Thrash mobs already die very fast when people are at the max item level for the content.