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  1. #21
    Player
    Jinglypockets's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2024
    Posts
    77
    Character
    Kisori Petrova
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Arohk View Post
    not really, there is hardly any puzzle mechanic in the game where the solution is not instantly clear, you just need to memorize the pattern and know where to go immediately without thinking about it.
    Not really, I just have to memorize the patterns and immediately go to the right spot instead of "solving" the puzzle.

    Now we've found three ways to say the exact same thing while pretending to disagree!
    (0)

  2. #22
    Player
    LilimoLimomo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2023
    Location
    Windurst
    Posts
    1,134
    Character
    Lilimo Limomo
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Valence View Post
    But other examples can be found everywhere, like the ghost dungeon and its teacup boss (expert), or Superchain Theory in EW...
    Am I the only one that's having that problem with those specific types of new mechanics?
    These are the only 2 mechanics I remember (both from normal content), so they're the only ones I'll comment on.

    I would guess that a major part of the difficulty with some of these mechanics comes from players feeling like they need to keep doing a full DPS rotation while they occur. Because doing your rotation takes a certain amount of your cognitive bandwidth, which leaves less cognitive bandwidth to devote to any given mechanic.

    And I think that's the entire point of mechanics like the teacups. All by itself, the teacups aren't going to cause trouble for most players that have reached Dawntrail; you know which cup the tea is in, so if you just keep your eye on that one cup (and remember where the other filled cups were in relation to the one you're watching) then you'll be fine. But this relatively straightforward task becomes much more challenging if we're multi-tasking.

    The general solution to any mechanic that's giving you trouble is pretty simple: stop your full-throated DPS while you need to pay attention to them. Just repeatedly tap a basic ranged instant-cast attack, or stop DPSing entirely. This frees up so much more of your mental bandwidth, both for performing and learning!

    Superchain Theory is similar; is there a hoop? If so, can you find it? It's just searching for shapes; this is something that most people are capable of. If it's challenging you, it's probably because your rotation is distracting you, so free up some of your mental load by stopping your DPS while you do it. And over time, you may eventually feel like you've got this mechanic under your belt enough to do more DPS. Or maybe you won't! Either way is fine.

    Or alternatively, don't ever stop DPSing! Continue DPSing while you try to learn and perform the mechanic, and if you die, you die. Dying is fine because it's a video game. Heck, I find dying fun, because it means the game has found a way to challenge me. I humbly recommend to all that will listen: when it comes to games, do your best to care less about winning and focus more on having fun. If you can only have fun when you're winning, you're having less fun than you could otherwise be having!

    And even when I'm not dying, most of my best memories from FF14 are from auto-matched groups where one or more people kept dying but kept trying. I did Tender Valley the other day and there were so many deaths and wipes. Despite tips and iteration, our healer stated that they just weren't figuring out the maze at the end. So I asked if they would like me to show them the right path during the fight, and they said yes. So instead of immediately going down the right track after I had solved the maze, I jumped up and down in front of the track so that we could all go together. And we succeeded. It was a really nice memory.

    And here's why it was nice: because we worked as a team to overcome a challenge. Every single person in the world has strengths and weaknesses that are different than those of others. And that's why teams are so fun! When I'm having trouble, someone else can help me. When they're having trouble, I can help them. None of us are a monolith that needs to be able to do everything themselves, because we are stronger together.

    Which leads me into what I keep saying about "most players". The world is vast, and I would not be surprised if there are people whose brains have trouble following an object as it moves, or sorting through a bunch of visual shapes to find the one that's different, etc. There are absolutely people who will experience a much greater degree of challenge when asked to perform certain feats, or may even be incapable of overcoming them, even if they stop doing their rotations. We should all be compassionate about that.

    But as long as we work together, as long as we see each other as allies who deserve compassion and support instead of strangers who owe us a good performance, as long as we see the game as an activity that's purpose is entertainment instead of a job that needs completing, we can overcome these challenges and have a great time while doing so.

    As someone with some disabilities myself, I want to acknowledge that this reply doesn't delve into all aspects of disability (like self-image); that would require a much longer and more detailed post. But I hope what I've written here can be helpful.

    And in the rare case that someone's a jerk because you or anyone else is bad, report them. Clean up the streets and help make FF14 that much more of a place where we have fun as a team.
    (2)

  3. #23
    Player
    Arohk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    1,332
    Character
    Lucretia Ryusagi
    World
    Twintania
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Jinglypockets View Post
    Not really, I just have to memorize the patterns and immediately go to the right spot instead of "solving" the puzzle.

    Now we've found three ways to say the exact same thing while pretending to disagree!
    okay, then what is the problem exactly? its not like you must solve a puzzle every time, just got to position X when pattern Y spawns, there is little to no RNG involved
    (0)

  4. #24
    Player
    Jinglypockets's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2024
    Posts
    77
    Character
    Kisori Petrova
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Arohk View Post
    okay, then what is the problem exactly? its not like you must solve a puzzle every time, just got to position X when pattern Y spawns, there is little to no RNG involved
    My problem isn't RNG, that the puzzles are too hard, or that they aren't solvable. I handle them just fine. I just don't think these kinds of mechanics are enjoyable gameplay.

    The ones I dislike the most are the ones that are effectively unsolvable in real time -- the squares in P6S come to mind. There are way too many checks for anyone to be able to figure it all out at once, so you just resort to memorization; if the X is here, go here, and if the X is here, go over here instead. There's something deeply unsatisfying about solving a complicated puzzle that way, but it's so ridiculously over the top that there's really no other way to do it. Related: Not a puzzle mechanic, but the Harvests on P7S where you need a map and a protractor to figure out all the safe spots give me the same vibe. The wheel on Rubicante Extreme is solvable in real time, but the faster, more reliable way to handle it is to learn the "tells" on each spin. You're not solving the puzzle -- you're just reading 1-2 keys to figure out which of the potential safe spots is safe.

    It feels less like I'm getting better at executing something difficult and more like I'm just memorizing a script.

    I'm glad the positions can be memorized, mind you, because I'd enjoy them even less if we actually did have to solve them in real time.

    To be clear, I've cleared all of the fights I mentioned; my complaint isn't that they're too difficult. I just don't think they're fun.
    (3)
    Last edited by Jinglypockets; 07-23-2024 at 03:34 AM.

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