Difficulty of normal content.

[Jinglypockets]

I'll add that the feeling of accomplishment you got from beating Void Ark is the feeling the rest of us are chasing when we say we want challenging content.

I've been in the same WoW guild for nearly 20 years. For most of that time, we were a casual guild killing bosses that were trivial for a huge chunk of the guilds on the server. Would it have been cool to have been on the cutting edge with the top guilds? Sure, but it would have required us to throw out a huge chunk of our identity in pursuit of progress.

Sure enough, a few years ago we started recruiting a lot more hardcore players, and we ended up killing Mythic endbosses as the #2 guild on our server for a while. Sure enough, we threw out a huge chunk of our identity and even sacrificed a few friendships in the process. All for progress that is ultimately...exactly as satisfying as the "trivial" content we had been struggling through before.

I'm proud of what we've accomplished, but it was not worth it. I would give anything for that guild to go back to casually struggling through little baby Heroic content.

Long story short, it does not matter where your progress stands in relation to everyone else. All that matters is that you're able to enjoy progressing through content that's fun for you.

[Jinglypockets]

There has always been options for the elitists that think normal is too easy. They can go extremes or savages or ultimates. Raising the difficulty of the normal content and locking out players that for whatever reason have difficulty with it is not the answer.

I hope square enix listens with their wallets, cause I just cancelled my subscription.

This game continues to have a dire lack of midcore content. I don't think you understand how big of a leap in difficulty it still is to go from Normal to Extreme, let alone how big that leap was in Endwalker.

There are a lot of people who aren't interested in Extreme/Savage/Ultimate, who aren't elitists and don't think of themselves as any kind of special, who've basically had nothing to do for years.

[Saraide]

Shadow of Mhach araids have much more obtuse tells. Ozma, Forgall and Calofisteri are ruthless with their mechanics. There's a reason it's called the Wiping City of Mhach. DT raids got nothing on that, they're just harder than the snoozefest that was endwalker normal raids.

[royox]

Not everyone wants a constant challenge. You ex players and raiders get your own modes and challenges, some people just want to veg out and enjoy a non challenging game, which the game has been for ten years, to it's success.

This is an absolute LIE. The game was challenging since the ARR release. Dungeons on MSQ had challenging stuff since day 1. Sastasha, the very first dungeon of the game, was a wipe horror if the tank didn't pull carefully, if the party didn't kill the clamps fast before being overruned by fireballs, if the DPS didn't know they had to block the spawn of enemies on the last boss by standing on the water holes.

Brayflox's Longstop was a guaranteed wipe if somebody pulled any extra enemy during the dungeon because they hit the tanks like trucks, and in the final boss if the tank didn't know he had to move the dragon out of the poisons. And let's talk about the literal horror movie that was Aurum Valley.

At MSQ dungeon level there were wipes, there was challenge. There was "final sting" that would oneshot tanks at 100% if the Melee didn't stun the wasp, there was "doom" that had to be cleansed by Esuna, standing on a white spot in the dungeon or being healed. There was that one with the underground worm that required one party member to venture himself to the "danger" area to trow some meat to make the worm come out...but if he catches you, bye bye. Freaking Pharos Sirus was a wipe fest on every boss and I can keep tryng to remember stuff and it keeps coming. The game had random telegraphs for the same mechanics in diferent dungeons...or didn't have telegraphs at all (hello Cyclops from Aurum Valley).

And the raids? If we don't consider Bahamut Coils as they were NOT intended for casual players. Alexander was a wipe fest on every floor, with tank swaps, wierd shenanigans, healers having to soak lasers, while healing, while DPS gets kidnaped to 1 vs 1 an enemy while the rest are dealing with aoes, laser turrets, the boss and missiles coming from all sides.

Alliance raids? OH BOY. Nobody remembers anymore how we all needed to have a macro for Behemoth to remind people to hide behind a rock? Or that before entering cerberus we all had the A: Adds, B: Boss/Belly C: Chains converstation? That the zombie dragon of Crystal Tower was an absolute drama because people had to add slow debufs to the skeletons to be able to kill them in time or they would wipe the party. Shall we speak about the WIPE CITY of MNACH and Ozma? Who had people crying on forums and reddit for "being too hard?" because people was asked to remember 3 diferent patterns of the 3 shapes it can get? Oh boy and let's talk about Ivalice, the 1st boss saying "hi!!" with falling towers that oneshots everybody, the MATHS boss, the electric grandpa with 3 swords that had people crying from week 1.

long etc.

The game was ALWAYS challenging.

[RaitoRalana]

There has always been options for the elitists that think normal is too easy. They can go extremes or savages or ultimates. Raising the difficulty of the normal content and locking out players that for whatever reason have difficulty with it is not the answer.

I hope square enix listens with their wallets, cause I just cancelled my subscription.

When you dont pay your sub.. you are not playing the game = They dont have to make it easier :O Win-Win?
I "like" how people are like "Dungeons in Dawntrail are too hard". Thats a thing since ARR. "Aurum Vale is too hard >" etc etc.
If the DUNGEONS are too hard for someone.. well, Trust/NPCs exist and they turn it into a tutorial.

When they make dungeons easier, people will cancel their subscription too, because it would be lame and boring. And thats not about "eLiTiStS!!11". Im pretty sure the majority dont care about EX, savage or ultimates, but when you play a game for hundreds of hours, people should be able to beat the normal difficulty dungeons - atleast with the NPCs. Im pretty sure, all DT dungeons are doable without doing any dmgs to any boss and just hug one of the NPCs. And ngl, when THAT is too hard.. yikes.

Oh and the funniest part:
"No need for healers anymore!! #HealerStrike!"
And on the other hand:
"Dungeons are too hard to heal "

I hope, Square Enix dont listen to people too much, because it would end up in a death spiral for the game.

And for disabled gamers: Just ask 3 good players to help you out. All bosses are able to beat with only 3 people

[SekiaTa1ga]

It's genuinely hard for me to wrap my head around someone who plays video games at all to think that the normal content in Dawntrail is too hard to overcome. Like have these people been decent at anything ever? I know that sounds like a bit too much but if life is overcoming obstacles then I'd rank being able to manage DTs normal difficulty pretty low on that list. Actually, when I think about it, I don't even know how it's possible to fail at Dawntrail given that you're mostly in a party with other people that can probably just carry you through it.

The misconception that bothers me is that people who think Dawntrail is too hard think there's a high bar with difficulty. Anyone who thinks the difficulty is just fine is suddenly 'elitist' when most likely I'd argue that the people who find DT to be too hard are the large minority.

[Lizvette]

There has always been options for the elitists that think normal is too easy. They can go extremes or savages or ultimates. Raising the difficulty of the normal content and locking out players that for whatever reason have difficulty with it is not the answer.

I hope square enix listens with their wallets, cause I just cancelled my subscription.

and clearly, if the forum is any indicative, their wallets will be much better off right now than previously. i myself just bought half a year of sub yesterday.
congratz, you played yourself.

as for everyone who genuinely ask for incredibly easy content to do - it already exists. it's called guildhests. i suggest you guys do that - guaranteed easy content for you to consume every day, any day.


mean words aside, if you wipe or die - just try again. it REALLY is no biggie.

[Dovaah]

This game continues to have a dire lack of midcore content. I don't think you understand how big of a leap in difficulty it still is to go from Normal to Extreme, let alone how big that leap was in Endwalker.

There are a lot of people who aren't interested in Extreme/Savage/Ultimate, who aren't elitists and don't think of themselves as any kind of special, who've basically had nothing to do for years.

Amen to that, SHB an EW normal content was way too easy for me and Extremes are too much of a commitment.
Dawntrail is the perfect middle ground imo

[EponaTBHSMH]

There has always been options for the elitists that think normal is too easy. They can go extremes or savages or ultimates. Raising the difficulty of the normal content and locking out players that for whatever reason have difficulty with it is not the answer.

I hope square enix listens with their wallets, cause I just cancelled my subscription.

Which normal content locked you out to the point you can cancel your sub?
Have you been running with trusts and wiping?
Have you tried duty finder?
How many times do you wipe before you consider yourself "locked out"?

[jdtuggey]

It's genuinely hard for me to wrap my head around someone who plays video games at all to think that the normal content in Dawntrail is too hard to overcome.

Am really trying to like, sympathize and sometimes it feels like just bucking for the sake of bucking.
Feels like there's no argument really, if they're struggling with a mechanic, you explain to them, they completely ignore you to talk about a completely unrelated problem.
They know the actual arguments concerning Dawntrail's difficulty are easily deconstructible, and are mostly about personal responsibility.
So they avoid the topic, and talk about us negatively instead! rofl. At least it's how I perceive it.
Like, feels like what they want is not actually Dawntrail to be easier, but to be catered to ?
Pay attention to me daddy square enix, make me feel more special than your entire playerbase! :P
Then, these people make new people like Aido believe that the game is impossibly hard further down the line, and that has them panicking/wanting to cancel their sub.
They also think the community is toxic af, when we're fairly welcoming and tolerant with new players who try.