The old Monk rotation is back

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

I believe they speak of optimal drift, related to Demolish dot drifting for alignment. Correct me if I got the terminology wrong.

[Silberzerox]

I hope this feels better to play now and more satisfying. I got used to the new rotation and it worked well as long i did not use perfect balance. Perfect balance made me trip half the time and i lost track of boss attacks or screwed up the opening of the Nadi i needed.
Over all i had a lot of moments where i needed 1-3 sec to reset my orientation, for me its just one class mechanic to much to follow. Respect to everyone that can play this class at max efficiency atm.

[Kirutsuki]

Please someone explain to me what the point of Monks AoE rotation is now?
I was hoping 7.01 would fix the AoE's in a different way.

As far as I understand Monks single target rotation is actually pretty complex with stances and stacks of fury management, but when it comes to the AoE's all you do is essentially:
Perfect Balance, AoE 1-2-3, Phoenix > repeat until you die of boredom.

Like, there's no way to get stacks of fury from any of your AoE moves at all, and they just buffed AoE's directly with 7.01???
Why not instead give the AoE's the fury buff from Demolish, Twin snakes and Dragon Kick instead of directly just giving a potency buff?
That way during a dungeon pull you actually have something to do and not just sit on your stacks of fury because AoE's don't use them.

I actually enjoy monks single target rotation alot with the fury management, but theres really no point in using Dragon Kick, Twin Snakes or Demolish when doing dungeon pulls.

Maybe I'm missing something, I'm not an endgame raider chasing the 1%, but this feels like a blatant oversight.

[SpeckledBurd]

It took 12 chains to loop. And did make the rotation more interesting, now you can easily just reduce it back to the 123-123-123-123 Ad nauseam rotation.

And they gotta look for ways to move away from that 2min pattern <.<

All things being equal, 2-3-4 Dawntrail Monk with formless Dragon Kick giving you a fury ball also meant that you'd basically ride the flank for ages so this at least makes what few positionals we have left have a little more influence on how we play.

[Zel]

I like the Change with the fury system don't feel so tedious now. However unless my brain is just dumb, the potency changes seem odd to me. Twins snakes and demolish(rear) have the same 420. Yet pouncing coeurl (flank + fury 520) is weaker then raising raptor(Fury 540), feel odd to me that the 3rd ws in the combo is either same or weaker potency. I know in end we will do 2 Pouncing to 1 demolisher and alternating the 1+2 ws, overall it prolly just make sense dps wise. but looking at it made me question it.

[Mikey_R]

Let's be honest here, the 2 minute meta has nothing to do with this. Every 2 minutes you do things outside your standard rotation (Fire's Reply, 2 PB windows and either Wind's Reply or Opo-Opo), The Odd minutes, you still have the PB window and Fire's Reply, you then have guaranteed 2 Opo-Opo forms, which leaves 3 GCDs for you to rotate through. These extra GCDs are replaced by Wind's Reply when it lines up. With that said, the change only affects the periods in between the RoF phases.

Going back to 112, in my opinion is bad. 2 weeks really isn't enough tome for people to adapt to a new rotation flow, especially since it has been the same for 10 years. Now, I understand that too many Pouncing Coeurls in a row was an issue, which is fine, however, they should have made Raptor the 3 rotation instead, making it a 132. And no, Monk doesn't have a '36 GCD rotation'. It is getting interrupted by RoF before you even complete a loop, so thinking about it like that is stupid.

As was evident here, I was looking forward to getting to know Monk's new rotation and having a different flow, where the underpinning knowledge was the same. This was a bad move in my opinion.

[GrizzlyTank]

Yeah, it was too hasty of another rework for monk. Should have let it stay past the first savage end then see from there.

[Pyitoechito]

It's bad job design to have only one job that doesn't fit the mold of the two minute timer that the developers have doubled down on this expansion. If you want monk to be played even less than it is now, advocate for it to be that one job that doesn't burst when everyone else is.

Also 12 loops = 36 GCDs that's exactly what I said. Though I'll admit I mathed it wrong, it doesn't take 2 minutes, it takes 72 seconds with a 2 second GCD which means the rotation will never loop as it was if you're using perfect balance when riddle of fire comes back up.

I'm confused. Are MNK's filler GCDs supposed to perfectly align to a 2-minute rotation? I thought the point of PB was you could interrupt the combos at any time to deal the big burst before returning to the standard rotation, with the new Fire/Wind Replies also adding more big damage that fills GCDs in the 2-min burst window.

Black mage doesn't align with a 2-min burst either, technically. It has buttons that are pressed every 2 minutes, but it's not like the beginning of fire phase perfectly aligns with the start of a burst window.

[wereotter]

I'm confused. Are MNK's filler GCDs supposed to perfectly align to a 2-minute rotation? I thought the point of PB was you could interrupt the combos at any time to deal the big burst before returning to the standard rotation, with the new Fire/Wind Replies also adding more big damage that fills GCDs in the 2-min burst window.

Black mage doesn't align with a 2-min burst either, technically. It has buttons that are pressed every 2 minutes, but it's not like the beginning of fire phase perfectly aligns with the start of a burst window.

The addition of the beast charkas alongside a core skill rotation that will never loop back into itself means you will have a difficult time having the same resources available to you in the burst window each time you enter it. Sure you'll have perfect balance, but you may be lacking charged up skills unless you over cap on those resources.

Also not sure that black mage is the best comparison? I'm not an expert on the job, but it seems to me black mage is more about steady high damage than big burst phase damage.

[Shurrikhan]

they said in no uncertain terms that monk's core rotation in Dawntrail wasn't going to change. They messed up, and they're fixing it.

The rotation as it was before the adjustment took 36 GCDs to loop back around into itself, or more than 2 minutes. This is a good change.

Except, at higher Skill Speed, we've actually been able to run two True Strikes per Twin Snakes outside of Demolish/Twin durations with formless GCDs (Blitz, Fracture, Touch of Death) from ARR through to Endwalker (though its advantage was at its most pitiful in Endwalker). So the ammo change still doesn't very well emulate what we used to have. And it still lacks any interaction with our CDs, be they soft (old Demolish) or hard (PB → Blitzes).

Also 36 GCDs is at most 72 seconds for Monk. No one takes more than 120 seconds to do 36 GCDs. Even the base GCD takes a mere 90s to do 36 GCDs. EDIT: He already corrected himself.

Imo, the change again misses the point. A "72s" loop (it wasn't, as you had PB, Blitzes, and Fire's Reply) was fine. That it didn't necessarily loop per or around RoF or Brotherhood (i.e., per 60 or 120s) was fine. Requiring new muscle memory (for those using standard loop instead of any adjustment) is fine. What wasn't fine was the lack of interaction or nuke-GCD besides Opo-spender, and that remains unchanged.