Gladiator/Paladin STR & MND Stat Caps?

[Izodius]

that chart molly references should give equal value to ACC and STR. If you are under accuracy cap then ACC > everything and if your weapon of choice adds accuracy you can swap in an equal number of STR in almost every slot. Example: rings 18str or 18acc, same for gloves where the materia breakdowns are the same for acc vs str.

Possibly, there isn't solid testing on STR vs ACC gains in regards to 1 to 1 DPS and if there is a cutoff point at which ACC gains below 'cap' start to provide less returns than say attack power... There could easily be a point where you certainly want to drop say 5 ACC to get 10 AP. I'm inclined you agree with you - as this is usually the case for every MMO, but there simply isn't enough testing or comparision tools out there to say that for a fact. Regardless the sheets Molly made, is based off of my & Silvano's Weapon Comparison calculator sheet and it has a place for you to put your personal value of Accuracy into it.

I valued Accuracy as a function of AP rather than strength though, since AP is more valueable as you get closer to the stat caps - and it also gives gains to your Auto-Attack damage which are not insignificant.

[Judge_Xero]

Possibly, there isn't solid testing on STR vs ACC gains in regards to 1 to 1 DPS and if there is a cutoff point at which ACC gains below 'cap' start to provide less returns than say attack power... There could easily be a point where you certainly want to drop say 5 ACC to get 10 AP. I'm inclined you agree with you - as this is usually the case for every MMO, but there simply isn't enough testing or comparision tools out there to say that for a fact. Regardless the sheets Molly made, is based off of my & Silvano's Weapon Comparison calculator sheet and it has a place for you to put your personal value of Accuracy into it.

I valued Accuracy as a function of AP rather than strength though, since AP is more valueable as you get closer to the stat caps - and it also gives gains to your Auto-Attack damage which are not insignificant.

Does Acc actually give you increased damage output?
Or is it in the sense that a "Miss" ='s 0 Damage, and therefore Acc increases damage dealt?

[Izodius]

Does Acc actually give you increased damage output?
Or is it in the sense that a "Miss" ='s 0 Damage, and therefore Acc increases damage dealt?

Something very important to note is that the numbers on the sheets are WEIGHTS they are not actual DPS or damage numbers. Accuracy is given a weighted value (as a function of AP) as an opportunity stat based off of the users entries. So as far as the sheet is concerned, Accuracy adds to the value of the weapon, yes.

[Judge_Xero]

Something very important to note is that the numbers on the sheets are WEIGHTS they are not actual DPS or damage numbers. Accuracy is given a weighted value (as a function of AP) as an opportunity stat based off of the users entries. So as far as the sheet is concerned, Accuracy adds to the value of the weapon, yes.

That's great work. It does a really good comparison.
Would you be able to list the base stats for each job on the page?

The reason I ask, is for people comparing the potential on Melee weapons. Let's say you want to know if ATK would give you the best setup over STR.

If you plug in your values say 350 STR under Primary, if it adds in ATK, then it will show the Weight of STR to be so much higher than ATK in some cases. But say, the base stat for STR is 232. Under primary (in this case STR) should we be putting 118? Because that's the difference from the base stat to 350.

Actually I think I answered my own question anyways lol

You should only add in what your stats are, above the base stats.

Also @ Izodius

do you happen to know what the Primary/Secondary and/or Stat Caps are for Paladin?
From my testing so far, I'd conclude that they cap at the same value, which is different from the other classes.

[Cthulhu]

/cheer

That's some good work.

[Zdenka]

That spread sheet is neat but some issues aren't really right I guess is a way to say it.

Accuracy is way too undervalued. Going from 350 acc to 420 acc on WAR is a LOT more DPS than going from 275 to 345 STR which is typically what you swap in and out for acc.

I don't play WAR much but for DRG, missing 1 key WS on Princess in a 1.5m kill lowers your total damage done by nearly 15%. Thats just 1 miss... at 350 acc on DRG you're accuracy is probably 80-85%.

The problem with that is since DPS is so reliant on keeping combos cooling off, that missing a combo WS and having them sit there while the one you missed cools down can drastically lower your overall damage. On a fight where I miss nothing I can pull out 150 DPS on Princess, but on ones where I miss 1-3 times my DPS can drop as low as 75.


Basically I agree with Tango that acc is far to undervalued. If put at a correct value Garuda Axe should re-evaluate back up to 2nd best axe.

[Molly_Millions]

That spread sheet is neat but some issues aren't really right I guess is a way to say it.

Accuracy is way too undervalued. Going from 350 acc to 420 acc on WAR is a LOT more DPS than going from 275 to 345 STR which is typically what you swap in and out for acc.

I don't play WAR much but for DRG, missing 1 key WS on Princess in a 1.5m kill lowers your total damage done by nearly 15%. Thats just 1 miss... at 350 acc on DRG you're accuracy is probably 80-85%.

The problem with that is since DPS is so reliant on keeping combos cooling off, that missing a combo WS and having them sit there while the one you missed cools down can drastically lower your overall damage. On a fight where I miss nothing I can pull out 150 DPS on Princess, but on ones where I miss 1-3 times my DPS can drop as low as 75.


Basically I agree with Tango that acc is far to undervalued. If put at a correct value Garuda Axe should re-evaluate back up to 2nd best axe.

Changing the accuracy to attack power ratio doesn't make as drastic a difference as you would think. Adding 26 mor STR does far more towards changing the wieghts than changing the acc:attack power value. LIke I said before, choosing a wep is not a one size fits all afair.

[Izodius]

"Accuracy is undervalued."

The user can change Accuracy's value, you can make it more valuable than STR if you want to (go over 100%). Accuracy is such a relative stat that there wasn't fair way to compare it. There's also very limited testing done on gains from Accuracy, other than we know that you cannot 'cap' accuracy and it does get worse as you get more (approaching zero) and that it's effected by the particular mob and their stats (Garuda says hi). I'd be suspect that 70 Acc > 70 STR in long term testing, but it certainly wouldn't surprise me either - of course it would also depend on the mob you were fighting, which adds a complexity to the calculations that I'm simply not willing to tackle.

Regardless if you're "capped" on accuracy then it's the most worthless stat (yes I'm assuming that you can't switch out other gear in that assumption, because it's theoretically possible for you to be in a situation where accuracy does nothing for you).

I valued Accuracy as a function of Attack Power because that way it effects all attacks, as it should, and not just weapon skills.

Pretty much what Molly said, there is no one-sized fits all comparison. The sheet is supposed to be a tool - the onus is on the user to use it the right way to make informed decisions based off of their situation.

[Molly_Millions]

The user can change Accuracy's value, you can make it more valuable than STR if you want to (go over 100%). Accuracy is such a relative stat that there wasn't fair way to compare it. There's also very limited testing done on gains from Accuracy, other than we know that you cannot 'cap' accuracy and it does get worse as you get more (approaching zero) and that it's effected by the particular mob and their stats (Garuda says hi). I'd be suspect that 70 Acc > 70 STR in long term testing, but it certainly wouldn't surprise me either - of course it would also depend on the mob you were fighting, which adds a complexity to the calculations that I'm simply not willing to tackle.

Regardless if you're "capped" on accuracy then it's the most worthless stat (yes I'm assuming that you can't switch out other gear in that assumption, because it's theoretically possible for you to be in a situation where accuracy does nothing for you).

I valued Accuracy as a function of Attack Power because that way it effects all attacks, as it should, and not just weapon skills.

Pretty much what Molly said, there is no one-sized fits all comparison. The sheet is supposed to be a tool - the onus is on the user to use it the right way to make informed decisions based off of their situation.

This. If I'm parsing near 100% accuracy with a weapon that has none, what good is the accuracy bonus on another weapon? If I put the relative value of acc at 65% on the spreadsheet it would incorrectly weight the value of a weapon with an acc bonus to me.

I filled in those spreadsheet for myself. I shared because my findings are interesting. You could always fill in your own how ever you'd like.

[Tango]

where do you come up with cap #'s at 330 for both mnd and str? I'd love to know caps but the listed data in the test doesn't relate to stat caps. Just shows relative value of str/mnd vs lvl 50 mobs.