Feedback: Dawntrail MSQ dungeon difficulty

[Bearskjold]

So I just wasted an hour in the Alexandria dungeon. I say wasted, because I spent most of that hour wiping with my NPC party on the first boss and then force closed the game mid-fight on the second one out of sheer frustration. Never before have I literally dreaded seeing a dungeon pop up in the MSQ the way I have in Dawntrail, but each one has gotten progressively more frustrating. I, like many others I imagine, play this game primarily to enjoy the story. And while DT's story hasn't exactly been my favorite, I have been enjoying the way it unfolded in the later half of the game yet having to struggle through increasingly difficult dungeons, I find myself questioning whether it's worth completing at this point.

I am admittedly an older gamer. My days of hardcore mythic/savage raiding are behind me, in part because I recognize that I just can't keep up with the increasing pace of fight mechanics. I'm completely capable of learning and reacting to mechanics, but there needs to be time to react. By the time you see the telegraph on the ground in these fights, it's already too late to get to where you need to be.

I have ZERO interest in playing Dark Souls or Elden Ring, but it feels like that's the direction the devs are pushing with these new dungeons. And while I recognize there is a portion of the playerbase that wants that, locking MSQ behind dungeons with that kind of difficulty punishes the rest of us.

I suggest that if these new fast-paced dungeons are indeed the direction Square Enix wishes to go with the game, that they add another difficulty setting to dungeons. By all means, give the hardcore action game folks their twitch reaction difficulty, but also make a normal level for the rest of us. You don't need to remove any mechanics, just increase the reaction time for them. Hell, I'd be happy if at least the NPC groups were altered to fit this, because right now, even the damn NPC's are struggling to keep up!

[TheRealQuah]

I bet you do the solo instances on very easy mode

[Bearskjold]

I do them on normal actually, but thanks for your nonconstructive response.

[Ori]

So I just wasted an hour in the Alexandria dungeon. I say wasted, because I spent most of that hour wiping with my NPC party on the first boss and then force closed the game mid-fight on the second one out of sheer frustration. Never before have I literally dreaded seeing a dungeon pop up in the MSQ the way I have in Dawntrail, but each one has gotten progressively more frustrating. I, like many others I imagine, play this game primarily to enjoy the story. And while DT's story hasn't exactly been my favorite, I have been enjoying the way it unfolded in the later half of the game yet having to struggle through increasingly difficult dungeons, I find myself questioning whether it's worth completing at this point.

I am admittedly an older gamer. My days of hardcore mythic/savage raiding are behind me, in part because I recognize that I just can't keep up with the increasing pace of fight mechanics. I'm completely capable of learning and reacting to mechanics, but there needs to be time to react. By the time you see the telegraph on the ground in these fights, it's already too late to get to where you need to be.

I have ZERO interest in playing Dark Souls or Elden Ring, but it feels like that's the direction the devs are pushing with these new dungeons. And while I recognize there is a portion of the playerbase that wants that, locking MSQ behind dungeons with that kind of difficulty punishes the rest of us.

I suggest that if these new fast-paced dungeons are indeed the direction Square Enix wishes to go with the game, that they add another difficulty setting to dungeons. By all means, give the hardcore action game folks their twitch reaction difficulty, but also make a normal level for the rest of us. You don't need to remove any mechanics, just increase the reaction time for them. Hell, I'd be happy if at least the NPC groups were altered to fit this, because right now, even the damn NPC's are struggling to keep up!

Agreed on every point. I am the same way.
It is not too difficult. But the way they want me to learn is extremely frustrating and un-enjoyable.

They could have done a much better job.

As well there is no reason to lock themselves behind 1 difficulty setting. Why not just have a story mode? As well. Why not offer extreme/hard right away for those who want it? They are creating all of this discourse over difficulty for no reason. They could make everyone happy at once and they literally choose not to by believing they have to have 1 difficulty for all.

[Alyx-Greywind]

I actually logged in to post because I feel so strongly about this I can't really stay quiet. I've been playing FFXIV for a fair few years now, I consider myself average at best but I'm also a disabled gamer who has built up an FC with a partner I met within the game itself. I've tackled Extremes and tried Savages despite my disabilities and I've pulled my own weight even if I have struggled. I've had my daily roulettes to go to for casual content and it's been fun, running as a Healer I will say I've actually found myself a little bored at times however I've never had a problem because I understood if I wanted more difficult content I have access to it, everyone does outside maybe the most recent Ultimates, Extremes and Savages can be tackled in Party Finder so easily.

Which is why when I was greeted with Dawntrail and it's new difficult curve I gotta say it's pushing me away. I can handle the mechanics after a spot of failure up until the optional dungeon Strayborough Deadwalk. This single Dungeon has exhausted me not only because of it's sheer difficulty spike but because it's uninventing, its unfriendly and downright far too punishing for for casual content. Even if I can get behind the mechanics, even if I get them down and can push through with my disabilities it's so exhausting to play through on a daily basis if I do get it because I don't just have to worry about myself but other new players, other casuals or players with disabilities worse than my own.

What am I met with when I bring up how unfun this content difficulty is? "Use Trusts" "Get Good" "You don't need to do this content lol." even when I do offer actual criticism. This difficulty is misplaced, it's not welcome by quite a number of players, players that are worried that the upcoming Raids will be just as harsh and unforgiving. We've had Extreme and Savage difficulties for so long now, why are we bothering to put this level of difficulty into the casual side of the game? Funny thing is I actually agreed things should be made more difficult, ShB and EW Extremes were easy as it is... but that's where the difficulty should be, not in our daily Expert Dungeons.

Personally I hope this content gets nerfed, I hope it becomes more accessible to more players because if they double down on the difficulty you'll be seeing a lot more casuals drop the game over time.

[Eastwall]

Yes, it is really incentivizing me to deploy my counter measure to ensure l don't have to deal with these dungeon, so l can have a smooth leveling roulette.

[Xurias]

I am posting in agreement to the original poster. I play this game as something to enjoy/relax after work, but starting with the first Trial (Valigarmande I think it was called) and onward anything involving a group has been more frustrating than enjoyable. I've had points where I failed multiple times trying to just get through to enjoy the story. I understand there was an extremely vocal minority that was complaining it was "too easy." I call them a vocal minority because from my experience if you queue up for trials / raids for anything that is Stormblood or later you will see a good number of people wiping to supposedly "too-easy" mechanics, which is an indicator to me difficulty was already high enough. This is not me trying to invalidate the opinion of those who did ask for higher difficulty, but merely using observation from my experiences to determine logical incorrectness in their statement of "too easy."

"Get good" does not always work and is not a valid response in all cases, there are literally past mechanics from older expansions I continue to have problems with even after encountering them at least 20 times, and I don't foresee practice making any difference on these. These are some examples of mechanics I will never be able to "get good" at:

1. Zodiark "Astral Eclipse" from Endwalker.
2. The Neir raid fight with the black and white blocks
3. Ultima the high seraph has some weird off-screen mechanic that kills me and I never see where it comes from.
4. Tower of Zot's Sanduruva, specifically Manusya Confuse. I'm on the autism spectrum, and have some difficulty picking up body language and facial expressions. The differences in the poses are too subtle for me to pick up and process this mechanic. To me they all just look the same. I'm unable to do this mechanic on my own, and have to follow the trust NPC's or follow a player and hope they run to the right spot.

What I ponder is since they seem to have caved into the demand for more difficulty, how much bigger is this red list going to get?

If the difficulty of a dungeon or raid is too easy then at best the "hurt me more" folks go into autopilot mode, and at worst they find it boring and won't like doing that particular raid or dungeon. If the difficulty is too high on the other hand then the "chill" folks will find it makes the game frustrating at best, or if it's an MSQ piece and required it becomes a brick wall at worst and makes the game feel unbeatable, to a point they feel they may as well quit since they cannot progress. The difference here is that in the case of too easy the "hurt me more" folks can finish it and be done with it then eventually move onto their extremes/ultimates where they will be hurt more from mechanics and difficulty. But the "chill" folks hitting a brick wall in MSQ trials/dungeons literally aren't going to complete the game, and quit.

[Conando]

I finally did them (I took my time) and I think, for the most part, they are just fine in terms of "keeping you awake" and engaged. Leonogg is obnoxious and they probably have to do something about those add hitboxes or how long the beheaded status lasts.

[dullneedles]

I'm still beating my head against Vanguard. I've got gimpy hands from a stroke and I've gotten a little better at remembering that the trust members will run out of an AoE at the last possible second which will squash you if you're a step behind but haven't gotten past the second boss before getting booted from the instance. And they're programmed to screw up and just eat the hit in multiple places, so sitting on top of them just kills you immediately

[Supersnow845]

Can I ask what it is about the first boss of Alexandria that people struggle with

If it’s his attack where he puts out 6 doughnuts or cross shaped AOE’s then does either a side or front cleave it’s about understanding his rhythm as only the first and last of the 6 doughnuts/cross shaped matter as they are the ones that will fall inside his potential side cleaves

1) if his first attack is a doughnut it will go off before his side cleave, so stand in the doughnut then immediately move out
2) if his first attack is a cross shaped AOE simply preposition closest to the first doughnut
3) if his last attack is a doughnut the cleave goes off first, preposition for the cleave closest to the doughnut, don’t be afraid to press sprint
4) if the last attack is cross shaped then you are already golden

As for the first boss of strayborough his adds are annoying and the punishment for them is too long but the adds don’t actually hurt that much so don’t be afraid of them

If worse comes to worst you can also do these fights on a tank, the tanks are near immortal so if you get hit by one or two AOE’s you’ll be fine