To the devs, from a Viper fan, with love...

[ItsMeZee]

Originally Posted by Wolf_Heartnet
Hopefully they go further with the changes. Making the job less busy seems to be a step in the right direction.

Respectfully, I disagree. You have the right to an opposing opinion, but I do not share it. Ultimately, I think if more people are saying they like the class as is (and it certainly seems that way, based on the threads im seeing across the last couple of days) it seems kind of mean spirited to cheer for gutting it even more than was already announced, and do so in every thread on the subject.

[Wolf_Heartnet]

Respectfully, I disagree. You have the right to an opposing opinion, but I do not share it. Ultimately, I think if more people are saying they like the class as is (and it certainly seems that way, based on the threads im seeing across the last couple of days) it seems kind of mean spirited to cheer for gutting it even more than was already announced, and do so in every thread on the subject.

Thanks for voicing your concern. I apologize that it seems that way to you but I feel that it's important to voice my opinions just as you feel that its important to voice yours as we both wish opposing things. I have no malicious intent but as I've mentioned in other threads, people who voiced these concerns are the reason the changes were announced in the first place. There is clearly two sides and no real reliable statistic to gauge where people stand as feedback for one side usually comes after an announced change while the opposing side is usually quiet until they are the ones dealing with changes they don't want.

[Arkrayven]

people who voiced these concerns are the reason the changes were announced in the first place. There is clearly two sides

That's another thing about this: nobody, here or on JP forums/Twitter, seems to be aware of who raised these concerns in the first place. The changes seem to have been announced from nowhere, and few to no threads have been created supporting the changes -- they are all negative reactions. So if you could link to any thread you made, or saw, asking for changes after the release of Viper but prior to the announced changes, I'd be incredibly curious to see it.

[Chasingstars]

That's another thing about this: nobody, here or on JP forums/Twitter, seems to be aware of who raised these concerns in the first place. The changes seem to have been announced from nowhere, and few to no threads have been created supporting the changes -- they are all negative reactions. So if you could link to any thread you made, or saw, asking for changes after the release of Viper but prior to the announced changes, I'd be incredibly curious to see it.

Maybe it was some streamer? That or whoever was filing a complaint was doing so through the "leave a suggestion" when directly contacting the devs so it would be harder to trace.

[Wolf_Heartnet]

That's another thing about this: nobody, here or on JP forums/Twitter, seems to be aware of who raised these concerns in the first place. The changes seem to have been announced from nowhere, and few to no threads have been created supporting the changes -- they are all negative reactions. So if you could link to any thread you made, or saw, asking for changes after the release of Viper but prior to the announced changes, I'd be incredibly curious to see it.

My source is https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...6321a515d36909 which I took at face value.

we’ve received feedback pertaining to the busyness of their skill rotation. To that end, we’re planning several improvements,

[Arkrayven]

My source is https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...6321a515d36909 which I took at face value.

Which is not the question I asked; thereby, you confirm that you yourself have seen no actual call for change.

Furthermore, the removal of all positionals from all melee jobs is outside of the scope of Viper changes. It's also not based in any logic in the first place to argue they should get removed, solely because some wall bosses exist. To take your argument one step further, it's like saying that because some bosses favors ranged DPS or casters (see: Eden raids), all melee should be removed.

[Wolf_Heartnet]

Which is not the question I asked; thereby, you confirm that you yourself have seen no actual call for change.

Furthermore, the removal of all positionals from all melee jobs is outside of the scope of Viper changes. It's also not based in any logic in the first place to argue they should get removed, solely because some wall bosses exist. To take your argument one step further, it's like saying that because some bosses favors ranged DPS or casters (see: Eden raids), all melee should be removed.

I apologize, I have taken squares response as a representation of said people. I have went to look for where this feedback is coming from since I assume it was from the japanese forum. I had some trouble since google translate wasnt letting me access some pages. I found a thread and realized that the early comments were before launch and the criticism started sprouting later down the thread. I believe and am not 100% positive that this is the source where square is taking the feedback. Here is the link.
Translate: https://forum-square--enix-com.trans...n&_x_tr_pto=sc
Raw link https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...82%B9%E3%83%AC

I dont fully understand your 2nd poiint you're making here. I believe the logic is sound. If you have positionals as part of your rotation, then all bosses should allow u to get in the correct positions. If it doesnt then it seems pointless to add in the first place. It's not one boss as a special case, theres many bosses like that. Both in easy and hard content.

[wereotter]

I apologize, I have taken squares response as a representation of said people. I have went to look for where this feedback is coming from since I assume it was from the japanese forum. I had some trouble since google translate wasnt letting me access some pages. I found a thread and realized that the early comments were before launch and the criticism started sprouting later down the thread. I believe and am not 100% positive that this is the source where square is taking the feedback. Here is the link.
Translate: https://forum-square--enix-com.trans...n&_x_tr_pto=sc
Raw link https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...82%B9%E3%83%AC

I dont fully understand your 2nd poiint you're making here. I believe the logic is sound. If you have positionals as part of your rotation, then all bosses should allow u to get in the correct positions. If it doesnt then it seems pointless to add in the first place. It's not one boss as a special case, theres many bosses like that. Both in easy and hard content.

While this might be what they're going off of (and this isn't meant to argue your position, though I'll say for the record, I'm also in the camp of leaving viper as it is) the JP player base commenting here seems to be encountering the same steep learning curve everyone I've talked to about the job did on day 1 as well as are voicing the stumbling block that the same hot bar spot changes between being a button you press sometimes one the rear of a boss and sometimes on the flank. But it doesn't look like they're asking for those position requirements to be removed, but instead possibly for the buttons to be adjusted in such a way that buttons remain consistent as to if you press them for rear or flank.

As to your other comment... I'll say this as someone who was maining monk since well before truth north existed in the game. It's better to take a potency loss and keep your GDC rolling than to get frustrated because you lost potency due to not hitting from the correct position. This was something monks had to do with some regularity in the Alexander raids as if you didn't keep your attacks going, you'd lose your greased lightning buffs. Sometimes you simply can't hit the position. Sometimes its because a tank is holding a boss with just its nose sticking outside of the poo puddles, sometimes its because they're tanking them in the wall, sometimes its because of where you have to stand to do a mechanic (P11S had this problem for melee jobs) So you take the hit to your potency when the game forces it on you and don't stress it. Only saying this because it sounds like you're having the mentality that if you can't perform the job optimally then the job shouldn't make the ask of you at all, when in reality you simply do your best, and if the game forces you to not be able to do that 100% of the time, you do what you can the rest of it.