The Negative Impact of Poor Character Writing on the Quality of Dawntrail's MSQ

[Palladiamors]

You know, this is a question I've had for awhile. Is the rubber bullets a localization thing or was it close to the Japanese? Because it's so strange to have a lawless western setting and settle disputes with rubber bullets.

That's what we're focusing on? Not the fact that laws be damned, if you take a rubber bullet your guilty because the accuser said so?

[Ath192]

That's what we're focusing on? Not the fact that laws be damned, if you take a rubber bullet your guilty because the accuser said so?

Yes, might makes right, trial by combat, duels, these all existed IRL. You know what didn't exist? Settling these affairs with fake weapons/ammo.

And it's a video game of all places, like what the hell. The setting and story aren't real, why compound it with fake ammo as well.

[SirShady]

Yes, might makes right, trial by combat, duels, these all existed IRL. You know what didn't exist? Settling these affairs with fake weapons/ammo.

And it's a video game of all places, like what the hell. The setting and story aren't real, why compound it with fake ammo as well.

There's gonna be a wild west showdown? Don't worry, they're using rubber bullets.

Racing to get to get all the keystones before the other claimants? Nah. Everyone has to wait for each other to do a taco making contest.

Valigarmanda, a world ending beast, is unleashed from its prison? Dead and dealt within 5 minutes before anyone dies.

Tulliyolal is under attack by a massive unknown force? Some nameless civilians die and the invading force leave for no explicable reason.

Those same forces come back and attack the small settlements? Driven back by Estinien and a small group of cowboys with guns. Everyone is fine.

The queen of the invaders who admitted she allowed the attack on our people is right in front of us? Let's have her teach us how they grow their crops.

We've entered a sci-fi hellscape where Erenville's village and mom were taken and subjugated for 30 years? Everyone in the village apparently was fine with this, and Erenville's mom is a silly cute robot now.

Zoraal Ja could easily send another invasion force to attack our people? I'm sure it will be fine. Let's go grab snacks with Sphene.

Sphene is about to go on a killing spree through the shards? We've got time. Let's go eat popcorn and ice cream for a bit.

We're supposed to delete the Endless, a mass of people we're told are simulacrum who can't feel sadness and lose their bad memories, for no discernable reason? Don't worry, the one that can feel sadness with all her memories in tact says they're just AI. Just genocide em. A 5 minute explanation is all the convincing I need.

We've left Alexandria with no ruler and upset their way of life? The evil dictator who just killed his own people has a spare 5 year old son lying around. Let's have the person who just killed their queen install him as their new ruler. Oh, and the soul harvesting place it still open. They're chilling.

God forbid a story have stakes or any sense of logic or tone.

[Rannie]

I'm almost to the point of saying Bella Swan was a better character than Wuk Lamat... I feel dirty just for typing this out ...

[MatthiusAbysswalker]

All characters we're done dirty in this expansion. Wuk was a poorly written, poorly acted main character, the WoL was an emotional support puppy who did nothing but nod, and the scions may as well have not been involved at all.

[Donze]

I have said this before, starting around lvl 95 MSQ, and now that I am 3 quests from done, i'll say it again, as it has become more and more evident; this feels written for children by someone untested.

I would be happy to list many examples, but the short of it is that the situations and the dialogue are constantly contradicting each other. Being told 'your happy now' when things are sad, being told "ive talked long enough!" when the voiced NPC literally said 2 short things that spanned about 9-12 seconds; even the fact that in the last 8 quests of MSQ, you're doing goofy hijinks dressed up as a mascot. The 2nd half of the story is a horror story to me (by which I mean I find what the bubble and solution 9 et al is horrific and cruel to the people). After all, we just finished Endwalker which spent its expansion and the last 10 years building up to the point where Happiness and Sadness go hand in hand, Venat sundered the damn word rather than people discarding sorrow. Yet, here we are again, so I can understand why some feel the story gets boring.

I dislike that the WoL responses are so forced here, that all these obvious queues are being ignored (I stopped counting after 6 the number of time Erenville gives a somber look and balls a fist or puts his fist to his chin in thought and discomfort over a certain something in the 2nd half). Instead, WoL is forced to respond in the positive about the state of the last zone, despite knowing FULL WELL that its wrong, and that bringing back the ones you loved at the expense of those still alive is the ENTIRE plan (the Ardor) of the Ascians that we have been fighting against for the last 10 years, and just wrapped up. Why the WoL responses seem devoid of WoL's experiences from ARR to Endwalker, meaning that he is hopelessly fun loving and positive about a situations he has first hand knowledge as being wrong, wishful thinking, only makes sense when I suppose this was written for children with memory issues.

I plan to play the MSQ a 2nd time on an alt thats ready to go, and revisit many of my notes and hopefully provide SE with some constructive feedback in places where maybe it just a bad localization thing, but on first wag, I like the story over all, just the pacing if crazy off sometimes and on point others, and the dialogue... dear god.

[Dariy]

I loved Endwalker and Shadowbriners story, but this... this is just depressing. Haven't finished story yet, but my main gripe is that story treats players like 6 year olds. Every single thing is explained to you in great detail. Like at one moment before first trial Alisaie was saying "Even people with wildly different ideals can find understanding through earnest discussion. I believe that wholeheartedly". This sounds like a corporate statement. No Sass, no character, nothing. Listening to this feels like munching dry and moldy bread. And all MSQ is like that. Characters are one (or even zero) dimensional. New races are bland and uninspired and basically have one defining trait and that's all. World building is lazy.

Yes, dungeons and trials are good. Yes graphics update is excellent. Yes, locations look pretty. Yes, new job gear is awesome, but what's the point if you want to unlearn how to read and perform self-assisted lobotomy just to not experience the story.

[Tethan]

This! My mother died quite recently so this hit me on a personal level. I felt like the WOL (and everyone else too, for that matter) was a complete failure as a friend for not trying to comfort him. It felt awful to not be able to do that.

I've lost all my grandparents (several of them to dementia/alzheimer's so I have some thoughts on whether or not memory is what makes a person), I lost my dad to cancer a few years ago, a friend of mine passed away suddenly just a few months ago, he was around my age, left behind his wife and little son. I found the final zone deeply insulting, as an exploration of grief it was nonsensical and wholly inadequate. Grief is such a powerful, scary and sometimes ugly thing. It's not something you can just handwave away. Everything in the final zone just said "yeah it's sad but it's natural so get over it". Erenville was the only one who reacted somewhat naturally to what was going on, but it felt like the game wanted to dismiss or chide his reaction, rather than actually explore it and as soon as it's done he is just fine again? That's not how it works.

[PaleYonder]

I can't agree enough with everything said above.
People who don't understand criticism of the main quest often seem to think we're upset about this being a different genre from before, or story type. But this isn't a case of "Was promised light-hearted adventures in the sun, got light-hearted adventures in the sun, unsubscribed." The game has switched genres and plot types and tones in the past, and it was fine. People had different favourites and less favoured sections, according to taste and some quality fluctuations, but that was very different. There was always a standard it didn't drop below, there was always something to like.
Previous writers got us used to a certain narrative and at times artistic quality, and that's what the game is rightfully measured by.

I would have been fine with the light-hearted adventures in the sun or else why would I even have given this expansion a chance in the first place? As long as it was good. As many have said, this is neither those adventures nor good.
And conversely, this drastic drop in quality in the writing itself would have doomed my absolute favourites too, and I'd have been no less unhappy if someone had tried to write Heavensward or Shadowbringers this way.

[Bunyon]

I didn't skip any of the story but I may have skimmed through some parts out of boredom, so I would like to ask: did Krile even matter at all this expansion?

I don't remember her doing anything significant in the first half, then we discover she came from the city of gold and the one thing that leads into is her earring, which isn't used at all until the VERY END and even then doesn't immediately open the door since the baby is the one that has to do it. Did she do anything significant at all in any part of expansion? I mean, we meet her parents for 30 minutes and we learn a bit about another dead shard, but all that information is on terminals so even if we didn't have Krile we'd get that information anyway.