Physical Ranged (Also SMN) "Freedom of Movement" Tax

[Corwin_Sunchaser]

But as soon as you mention flattening the damage output all across the board, casters and melees start to freak out real bad somehow.

Should we care? I mean, I've been refected from PF groups by green parsers BeCAUse McH Iz NoT CoMPetiTiVe!!!...

[Shiroe]

wait, Snm (the summoner of BAHAMUT) is the lowest dps of the whole game atm?? (aside of Dnc, the support god)

[Shiroe]

(can't edit on my mobile, sorry)
...
Dnc & Smn were the most played (dps) jobs in EW, so to get players off of them, they got nerfed the most?? (& ofc the new jobs got buffed the most, .. same reason, to get more players invested in them)

[LilyPendragon]

wait, Snm (the summoner of BAHAMUT) is the lowest dps of the whole game atm?? (aside of Dnc, the support god)

If the image I saw earlier is anything to go by, no SMN is not the lowest. Dancer still is, closely followed by... Black Mage. With SMN in third. (Which IMO is fine because SMN is the easiest job by a massive margin). One of the (now) only two jobs that should be competing with Samurai for damage (BLM and VPR), is currently only just beating out dancer, and competing with Summoner lol

[CrystalAurora]

If the image I saw earlier is anything to go by, no SMN is not the lowest. Dancer still is, closely followed by... Black Mage. With SMN in third. (Which IMO is fine because SMN is the easiest job by a massive margin). One of the (now) only two jobs that should be competing with Samurai for damage (BLM and VPR), is currently only just beating out dancer, and competing with Summoner lol

That's only taking all percentiles into account which means runs included in which people are playing poorly, have low gear, and deaths. The game should never be balanced around people who aren't performing.

Now obviously BLM is under tuned at the moment but its not worse than RDM, BRD, SMN, DNC and MCH in terms of total group damage contribution.

I will always disagree with the notion that because your class is viewed as 'Easy' it should do less damage in an MMO where its not particularly hard to play any job at a high level.

This just seems like once again, people just having an ego that if they are playing a 'hard' job they deserve to do more damage.

Personal damage should be based around how strong a classes raid buff is with some but not overly exaggerated consideration to have much utility they have when it comes to mitigation and other factors.

If the personal damage at the top aren't the 4 DPS classes with no raid buffs being SAM, BLM, VPR and MCH then there is no reason for MCH to have the fantasy of being a pure DPS with no raid buff.

As far as SMN is concerned there is no reason for the job to even exist if its going to be punished with low damage because it has a raise and its 'Easy' when RDM does more damage, has raid wide mitigation utility and an easily accessible raise if you're deciding to balance in this manner.

[elioaiko]

Phys. Ranged lost their "support" back in ShB when the devs decided that aggro and assisting in team MP recovery wasn't good enough to keep.

Phys. Ranged just has the unfortunate problem of being free of range limit and no cast time so the devs use this as an excuse to keep them below everyone else on the dps spectrum.

Until the devs add back some complexity to the combat system, everyone is just a dps.

[Connor]

Phys. Ranged lost their "support" back in ShB when the devs decided that aggro and assisting in team MP recovery wasn't good enough to keep.

Phys. Ranged just has the unfortunate problem of being free of range limit and no cast time so the devs use this as an excuse to keep them below everyone else on the dps spectrum.

Until the devs add back some complexity to the combat system, everyone is just a dps.

Honestly it’s weird to me they don’t see the contradiction in this. They label jobs like ‘Bard’ and ‘Dancer’ as support-oriented, remove practically all support outside of the most basic damage/mitigation/healing up, then wonder why people complain about how low their dps is.

And I feel like their ‘phys ranged need to suck cuz mobility’ argument falls apart the moment you look at Summoner.

Definitely agree with the last part; until they do something to ‘spice up’ and diversify the combat system, physical ranged are always going to sit where they are now as the ‘bringing it for the party role bonus and not the merits of the job/role itself’.

It’s similar to the way healers suffer from how ‘septic’ the battle system has become. They don’t have anything to heal, but they have literally no way to actively support the party, so they end up just spamming the single DPS button over and over because there’s little else to do.

Obviously healers have it worse but at the same time it’s a similar issue. They can’t do their main role because of some arbitrary excuse the developers have made (healing / having competitive dps), but they can’t do the ‘extra things’ they’re supposed to bring either (i.e healers dps’ing, phys ranged providing support/utility).

[ForteNightshade]

If the image I saw earlier is anything to go by, no SMN is not the lowest. Dancer still is, closely followed by... Black Mage. With SMN in third. (Which IMO is fine because SMN is the easiest job by a massive margin). One of the (now) only two jobs that should be competing with Samurai for damage (BLM and VPR), is currently only just beating out dancer, and competing with Summoner lol

For reference sake, when comparing jobs, you should always change the "All Percentiles" tab to 90-95%. This fives you a far more accurate display of each job's theatrical output. Like Crystal said, they shouldn't ever balance around the lower half since that would include significant rotational mistakes or straight up dying to mechanics.

cDPS is probably the best metric for comparing jobs, especially selfish to buff. With that in mind, SMN very narrowly pulls ahead of MCH (we're talking like 200 dps). Which is downright comical for both jobs. Picto absolutely bodies SMN to a hysterical degree, and RDM has the superior support while also dealing higher damage. In other words, BLM and SMN are in a very rough state. Likewise, MCH has very little relevance getting outpaced by Bard the way it is. Granted, it's only by 400 dps not 3,000 like a certain Caster but it's still noticeable. DNC is a little wonky to compare since cDPS doesn't include single target padding, i.e. Devilment / Standard Finish.

[CKNovel]

And I feel like their ‘phys ranged need to suck cuz mobility’ argument falls apart the moment you look at Summoner.

Viper has 3 ranged GCDs that are a DPS gain, since you don't use them during burst, you're free to use them for movement.
Reaper has a similar ability with Harvest Moon that allows the RPR to maintain uptime.
BLM will probably be buffed to regain its EW spot, but the job kept getting more and more mobility.
Bosses massive hitbox and are designed for permanent melee uptime.
Last time a content actually forced Melee to disconnect, it was in ShB the casters were shining and the ranged remained at the bottom.

We've been in the ranged tax for 5 years now, it never shown itself to be necessary in any shape or form.
It makes sense for healer and tanks as they're filling multiple role, but not for ranged, especially MCH which main purpose is to be a DPS.

[Shiroe]

dunno about that chart.., as Blm is harder to learrn, so incl. lower % can have the blm higher (and Smn parser are obscureed in lower % too, as they waste dps on rezes.., on 90+ the Smn likely didn't evet have to rez, otherwise it would be lower)
...
use a 90-95% chart