Please don't change Viper

[Henber]

I absolutely agree. The job isn't out for an entire week yet. Simplifying it to make it more popular is not the right way to go.
It's really sad to see such an overreaction for something that hasn't been out for even a whole week yet.
This job anxiety feels like a lack a vision and a want for acceptance from the Square Enix team.
As a passionate Viper player, I beg of you to change your minds.

[Nary]

Say Viper is hard, i laugh so hard!
So many other job was more difficult.
I was really impress to see a job (VIP) really easy to play, more easy then SAM and RPR
It's really funny, they can't know the old MNK or AST how hard it was to play (placement or what all the card do)

RING THE BELL !

[Hyperleo]

Please don't take my positionals again, they made me love Monk in ARR; and this is enough for me to have fun again.

[ValStormbreaker]

I'm going to hard agree with this. I quit the game back in 5.4 over the MNK simplification, when all of us were asking for MNK to go back to the way it was back in 4.4 with some streamlining and improvements since before 5.0 when some of us had the opportunity to play preview versions of the job at media events. It wasn't "fixed" until the end of the patch, and by "fixed" I mean outright neutered. I ONLY came back to see the MNK changes (it's in the worst shape that it has ever been in), and tried Viper on a whim. I had no problem quitting the game for Guild Wars 2 because the combat system has been mauled into oblivion.

Viper is literally a streamlined tornado-kicking MNK in scouting gear, with the wishlist of what we asked for since Stormblood; the demolish and snap punch combos consolidated to one hotbar button each to make room for more moves without taking anything away, unshackling it from Samurai with a different gear set, a greased lightning gauge with a guaranteed way of getting stacks up instantly (serpent's ire > anatman) and not tied to speed and power buffs, a chakra gauge not tied to RNG (no melee DPS should have random chance on a resource gauge), a Dolphin Flurry combo, a better and less boring AoE kit, a projectile that doesn't cost an all-or-nothing resource to use, and a version of tornado kick that isn't just a stack dumper (and hey, even has more oGCD weaving!).

Even then, it's too simple, and is pretty much "baby's first double-weaving oGCDs tutorial," but it's the closest thing we have to our main job since that was ruined. If they remove anything from it, I have no problem leaving the game again, review-bombing the hell out of Dawntrail and going straight to Guild Wars 2. I'm ONLY back because of Viper. Story jumped off a cliff lore-wise and Viper's current gameplay is the only reason I bother logging in now.

As much as I laughed at the entitlement of the "Healer Strike," considering how much the devs did not learn from people complaining that simplification is bad and they need to reverse course, I'm considering we need a DPS strike. In the meantime, I hope Viper-lovers start apologizing to us Stormblood MNKs because in spite of having a lot of buttons, it was pretty much this simple, though required a bit of executive decision-making that kept the job a bit more engaging. Now, we have hand-holding mechanics for people who don't want to learn, and this just makes people avoid learning more.

Leave Viper alone. Monk needs to be brought back to what Viper currently is, at the least!

[HaruMitsuru]

I've never even logged in here in the official forum, but I had to now because I just saw these changes.

Viper is great as it is, I wanted a job like this since the beggining of this game, please do not change anything. Never have I had so much fun with a job in this game.

[Ranpuff]

I literally registered my forum account just now after playing this game for 10+ years to add my voice to this. I just hit 100 Viper today and I LOVE how it plays, there's absolutely no reason at all to simplify it.

Please do not change Viper, at least not without giving the playerbase considerably more time to become familiar with the job.

[Idkidc1233]

I don't post on forums or on Twitter at all, but the Viper changes are really disappointing, so I had to register my forum account after a couple years of playing to post this. I really hope we end up not seeing them. I agree with everything here in this thread and all the other threads that do not like the changes.

Viper is not that hard to position. You have two standard abilities that you will have to position often, big whoop welcome to melee classes. The Dreadwinder can be combo'd with True North 9/10 times, and every now and then you may have to do it without due to the 5 second difference that can cause drifts.

I don't mean anything rude by saying this, but if you can't position well on Viper and have to complain about it, you probably shouldn't be playing Viper in the first place. Either don't play it, or hush up and go practice some more with it.

[Kalaam]

Removing the positional on the dread skills I understand, you've got a single GCD of time to move into position each time etc (tho i guess True North is there for that)
But otherwise, please don't simplify it, it's fine. It's interresting to play.

[ValStormbreaker]

Old MNK was never hard. Viper is literally just that with some of the 3-hit combos consolidated to fewer buttons to make room for newer moves and a better AoE combo, plus a lot of the wish-list items that MNK mains wanted (no RNG on the 5 chakra stacks, making greased lightning not an all-or-nothing resource and not tied to ramping up speed or power, etc.). It's the reason why so many old-school MNK mains love it so much; it's the closest thing we have to a return to what MNK should have been.

Us MNK mains require an apology from the people who understand Viper, because MNK was the first melee job to be simplified into the ground and basically paved the way for the current state of melee jobs as people at the time thought it was "too hard,".
Nothing, and I mean NOTHING in this game is difficult. It's "baby's first MMORPG,". But some people are loud and effort-averse, and don't want to have to learn anything, which makes the rest of the game boring for everyone else.

We tried to warn you that the people who advocate for simplifying jobs in the name of "trying something out" never stick with the job anyway, which just ruins it for the people who were maining it at the time and had no problems with it. We tried to warn you that this would happen game-wide if you allowed the precedent in the name of "accessibility,". I'm a disabled player (have nerve damage in my right hand and am forced to play all games with a controller) and I could still do it, and everything else in the game was too boring for me. I do NOT want it dumbed down further. The number of skills being "overwhelming" to the smooth-brained is not an excuse for players to not sit down with it, read the tool tips, try things out on a dummy and figure it out. I didn't read or watch a guide to learn Viper, I sat on the striking dummy, messed around with some moves and FIGURED IT OUT, then rearranged my hotbars for comfort and now it's even a bit TOO simple for me.

The game is a terrible teacher, and the tool tips and jargon definitely need some culling and reorganizing, but the job itself - once you sit down and figure it out - is perfectly fine, if not a bit too easy. The same goes for 4.4 MNK. Not difficult, but people don't understand good hotbarring practices or how to do their positionals properly, so they whine that it's too hard for them because they don't want to think or learn. Standing in one spot until the combo ender says it's time to take a step to the left or right isn't complicated. Literally "take a step to the left and do 3 moves, take a step to the right and do 3 moves,". Too many SAM/DRG players who don't get how to straddle the SE/SW intercardinal and make egregious 90-degree rotations around the hitbox whining about mechanics they don't understand. Us ex-MNK mains know what's up.

[fireroy777]

Agreed wholeheartedly, seeing that paragraph made my heart sink. I already love this job and dedicated to maining it for the expac, I really hope they walk this idea back. I haven't even seen anyone say what they're mentioning are the "problems" with it.