Unpopular Opnion: Dawntrail MSQ one of the best yet! [Spoilers]

[Xil-Ventus]

Dawntrail was absolutely wonderful and well written but I've seen so much negativity around it and it makes me a bit sad.

People who have made up their minds won't be swayed and that isn't the point of this post, but I wanted to address the main complaints I have seen and give people who liked the story a place to set up shop...

This contains spoilers for the entire story. Stop reading now if you want to remain unspoiled.

Most points are taken from https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/502794, steam reviews, and other forum posts.

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Learning about new cultures is unimaginative and superficial

It takes more than just meeting with the people of an area and eating their food to understand the culture.



While this is true to a degree, the main point the story was trying to make is you have to START THERE at least or else you won't learn anything about anyone.

Most people in the real world won't even give others a chance because of that surface-level difference, but if you break the ice and try something out of your comfort zone you may come to appreciate things you never thought you would.

Up until now in the story, almost every single main antagonist wouldn't have existed, had they stepped back and taken the time to learn about the people they were subjugating, what those cultures wanted, and why they did the things they did. (Notwithstanding Zenos because he's just insane and we love him for it)

There are tons of people in our real world who won't even give other cultures' ideas or traditions a second thought before criticizing or discounting them and this point is worth driving home.

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The right of succession was mostly pointless and dragged out

Each right was meant to bolster the claimants' shortcomings and ensure the next ruler would lead like Gulool Ja Ja led while ensuring anyone not fit to lead, wouldn't.



Koana wanted to help everyone through technological advances but wanted to do it at the cost of discounting cultures simply because some practices were 'inefficient' or didn't make sense to him.

Bakool Ja Ja wanted to win at all costs because of the guilt placed on them by their parents for the many sacrifices they had to make to create them. They had nothing else on their mind and decided they would do anything to win as fast as they could.

Zoraal Ja is an extremely well-written character, and I can't abridge his motives here without writing a few paragraphs, but it boils down to the unfair expectations put on him by others and his inability to empathy. In my mind, he is the embodiment of toxic masculinity to some extent.

Wuk Lamat was understanding of the cultures when they got down into it but would have never done so on their own. Though they had a winning personality, and I can't see them failing to listen to the people even if they didn't take the time to learn the cultures, they started the story as the physically weakest and would have easily been overthrown as they were countless times early on during the competition.

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Wuk Lamat is obnoxious and/or isn't fit to lead

Wuk Lamat is an extremely nice change of pace in a world previously filled with characters who were nice until it was inconvenient for them.



The problem that normally exists with these kinds of 'goody too shoe characters' is that they can usually solve EVERY SINGLE PROBLEM by just talking it out or being nice, the story writers made it the entire point of Dawntrail to contradict this with Sphene's ideology which represents how twisted this can become when taken to the extreme.

Having Wuk Lamat solve their problems, in their way, without extreme intervention from the Scions until the very end was a breath of fresh air. The Scions, by themselves, would have handled the situation much differently (worse) had they not been with Wuk Lumat and I believe that is a major point of the story.

Wuk Lamat was the only one outside of Koana who made up for their shortcomings and took their people's opinions into account. Yes, they have their flaws, but they are the closest thing to Gulool Ja Ja by the end of the succession right and by far the most qualified to lead.

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Story is a repeat of Elpis or Amaurot and the Endless are unoriginal

The story of Dawntrail and Sphene isn't less compelling because of the Ascian's story but is more compelling because of it.



The Final Days started because people across the universe suffered from despair and suffering. Meteion decided that there was no hope, no possible way for people to be truly happy and deemed total annihilation as a more humane solution.

The Alexandrians created a solution the Ascians never comprehended, one that eliminates despair from their people but doesn't make life so boring you create a golden beast to end it all.

It came at a cost of course, but only due to their limitations. Had the Ascians, with their near-unlimited manipulation of Aether, been able to do what Sphene did, they probably would have never shattered.

Sphene was much harder to discount than the Ascians. The Ascians brought about their downfall and had every chance to succeed. Sphene's shard was forced into chaos by elements outside of their control, and they snatched victory from the jaws of defeat despite that, all while unifying their people every step of the way.

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Where is the dark side of memory manipulation?

The point of the story is that Sphene created a near-perfect world that the audience would find difficult to fault.



If you paint your antagonist's entire reason for doing what they are doing because they want to help their people and then add in story beats where they are purposely hurting them by manipulating their memories, you have just undermined your antagonist's entire ideology.

If there was ever this type of memory manipulation from Alexandria's past, Sphene surely would have eliminated it early on.

Mentioned primarily in: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/502794

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Bakool Jaja flips from bad to good real quick



Bakool Ja Ja should have gotten a bit more screen time and depth after the change of heart sequence, but the quick turnaround makes a ton of sense in what was delivered to the audience.

Bakool Ja Ja's only driving force behind their behaviour was the pressure from their community and the guilt of being born from countless children's sacrifices.

Imagine yourself as Bakool Ja Ja, and then someone comes along and does something you never did. Talk with your people and figure out what the problem is, focus all efforts and solve that particular problem without hurting others.

The story establishes Bakool Ja Ja is embarrassed, feels guilty and idiotic for what they did, which means they are not a total monster. This leaves them with two logical options. Give up entirely or start immediately atoning.

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Long cutscenes, no combat, bad pacing

People can queue into combat whenever they want, after or in between story beats, but the story is limited, it's something you can't go out and get whenever you want. It deserves to be as lengthy as it needs to be.

Other expansions have a very slow buildup, lots of talking and running around and not a lot happening. Dawntrail drops you right into the action with the right of succession and keeps the heat on the entire time, with a slight slowdown before the final act for setup.

Final Fantasy is about the story and always has been. For those who don't care for the story aspect and only care about raiding or PvP, they have the option to skip through everything.

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The last zone is just playtime padding

The final area's pacing is established when we are told that we have a good amount of time to complete other tasks before we have to worry about the final confrontation. For once the WoL is given a bit of a reprieve where we aren't rushing from place to place and can smell the roses before we snuff them out.

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The WoL has no Agency

The WoL has never had agency. We never could control the outcome of events outside of what was scripted for us. We have only ever had the illusion of choice, as is traditional and possible in MMORPGs.

Regardless of what dialogue options you choose throughout all of FFXIV, you will have the nearly same experience as every other WoL minus a few lines of dialogue.

This isn't a fault of FFXIV per se, but a limitation that currently exists with MMOs in general.

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Party Dynamics are weak

For the first time in a very long time, we get an NPC with personality, goals, dreams and wants that isn't a Scion. We get the Scions get along and jive, but anyone but the Scions rarely spends an extended amount of time with the WoL.

Dawntrail also gives us the first friendly competition between Scions and it's done exceedingly well. I can clearly remember cursing Thancred blocking our path in one of the dungeons. I hope to see more friend co-opetition between friends in future expansions.


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The story treats us like children

Dawntrail stands out as the most emotionally resonant expansion in a long time, skillfully crafted for a mature audience.

Excessive exposition would have felt heavy-handed, insulting our intelligence. Conversely, too little exposition would have hindered our empathy for the characters.

Dawntrail rewards attentive players with emotional intelligence, offering a refreshing experience that respects its audience's maturity.

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Conclusion

Dawntrail is narratively unique, and exceedingly well done. Like previous expansions, it takes our expectations of what a story and characters should be and blows them out of the water, delivering us a stellar experience that is unexpected, heartfelt, emotionally complicated and thought provoking.

I am excited to see more and hope they continue on their current path.

[sindriiisgaming]

Sadly much like the anti healer strike thread those people will simply come here and spam there negativity in an attempt to drown out different opinions. I will say. The picture you show is where in the msq I am. And I am not enjoying it. But posts like yours keep me excited that it might get better

[Malthir]

The story is literally a re tread of stormblood but done infinitely worse, Wuk Lamat is a character that has no growth because she isn't allowed to grow, she acts like a childish moron and never changes because almost everyone around her is constantly singing her praises. The pacing is so slow and constantly telling you not showing you what's happening. Then there's the terrible dialogue where people literally have to keep saying thinks like, wow Wuk Lamat really did well there when she basically just didn't fall flat on her face, again to my previous point. I would be fine with Wuk if they actually had her develop but they don't, she starts like an irritation teen then continues as an irrational teen but is forced upon the plot as if she has had any kind of development. Then there is the second arc, Sphene is literally Emmet without the build up, it's the exact same plotline and theme just told worse because we have no functional attachment to her or her people, there's no reason to care or really any build up to a pay off. Sphene should have vanished after she gave her there can be no peace speech. They should have ended the MSQ there setting her up to be a threat, taking all the soul robots and ships with her. We then have a, where could she have gone what's she planning plot to work from. For the expac that's supposed to be building the future story it doesn't build anything. It basically just does a worse copy/mash up of other plots and then instantly resolves itself so we're basically back to square 1 with no more storyline except we have a magical mcguffin.

Let me be clear I'm not dragging it for the sake of dragging it, the writer is just not very skilled.

[HighlanderClone]

I'll read this and respond when I'm on a flight.

[Shaedhen]

Dawntrail stands out as the most emotionally resonant expansion in a long time, skillfully crafted for a mature audience.

Excessive exposition would have felt heavy-handed, insulting our intelligence. Conversely, too little exposition would have hindered our empathy for the characters.

Dawntrail rewards attentive players with emotional intelligence, offering a refreshing experience that respects its audience's maturity.

Please tell me this is satire.

[AddictedToWitches]

You can enjoy something and acknowledge it's mediocrity
You can dislike something and acknowledge that it's good.

[SirShady]

Sadly much like the anti healer strike thread those people will simply come here and spam there negativity in an attempt to drown out different opinions. I will say. The picture you show is where in the msq I am. And I am not enjoying it. But posts like yours keep me excited that it might get better

Yes, and dismissing others opinions as "spam" because they're negative offers a lot to the conversation. Definitely not just an attempt to "drown out different opinions". Pot, meet kettle.

I heavily disagree with almost every point but I'll have to post another time. I am glad you've enjoyed your time with it! I sure wish I had!

[Sorimachi87]

It. Is. A. Fresh. Start. To. A. New. Story.

I can speak only for the german language but the VAs have all done an amazing job of voiceing the NPCs and friends we accompanied along the way in MSQ. While power of friendship is a turnoff for many people, i can see that. Nevertheless people need to realize were we would be without the aid we had in the adventure so far. Yes, no longer alive at this point.
Yeah Story had a few headscratchers i admit that, but overall i really liked the story and now its involvement of the different cultures happend.

I don't dismiss the negativity here as it does have its place to a certain degree, but lately the forums really came down to a negative hellhole, which is really sad to me. The devs are putting us on the path of a new story and i am excited to see where it goes.

Lets have fun and before i get marked as a whiteknight... i vanish *pop*

[koko-on-da-forumz]

It. Is. A. Fresh. Start. To. A. New. Story.

It opened exactly one new thread, and it's one that we've kind of known about in the world for the past six irl years.

This counter really annoys me because every single story except Endwalker was brand new, and Endwalker was just a sequel to Shadowbringers.

The only real continuity between ARR-HW-SB was Garlemald, and they were present in extremely different capacities in each. They had to rewrite Ascian lore to make Shadowbringers work and that was the only thing that was carried over. It's all new and fresh every single time. That's not an excuse to poop the bed.

[FemmeFatale]

Dawntrail is narratively unique

The only true statement in this entire post.

The rest reads like an automatically generated review from ChatGPT with the prompt ''Positive Dawntrail Review but Hyper Exaggerated''