Dawntrail's MSQ story is a disaster and waste of potential. [full spoilers]

**Malthir** · 07-07-2024 01:23 AM

Originally Posted by McGrump

Story
Concepts, solutions, philosophies, everything is on the surface in this expansion. We see no resistance with any of the races when we encounter a problem. They accept change without a second thought. remember how it was a challenge for the Ishgardian people to accept the dragons? Now, everything is solved in 2 minutes, which is also something that I noticed in the post endwalker MSQ. We conveniently find a portal that was guarded by Vishap's device, we conveniently have those gem thingies to go in the void world without being affected by the void, we don't get swarmed by voidsends when we get there, we conveniently find a way to fix the inbalancement of the void, we conveniently find a way to fix the First. It's the same here. Like everything can be solved so easily, right? RIGHT?! It just made stop caring for the lack of stakes.

You hit the nail on the head here imo. The biggest issue with the expac other than Wuk is the constant resolving of plot threads before they really get the chance to develop. So you as the player just end up not caring, making a poorly paced story even worse.

I personally would have preferred if they never resolved the throne contest, never defeated Sphene, had her leave with all her forces so she's a potential future threat. Give us some actual story to develop into.

**genuine_stranger** · 07-07-2024 08:07 AM

Dear players,

We appreciate your feedback and will continue working diligently on the future of your favorite MMORPG Final Fantasy XIV and craft even more fantastic stories like in the new expansion, Dawntrail. Please look forward to it.
Meanwhile, please visit our online store where you can find fantastic outfits, mounts and other miscellany items of our highly regarded designers.
We appreciate your additional support.

Kind regards,

potential SE representative or whatever.

**Zabuza** · 07-07-2024 08:22 AM

The devs really do think their players are children. Now the storytelling has gone down to child level. It's frustratingly disrespectful. At several points in the story I just had to sit back and either laugh or stew in my frustration at the storytelling.

1. Zoraal Ja represents what the OP was referring to. Wasted potential. The writers did a terrible job making us sympathize with or relate with him if that was their intent. Waited until the very end to attempt to make him something other than a one-dimensional villain. Unfortunately, by then, it was too late. Was his son supposed to make me relate with him in some way? But his son is not explained whatsoever. He just pops up randomly out of nowhere. I just chalked it up to he had a one night's stand with someone and that was the result. We're told his father spurned him but shown nothing which would indicate he was mistreated. Either commit to making him a one-dimensional villain or make a decent showing of why this character deserves my understanding. The whole theme of feeling alienated because people shower endless praise upon you is very real, but the only indication we get of this is in the middle of our trial fight with him. His character could have been interesting but was executed very poorly and any crumb that would help us understand him came far too late to leave an impact.

2. Wuk Lumat's character is inconsistent. She is willing to go so far to understand cultures as to still try to befriend a hostile giant trying to kill her. Yet when it comes to her own brother Zoraal Ja she immediately comes to the conclusion that he must be killed. We're never shown that in the past she tried to reach out to him, either. So she cares about random strangers more than her own brother? And how lucky for her that the stars always align wherever she walks. She doesn't have to change her approach no matter what culture she deals with because love and peace beyond logic always prevails. If they don't agree with the love and peace, they are eliminated. There is no alternate solution or middle ground. And somehow she's able to defeat Bakool Ja Ja in 1v1 combat while he used to swat her away like a fly. Not only does she defeat him in a duel, but also wins with all his henchman assisting him at the same time! And the reason is... the power of friendship? Very reminiscent of a children's anime. Sad. Also, how convenient that when a giant wants to kill her, a bird attacks one of his kin so she can step in and save him. Wouldn't want to have to explore a complex solution to a complex problem. What a forced and contrived plot occurrence.

3. Sphene should have been given more screentime. Some compare her to Emet-Selch and yes, I can see the similarity in motivations, but Emet-Selch was introduced in the Stormblood patch quests before he became the main attraction in Shadowbringers. In Shadowbringers, he'd often pop in and give commentary. Sphene, like Meteion, appears late in the game. I would have liked to see more of her character. I believe this expansion would have been more interesting had she and her people been given a focus earlier instead of filler fetch quests from 90-96 where we learn crumbs about the other characters(minus Wuk Lumat) here and there. I wouldn't of minded seeing more screentime of characters like Zoraal Ja and Bakool Ja Ja, either, if it meant fleshing out their characters rather than getting the dull surface level cultural understanding filler quests that were thrown at us.

4. What was the point of getting to know the Endless if we were just going to genocide them? The whole premise of why we erased them was so that Sphene would get demoralized, but that doesn't even happen. So wiping them all out was utterly pointless? What kind of a dumb non-payoff is that to a story? Moreover, if we're GOING to genocide them because we WEREN'T given a choice, WHY do we have to get to know them? What good does that do? These aren't going to be Wuk Lumat's people in the future, since the author already decided we're going to erase them. So why do this? Oh right, because you need filler to make the sixth zone as long as the others and because you want a cheap attempt to pull at the player's emotional heartstrings that wasn't earned because the whole premise makes no sense. We didn't know how long it would take Sphene to enact her plan. For all we know she could've finished it in the time we were taking getting to know the Endless. Also, getting to know the people you've already decided you're going to kill makes NO sense. But at least they stripped the place barren to remind the player of the genocide they committed every time they enter the zone in the future, whether they agreed with it or not.

5. Isn't this supposed to be an MMORPG? As in, an online RPG? Is it really an RPG when my dialogue options are just three different ways to say I agree with Wuk Lumat?

6. What is the excuse for having such sparse occurrences of voice acting? With all the money this game has pulled in, ALL the MSQ should be voice acted by now. And yet it seems like we got less, not more? And the MC's voice actor was lackluster?

7. Maybe I should have made this number 3. Talk to 3 of these people. Collect 3 of these things. Look for this item or person, but the first two times you don't find what you're looking for, but the third time's the charm! This also took me out of my immersion because it was so predictable and just reminds me of how this dev team, the one using the same formula for a decade, is absolutely TERRIFIED to take risks or deviate even slightly on ANYTHING.

8. We are the Warrior of Light. Savior of the Universe. Usurper of Tyrants. And yet, for the sake of a forced plot, our character chills in the back because otherwise the plot would end right there. The amount of times I was practically screaming at my screen while we just let Bakool Ja Ja do as he pleases, or as we LET Zoraal Ja kill his father and then let him WALK away without a care in the world, or as we LET Sphene go and pick up the all important key item just for the sake of prolonging the plot. Just, why? We could annihalate them with ease and solve the problem before needless casualties occur. So WHY? Gulool Ja Ja's death was pointless and unnecessary.

**Bunyon** · 07-07-2024 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by Zabuza

1. Zoraal Ja represents what the OP was referring to. Wasted potential. The writers did a terrible job making us sympathize with or relate with him if that was their intent. Waited until the very end to attempt to make him something other than a one-dimensional villain. Unfortunately, by then, it was too late. Was his son supposed to make me relate with him in some way? But his son is not explained whatsoever. He just pops up randomly out of nowhere. I just chalked it up to he had a one night's stand with someone and that was the result. We're told his father spurned him but shown nothing which would indicate he was mistreated. Either commit to making him a one-dimensional villain or make a decent showing of why this character deserves my understanding. The whole theme of feeling alienated because people shower endless praise upon you is very real, but the only indication we get of this is in the middle of our trial fight with him. His character could have been interesting but was executed very poorly and any crumb that would help us understand him came far too late to leave an impact.

For quite a while I thought Zoraal Ja knew more about something ominous that was coming, since his whole deal was how peace led to complacency and the country was unprepared to face war. I thought the whole thing was a slow build up that would maybe not even resolve in this expansion, like his knowledge of other unknown countries preparing for war. But no. It was just daddy issues because unrealistic expectations. So much for that.

**Zabuza** · 07-07-2024 11:58 PM

Originally Posted by Bunyon

For quite a while I thought Zoraal Ja knew more about something ominous that was coming, since his whole deal was how peace led to complacency and the country was unprepared to face war. I thought the whole thing was a slow build up that would maybe not even resolve in this expansion, like his knowledge of other unknown countries preparing for war. But no. It was just daddy issues because unrealistic expectations. So much for that.

True. I forgot about that but now that you mention it, that was just another one of the setups that had no payoff whatsoever. Along with the setup of competing with Thancred and Urianger in the rites of succession. I thought we might actually have to fight them in a duel at some point, but nothing really happened at all out of that. We conveniently ended up cooperating with them and their claimant and getting paired up with them in the cooking rite, too.

Originally Posted by HighlanderClone

Interesting theory. A lot of the issues with EW also arise because of having to condense two xpacs into one.

I don't know why people keep praising FF14 for being so story-focused or that it's an "RPGMMO" when it's so clear that the story has to constantly bend over backwards for its gameplay and MMO formula (Sol 9 as a hub as you mentioned, the necessity of having 3 party members + WoL, the necessity of needing 7 party members + WoL for trials, the necessity of pacing the story so that there's a dungeon every odd level... so on and so forth).

If a rewrite occurred at some point I think it also speaks to just how rigid the formula is (with the release schedule, patch cycle, gameplay systems etc.) that they have to butcher their story just so it can work with the release cycle and gameplay systems.

Honestly I am so tired of FF14's formula and it isn't just the story. If they keep going on this formulaic route the entire game is going to wither slowly.

True. I've been complaining about this since the story was good. Same amount of extremes released. Same amount of dungeons. The dungeons themselves are structured the same. Two trash pack pull --> Two trash pack pull --> Boss. Repeat this three times and dungeon over. Every single time. Four story raids released. Then later, four savage raids. Next patch, 24 man alliance raid released. Same tomestone formula, same gear reward format. In quests, click on three items. Talk to three people. Looking for missing thing three times. Back in Stormblood we had a quest in the Steppe where we picked up dung. In Dawntrail we get a quest where we pick up dung. Same old song and dance. No variation whatsoever. For a decade. In the quest where we were looking for Valigarmanda with the detector, I was silently hoping to myself that it would take any numbers of times but three to at least give it a slight variation, but nope. Third time's the charm. Yet again.

Now the story isn't even around to save this game. I'm glad criticism is plentiful, because people kept insisting these devs can do no wrong and devs need to see that there are indeed problems that need working on. When the players continuously praise the devs for everything they do, they get complacent and start thinking they can put in less effort and get away with anything.

**MarianneviBrittania** · 07-07-2024 09:43 AM