Wow, Wuk Lamat is really single-handedly ruining the DT story...

[Vyrerus]

Also, Krile and G'raha, what? Don't care enough about us to dynamis their way back into the arena, too? G'raha?

And, while I see the parallels of both being queens with Wuk Lamat, G'raha and Krile have their connections to Sphene that could have been expounded upon and used too.

Krile is literally one of her people, having been born in Alexanrdria. And G'raha was a ruler who had to guide his people through an apocalypse on a dying world for a century, which arguably means Sphene should have related to him more than Wuk Lamat.

The bonding and writing spotlight should have been spread around.

Amen to this.

Honestly, the way Wuk Lamat forcefully stays front and center in this story seems like a pointed offensive against player mindsets. It's like they are attempting to smash people's conception that the WoL is the main character of FFXIV by giving us this NPC who has the mask of being a main character, but none of what actually sells a main character.

Like her leaping into the fight to help WoL is practially a countdown to ending the fight, as much damage as she's doing/buffing the WoL to do, and it happens in the latter half of the fight... When Sphene was already on a back foot.

But I guess this trend of the WoL, "needing help" started back in Shadowbringers, and Shadowbringers was so successful they've sought to copy it twice now with how end trial fights resolve. Azem Stone into 8 man WoL team into villain nearly beats them with his big attack, into the WoL getting hypercharged by powers outside of the fight.

In Hades's fight, it was the Lightwarden light combining with The Blessing Light to both shield and increase damage from the WoL team. In Endwalker it's the Prayer bubble from the Scions that save WoL from Meteion's death surge of Dynamis. In Dawntrail... WoL is beating Sphene like a redheaded stepchild, and Wuk Lamat steps in anyway, super buffed, super buffing WoL and it goes from a murder to, "Stop, stop, she's already dead!"

[Catwho]

It's like they are attempting to smash people's conception that the WoL is the main character of FFXIV by giving us this NPC who has the mask of being a main character, but none of what actually sells a main character.

I guess none of this bothered me because this is the way every FFXI expansion was written. So it felt more like a throwback than anything.

[Masekase_Hurricane]

Wuk Lamat is as awesome character. Learns from her failures and she's got a cute personality! Love me some Wuk Lamat!!

I'm about halfway through the story and not really seeing the extreme hate people are having for the character. If I really wanted to be picky i'd say it would've been nice to actually have some training scenes with WoL and Wuk (ff7 flashback gym squats etc :P)

[Nothv13]

Wuk Lamat is as awesome character. Learns from her failures and she's got a cute personality! Love me some Wuk Lamat!!

What failure? Her getting kidnapped that one time and then not worrying about it at all until she somehow was able to beat someone easily that she couldn't even touch before despite showing no growth or gain in fighting power? No. Everything goes her way with little to no effort. Hell, even the giants that wanted to stop her were mcguffined out of actually challenging her world view. The father of Bakool Ja Ja just immediately does a 180 with the mere mention of another method, that isn't even guaranteed. This a guy who was ingrained so heaviliy in a cult like mentality, that not even his wife could get him to change, and Wuk, makes him just immediately.

[Nebelheim]

I guess none of this bothered me because this is the way every FFXI expansion was written. So it felt more like a throwback than anything.

Except ff11 did it better and didn't sideline our character and at least our character in 11 was acknowledged for helping in the story in that game even if we started as lowly adventurers at the start of each expansion we weren't relegated to side character status and was pretty equal to each lead female by the end of each expansions story.

[Amh_Wilzuun]

No, it's not. People were AVERSE to trying Wind Waker because of the art style. Those who did play Wind Waker had valid complaints but the game was far from called trash.

The feedback Nintendo took from this was appropriate (even if the art style was really great in the end) and that was people didn't really want super cartoony art style for The Legend of Zelda series (at least not the main games).

To draw a parallel, I have friends who weren't interested in DT because of the way the expansion was pitched to us (through live letters and trailers). That's similar to what you saw with Wind Waker and those who didn't like the art style.

To say people playing DT, going through the story and expressing how it was not enjoyable is the same is a false equivalency. That's not an "initial impression".

It's the same as people saying "it's a new start to the story! You can't expect it to be good!"; the run time of the MSQ is longer than most seasons of TV shows and longer than movies by many hours.

How much hand waving is needed to try and get rid of valid criticism?

I didn't enjoy the first half of the story, I didn't like the middle part of the story and I really didn't like the ending. Is that an initial impression or do we need to keep moving the goal post for what/when we can consider feedback valid?

I didn’t move any goalpost or handwave anything, I was just expanding on a side point. People did call wind Waker trash even after it came out because they weren’t able to look past the art style. There wasn’t this magical come to Jesus moment where everyone did a 180 on the game the day it came out. It took years for that negative sentiment to dissipate to where WW is now considered a Zelda classic

[Bellybell]

I'm about halfway through the story and not really seeing the extreme hate people are having for the character. If I really wanted to be picky i'd say it would've been nice to actually have some training scenes with WoL and Wuk (ff7 flashback gym squats etc :P)

i WAS share the same mind, until I actually finished it anyway.
i hope you can maintain your perspective after you finished, unlike me.

[Swad]

I guess none of this bothered me because this is the way every FFXI expansion was written. So it felt more like a throwback than anything.

Cannot imagine the damage that these writers will do to XI with the alliance raids. Fickblix had a better story then Wuk.

[Kathryn]

I'm about halfway through the story and not really seeing the extreme hate people are having for the character. If I really wanted to be picky i'd say it would've been nice to actually have some training scenes with WoL and Wuk (ff7 flashback gym squats etc :P)

I was like this til half way through, then I thought I would be set free and im known as a WL sympathizer but after the last 2 areas and the amount of decision making, bossing about, screen time and just literal WL overload I want her as our next trial, seriously SE, let us kill her or at least humiliate her, I was so heart broken for erenville and krile after area 5...

It's just... i dont want to see anymore of her.

[Verathel]

At least Zero had a theme considering her background which properly explained her behavior even if people didn't accept it or agreed to it.

And people will continue to criticize Wuk Lamat for frankly we expected better and got mediocrity. Even her best traits start to fall flat after a while