Dawntrail character graphics update - opinions, requests and discussion megathread

[Alice9]

Yeah I have to agree with the grievances around the eyes. I think it is one of the worst parts of this new update. Not only are the sizes and shapes just different for certain faces, but they look vastly darker and lifeless. That combined with the poor lighting of the Portrait system and now a bunch of character portraits that used to look great before Dawntrail now look terrible. At least mine do. Even when you fiddle around to try to recreate better lighting- eyes don't stick out like they used to, and that's the biggest shame in my opinion. They used to stick out and be bright, and it was charming in my opinion. Now if you go a far enough distance its hard to even see someone's eyes. its a complete style shift that was bound to be controversial.

[Doopliss]

I feel your pain... I used to make a lot of video edits with my WoL, but I've held off on them to wait and see if anything will look remotely better in 7.1 because right now my character is so different :C


The one wearing the allagan circlet of fending is from EW:

This one leaves me particularly speechless...

While I do, admittedly, love how the ♂ Elezen "updated" "Face 1" looks because it reminds me of old Elvaan concept art, this is just outright an entirely new face. It looks younger than ♂ Elezen Face 2 now(!?), and I think actually not a single feature looks the same--or at least gives a similar enough impression--as it once did on this character. I'm sorry. This is honestly another case where it should be a Face 5 option or something, because that is absolutely not Face 1.

And even then returning this face to something closer resembling its original form should 100% be prioritized first. This is just way too extreme of a difference.

[CuteBucket]

I feel your pain... I used to make a lot of video edits with my WoL, but I've held off on them to wait and see if anything will look remotely better in 7.1 because right now my character is so different :C


The one wearing the allagan circlet of fending is from EW:

The dazed and bored eyes strike again. A character with an intense passion behind their eyes? Can't have that, add more shadows, flatten the mouth, make them look like they feel nothing.

I see this face was also hit by the Great Lip Flattening. Had a unique lip shape? Not anymore! Now everyone can have the same generic lips and mouth!

Ugh.

[mallleable]

Not character related, but I do hope they can do a second pass on over world zones, and increase the amount of foliage. I wish Thavnair's jungle were as lush as Yak T'el's

[Sylie]

Same here.
I've also stopped coming to this forum, 1) as I tried not to get reminded of the changes and to get used to the character, and 2) as I don't believe they will make drastic changes, especially to a less popular race that has just a few feedbacks.
But I never got used to it, don't have the inclination to snap screenshots during cutscenes anymore and still miss my old impression... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯RIP


(Same cutscene, gone back to the same facial settings except skin color)

I was fortunate enough to have gotten used to it in a short time(3-4 days). Personally, i saw the change to my character as "for the better". But at the same time, at that time it didn't feel or look like the same character i've had for years, which felt weird. What's wild was when i shared this observation, i was getting comments saying "there's no difference" despite posting comparison pictures, with some even stating that i hated the change despite repeatedly stating that i never hated it, it just felt unfamiliar. While i understand the lack of perceived difference from other people, the complete dismissal of same perception from someone who spent years looking at the same character was, imo, absurd.

Anyway, they definitely did something with the eyes, yours clearly show it. They seem to have made it smaller and/or narrower. Same with the changes to the lips, but i am personally not as bothered with it. I'll provide an example myself with my Black Mage's old portrait

Pre-DT


Post-DT


Different background and frame, but the emote and facial expression used was unchanged. Fortunately, they seem to be addressing this, if my understanding of that response they posted is correct. Hopefully, they don't make more of a mess of things. Like I've said, i got used to it. I actually like the way my character looks now



So i'm kinda scared that they may mess it up further. And not only make it look further from the pre-DT look, but make it worse than how it looks now. But i certainly won't mind a reversal to an HD version of my WoL's old look.

[Sairaag]

Yeah, I'm kind of worried about the new eyes and whatever adjustments are coming, or not. Along with the new mouth shapes for male Miqo'te, the eyes bother me the most when I look at my WoL's face. I'm sorry for whinging about eyelids almost every time I post here, but just look at this...



They're saying now that it's an improvement, smoother visuals that better represent what was intended by the original data. I'm not sure what to think about this, because to me these eyes always appeared open and bright with subtle lines that followed the shape of the eye. I just really loved that I could have that shape without the eyes looking heavy-lidded. Does the statement mean that I was actually supposed to see these carved lines and deep double eyelids for all these years but the technology just wasn't there? That may be so, but if I could never guess this intent from the face I stared at for years, this change is going to look drastic no matter what.

I think it might help if they could add some shading on top of the eyelids or whatever it takes to make them shine less. Currently the lids are so reflective that they stand out even from most shadows, like the light that once was in my catboy's eyes went into the skin above them. Some facepaints help a little, but the eyelids are just too powerful to be fully contained now, and in many cutscenes it disturbs the balance of his eyes and thus the whole face. I'm not sure how bad it is for other characters, but that's the case for my face 1 Keeper at least.

But yeah, I'll wait and see what happens with the next update. And if I have to wait until they're able to expand character creation options, then I truly hope for an option that better represents what I saw in my character's old version.

[Cheapshot]

I see this face was also hit by the Great Lip Flattening. Had a unique lip shape? Not anymore! Now everyone can have the same generic lips and mouth!

Ugh.

If I consider all the changes to my face, and there were a large amount, the entire mouth stands out as the worst and most drastic change. It would be my #1 ask for fixing. The shape of it, the new recessed corners, the flat texture with drawn on and incorrect shadows, the unnatural default colour, the permanent gloss no matter what setting you choose. Mouths in this update look bad to me. I'm sorry to be rude but I have to be honest. I'm honest because I want the game to change for the better. This graphics update in many many regards was not the quality I expected to see.

Here's some more comparisons


Of course mouths were low poly and rough and needed improvement but think they got carried away and forgot to stick to the characters original feel. They look strange and doll like to me now.

• The mouth is a different shape (you can see this further in a side profile comparison which I've done in previous posts), including these recessed mouth corners that are new.
• The colour of the lips by default are now far too strong making it look like lipstick is applied even though "none" is selected. (I believe this may have been mentioned as something to be fixed in the recent statement).
• There is a glossy shine on the lips that is permanent despite "none" being selected.
• There is very little texture and variation to the lip colour making the lips look very smooth and doll like.
• There are shadows drawn onto the lips texture, which ignore game lighting. This causes a very strange appearance where the shadows appear even with light shining straight on them. The shadows are also both too strong and incorrectly placed. The shadow at the corners are out of place and make it look like something is dripping out the corners of the mouth! I think it's strange that the developers were firmly against keeping backed in fixed catch lights, but have no problems adding baked in fixed shadows?

[Cheapshot]

I also want to go back to the eyes because I think much was left out of the public reply.

• The eyelashes are completely different. This has nothing to do with the "direction" they're pointing or darkness or anything like that. They're just completely different eyelashes and I liked the old ones better.
• There is a grey haze over the new eyes, at least on Miqo'te face 4. I haven't seen any acknowledgement of this yet.
• My eye textures looked much sharper and clearer before 7.0. The blurriness feels like a downgrade.
• The eyelid fold above the eyes looked better before. It was more subtle and delicate and pretty. The lid folds have been make much deeper and more exaggerated in 7.0.
• The corners are lower now but that's obvious.
• It was said that catch lights are working as intended, but I believe they are too diffused. This makes the eyes look duller and more lifeless in general, because they don't have the sharp reflective quality of real eyes. My eyes prior to Dawntrail looked more "curved" and also more lively.

[noumen0nn]

If I consider all the changes to my face, and there were a large amount, the entire mouth stands out as the worst and most drastic change. It would be my #1 ask for fixing. The shape of it, the new recessed corners, the flat texture with drawn on and incorrect shadows, the unnatural default colour, the permanent gloss no matter what setting you choose. Mouths in this update look bad to me. I'm sorry to be rude but I have to be honest. I'm honest because I want the game to change for the better. This graphics update in many many regards was not the quality I expected to see.

Here's some more comparisons


Of course mouths were low poly and rough and needed improvement but think they got carried away and forgot to stick to the characters original feel. They look strange and doll like to me now.

• The mouth is a different shape (you can see this further in a side profile comparison which I've done in previous posts), including these recessed mouth corners that are new.
• The colour of the lips by default are now far too strong making it look like lipstick is applied even though "none" is selected. (I believe this may have been mentioned as something to be fixed in the recent statement).
• There is a glossy shine on the lips that is permanent despite "none" being selected.
• There is very little texture and variation to the lip colour making the lips look very smooth and doll like.
• There are shadows drawn onto the lips texture, which ignore game lighting. This causes a very strange appearance where the shadows appear even with light shining straight on them. The shadows are also both too strong and incorrectly placed. The shadow at the corners are out of place and make it look like something is dripping out the corners of the mouth! I think it's strange that the developers were firmly against keeping backed in fixed catch lights, but have no problems adding baked in fixed shadows?

I think this is one of the prime examples of how big of a subjective difference even tiny changes can make. I'll be honest, even I have to closely study the image to spot the differences (shape-wise at least, the shadows and gloss are obvious), but once you do it really stands out. I'm hopeful that the recessed mouth corners get addressed since that's one of the things they mentioned in the announcement.

But this begs the question- what the hell happened with my lips, or rinai's eyes? The features that even at a glance are just not even close? This update was all over the place in terms of consistency.

[Cheapshot]

This update was all over the place in terms of consistency.

That's just been my biggest grievance with everything. I think they should have taken the time to do this graphics update on its own without distractions or split efforts. And really do it right and get all the details right. The fact that it's so inconsistent on top of the games zones and gear being updated in parts? It's not a good state to put a live service monthly sub game in.