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  1. #1
    Player
    currentlemon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Posts
    262
    Character
    Celica Genhu
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 80

    Improving Dawntrail WHM

    I already posted this on the Healer strike thread and on it’s discord, but I want to make a WHM thread on the Healer sub-forum.

    I think that going into DT, WHM is in a decent spot. There is actually stuff to look forward to this time, unlike in EndWalker. However, there is always room for improvement.

    Healing kit is fine. Aside from having Cure I naturally upgrade to Cure II and gaining an action at the level 18-26 range.
    - (NEW) The shield timer on the new Divine Caress is too short. It needs to be increased.

    As for DPS, we can actually build a mini-rotation using the job’s current DPS kit.

    Let’s go over them really quick:

    Glare III - Fine As Is
    Afflatus Misery - Fine As Is
    Dia - 30sec DoT ability
    Glare IV - Locked behind a 120sec ability
    Holy - Only used in AoE situations.

    The problematic DPS actions are Dia, Glare IV, and Holy. These three actions deserve to be used more in WHM’s DPS rotation.

    Let’s make some adjustments.

    - Shorten Dia’s DoT timer to 15secs. Make WHM press this button more. Potency will have to be adjusted should a change like this occur.

    - Decrease Presence of Mind’s CD down from 120secs to 60secs for more Glare IV’s.

    - Do not lock Glare IV behind just Presence of Mind. Let WHM use this action more. It can be done in a few ways.

    * Introduce a new trait that allows each tick / second of Dia’s DoT timer to proc into Glare IV. This works similarly to BLM’s old Thunder proc ability. For this to work, Glare IV needs to be it’s own button and not locked behind PoM.

    * If the above sounds too OP, have Glare IV be a GCD ability with a 20sec CD.

    * Have Glare IV be usable after using other actions like Assize and Tetragrammation.

    - Enhance Holy into an AoE DoT ability after Presence of Mind is used. This makes Holy, a Final Fantasy staple, usable in a single target rotation for WHM as it’s new “finisher.”

    There. A mini-DPS rotation for WHM with no new DPS actions included. The only thing left to do is to have the job gain a weaker version of Glare IV at an early level.

    Edit: I understand that some potency nerfs may need to be done for some DPS actions in order for these suggestions to work, but that is something that I can live with.

    Feel free to post any other recommendations for WHM.
    (5)
    Last edited by currentlemon; 07-05-2024 at 01:55 AM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Silver-Strider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    1,753
    Character
    Silver Strider
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Give Regen/Medica a proc similar to Thunder proc that frontload's Dia's Dot

    Merge Cure 1 and Cure 2, while adjusting the Freecure proc to upgrade Glare 3 into Glare 4

    Give Thin Air a trait that can force these procs similar to Sharpcast

    Add Protect as a Lily Ability as an AoE mitigation skill on a 60s CD

    Add Divine Seal, Stoneskin and Fluid Aura as low level versions of Temperance, Divine Benison and Assize.
    (1)
    Last edited by Silver-Strider; 06-21-2024 at 11:53 PM.

  3. #3
    Player
    Ramiee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2022
    Location
    Uldah
    Posts
    1,096
    Character
    Grainne Gothram
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 50
    the only slight issue I find is that PoM is a powerful healing tool as well. Having it every 60 seconds for Glare IV basically makes it into a damage focused burst ability, seperating Glare IV and giving it like a 25 second CD and have it have 3 charges or something would probably be a better change.
    (1)

  4. #4
    Player
    Zaytex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2022
    Posts
    118
    Character
    Zaytex Zanshin
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Ramiee View Post
    the only slight issue I find is that PoM is a powerful healing tool as well. Having it every 60 seconds for Glare IV basically makes it into a damage focused burst ability, seperating Glare IV and giving it like a 25 second CD and have it have 3 charges or something would probably be a better change.
    There's no world where you use PoM for healing, it's strictly a tool for DPS.
    (1)

  5. 06-22-2024 05:08 PM

  6. #5
    Player
    Supersnow845's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2021
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    6,082
    Character
    Andreas Cestelle
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Pictomancer Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Willemdarke View Post
    DT WHM design sounds near perfect to me. The only thing I'd add is a chance for Dia ticks to proc a Glare 4.

    As for things like Regen or Thin Air, or whatever, procing DPS abilities - ugh, a very, very hard no. Why would anyone even think of tying the healing kit to damage? There's a reason SE is removing damage from melee DPS' gap closers.
    If procs from regen made regen uptime a DPS gain then you could heal and do damage with one button, I think that’s a perfectly acceptable idea in a meta that’s scared of healers having complexity because they then might not heal
    (2)
    As a healer main in this game for nigh on 14 years all I can say is that I’m tired. My role has been eroded of complexity and expression for 3 expansions. I’ve watched the tanks do my role for me for 2 expansions and my feedback and critiques continue to fall on deaf ears.

    I have no idea who modern healers are designed for but I know now it’s not me. This is the first expansion I’m truly considering dropping the healer role and not returning, so if that was the goal- congratulations I guess

  7. 06-22-2024 06:32 PM

  8. #6
    Player
    Supersnow845's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2021
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    6,082
    Character
    Andreas Cestelle
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Pictomancer Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Willemdarke View Post
    If by complexity you mean mind-numbingly putting regen on every target that doesn't need it until you run out of mana, or wasting Thin Air on DPS and not having it for rez, then sure. Whatever floats your boat
    As opposed to mind numbing pressing glare for 15 minutes

    If it’s a choice between completely disconnected healing and damage actions or healing proccing damage and vice versa I’m always going to pick the latter

    It wouldn’t even be hard to balance this thereotical scenario, all you would just have to do is make regen+diacloud proc a slight gain over glare but only if the proc is used after say…….12 seconds of dia ticking

    So it becomes semi optimal to keep regen up on one person (generally the MT) but spamming regen for diacloud procs would just be a loss as the procs would overwrite each other and you wouldn’t make up the cost of dropping a glare to cast regen

    I’m not saying this is the best idea ever but it’s better than what we have now where dia is completely unconnected from the kit despite WHM meant to be mirroring BLM
    (3)
    As a healer main in this game for nigh on 14 years all I can say is that I’m tired. My role has been eroded of complexity and expression for 3 expansions. I’ve watched the tanks do my role for me for 2 expansions and my feedback and critiques continue to fall on deaf ears.

    I have no idea who modern healers are designed for but I know now it’s not me. This is the first expansion I’m truly considering dropping the healer role and not returning, so if that was the goal- congratulations I guess

  9. #7
    Player
    Ramiee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2022
    Location
    Uldah
    Posts
    1,096
    Character
    Grainne Gothram
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Zaytex View Post
    There's no world where you use PoM for healing, it's strictly a tool for DPS.
    In my non-parsing casual raiding group the WHM would use PoM for healing, it can be used for it and should be an option for people less confident in healing. Attaching glare iv to it just fundementally seems like a bad idea to me really gives the vibe to WHMs that if you're not using this ability in this paticular way you are throwing, its like saying you should only use dissipation for the ED dump.
    (1)

  10. #8
    Player
    Supersnow845's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2021
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    6,082
    Character
    Andreas Cestelle
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Pictomancer Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Ramiee View Post
    In my non-parsing casual raiding group the WHM would use PoM for healing, it can be used for it and should be an option for people less confident in healing. Attaching glare iv to it just fundementally seems like a bad idea to me really gives the vibe to WHMs that if you're not using this ability in this paticular way you are throwing, its like saying you should only use dissipation for the ED dump.
    WHM’s healing design just doesn’t work with using POM as a healing tool, it has too long of a CD, it’s too useful as a damage tool and even used as a healing tool it just doesn’t provide that much benefit. It’s biggest benefit would being able to spam something like cure 3 faster but something like harrowing hell or terminal relativity is designed more as a mitigation check

    Dissipation is a different beast because it actually has 3 functions (ED dump, spreadlo amplifier and emergency recovery tool in prog)
    (3)
    As a healer main in this game for nigh on 14 years all I can say is that I’m tired. My role has been eroded of complexity and expression for 3 expansions. I’ve watched the tanks do my role for me for 2 expansions and my feedback and critiques continue to fall on deaf ears.

    I have no idea who modern healers are designed for but I know now it’s not me. This is the first expansion I’m truly considering dropping the healer role and not returning, so if that was the goal- congratulations I guess

  11. #9
    Player
    Silver-Strider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    1,753
    Character
    Silver Strider
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Willemdarke View Post
    Why would anyone even think of tying the healing kit to damage?
    THAT'S THE ENTIRE LILY SYSTEM????!!!!!!
    (10)
    Last edited by Silver-Strider; 06-23-2024 at 03:53 PM.

  12. #10
    Player
    SargeTheSeagull's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Posts
    421
    Character
    Rad Calidum
    World
    Ultros
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    Genuienly, DT WHM isn't super far off from what I'd like to see. What would I change?

    - Dia has a 2.5 second cast time and works like thundercloud on black mage.
    - After casting glare 3 three times you get one cast of glare 4
    - Every three casts of glare 4 grants "enhanced holy 3" increasing the damage of holy 3 by 300%.
    - (free space) Freecure reworked: Cure 1 upgrades to cure 2
    - Protect added. Consumes 1 lily. Grants a 300 potency barrier to all party members.

    That's all I'd do. DT WHM will probably be fairly fun. Locking G4 behind a 2 minute cooldown is sorta weird, that's all.
    (3)

  13. 06-24-2024 03:52 PM

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