new option: vote wipe

[Unholychinchilla]

I kinda fall on the side of no because it's either going to be annoying/abusable or full of some many requirements that as soon as it gets implemented there will be people running here to complain it wasn't available when they wanted it.

I get that there are times when you die because the healer was down and the raidwides were too much to survive without them, but there are actually very few bosses like that in most content and honestly the times I've sat for several minutes watching the tank play are rare. Is it obnoxious (especially when it's not your fault you died?) often yeah but sometimes if there's been a good rapport in the party it's not too bad. To be honest I've had way more instances of me being the sole dps kept alive by nascent glint/clemency and my own second wind/bloodbath, I admit it does feel good. Even that is something I only see once in maybe dozens of runs. If this is happening to you regularly, then there's definitely something wrong.

The main issue here, to my eyes, is that introducing mechanics to more easily police what people view as poor behaviour is a part that can quickly go wrong, especially given there's divided opinions on just this one. I think a better route would be to make it so that blacklisted players can't be matched with you randomly (other games make this a thing and I think the effect it'd have on queues is overstated, most people wouldn't use it much if at all and people who overuse it are just hurting their own queues). That way, rather than load down runs with a never ending series of voting systems (there will always be a new edge case somebody wants to vote on) you just have the option to not play with somebody again if they really got your back up that much. In the ten and a half years I've played, I've wanted that probably few enough times to count on one hand and most people don't care either. Even in content lulls the games population is large enough that I rarely notice the same random in my groups repeatedly.

[Turtledeluxe]

This is a terrible idea, but your heart is in the right place. The true solution though, is to nerf tank sustain.

Also on the absolute joke subject of WAR soloing-- no one is impressed, they are just being nice. The player base is generally non confrontational in parties. Everyone knows WAR is literally designed to be immortal at this point and you'd have to actively sabotage yourself or be below average skill (which is by definition a minority of users). As we saw in the new dungeon run by Xenosys and other world first streamers, even their DPS died. It just happens if you're not one of the few jobs designed to be easy.

Xenosys made plenty of errors but the fact is, WAR has a huge buffer for error.

[Lyth]

This issue is fairly important to address prior to Dawntrail's launch. No healer runs aside, there are at least two separate examples from the media tour of a party wiping and their WAR tank impromptu soloing the rest of the fight, typically over 10-20 minutes with several vulns up. It's not even skill dependent, because they were doing it despite failing multiple mechanics because of the amount of burst healing built into WAR.

Levelling content is generally more prone to wipes simply because everyone is readjusting to the new actions and rotations, and there's a lot of variability in terms of gear. That's not a bad thing and should be part of the experience. Being locked into an instance where you're forced to watch someone badly solo a fight over 10 minutes shouldn't be standard in these cases. It ruins the experience.

I can't say that I'm confident that the job balance team will make the appropriate adjustments to prevent this from happening from a job/role design perspective. That's why an option to 'Vote: Reset Pull' should exist.

Any vote can be designed around a mandatory quorum requirement to keep things fair. If three out of four people in a light party comp vote to end a pull, then you should end the pull, and there should be a built in mechanism to protect players on this point. The same might be true if you had five out of eight players in a full party comp voting to stop the pull.

It's also worth mentioning that this sort of addition is good QoL in general, because there might be some pulls where you're waiting for an extended cast bar or animation lock to do the reset, and not every arena lets you wall it.

[kaynide]

I would argue this is less of a player’s fault for wanting to carry an entire fight solo and more bad game design if played sync’d and as the game intends.

I concede in unsync’d content to some extent it’s wonky, but that’s already playing outside of intended settings and should come with some discussion before starting whatever duty.

[GoatOfWar]

If I can solo the fight, it's my right to do so. Why should people who failed the mechanics, potentially multiple times, get to forcefully reset the fight and waste my time?

For example, if a party wipes 3 times in a row, and I just decide to solo the fight on the third time, maybe it's for the better since they might never get through the fight otherwise. It also allows them to sit and watch someone do the mechanics flawlessly for ages which has the effect of teaching them the mechanics.

Average Warrior ego trip

[Valence]

I completely agree with this take and hope something as heinous as forcing good players to be unable to continue a fight they have been doing well on never gets implemented. What a terrible approach to punish the surviving member(s) of the team for doing good on a fight in benefit of those that failed.

This would be disastrous and rewarding bad players at the expense of the good ones. Those who survive should have the decision to continue or wipe the party, not the failures.

The fallacy is thinking that a tank surviving through a dungeon boss fight past lvl80 is a good player and not an overpowered self-carried job.

However this thread is a red herring, because it wouldn't even be a thing if the trinity and the battle system wasn't broken to begin with. Maybe that's what they ought to fix...

[Local_Custard]

The fallacy is thinking that a tank surviving through a dungeon boss fight past lvl80 is a good player and not an overpowered self-carried job.

However this thread is a red herring, because it wouldn't even be a thing if the trinity and the battle system wasn't broken to begin with. Maybe that's what they ought to fix...

you'd be right in saying that I would have never suggested this if tanks couldn't solo most fights (exception being fights that have no composition requirements and/or are designed to be solo'd)

[Acelyn]

nah, i enjoy when the wheels fall off the wagon, death chases everyone and we maybe get to watch someone try and fail to finish it.

its a built-in punishment for being a group of losers(me included)imo,

gives the game some character, something slowly being drained from it.

[ForteNightshade]

actually, im against that. i would rather have them lower warriors defence and also raising the hp so warriors have to use their self sustain to help the healers getting himself full

Sooo... they actually tried this back in ARR. Warrior was, originally, the HP tank while Paladin was your standard defense and mitigation. The end result was Warrior being completely shunned because it simply couldn't keep up. In order to threaten Paladin, they had to keep dramatically increasing the damage tank busters dealt but that meant Warrior simply couldn't survive. For a system like this to work, you'd have to bloat Warrior's HP to absolutely comical degrees. At which point, why bother? It wouldn't really feel any more unique at that point.

[littlehobbit13]

Maybe not "Vote Wipe" but "Vote Reset", just for more neutral wording. Otherwise I'm fully in favor of the option. Full party vote, and that way if 3/4 want to reset and the tank is refusing to be a team player at 50% boss HP, majority rules.

Side note: very unclear why all the people insisting they should be allowed to tackle boss fights alone aren't just playing with Duty Support? Find a way to get your NPCs killed and then you can solo down the final boss from 80% for all anyone else cares.