How would you tackle job identity?

[Shurrikhan]

They did this in ARR. The class was so garbage that the very first patch ARR got specifically turned WAR into PLD.

It can be considered that way, and I called it as much myself at the time, but that's mostly just because of how broad a set of parameters would have been "PLD" at the time. Namely, before 2.1, "PLD" included any sustain (means of surviving, be that healing, barriers, %DR, %recovery, etc.) that scaled with enemy attacks instead of solely your own stats.

Yes, technically, MRD had one such ability (Foresight), which Paladin could then also take, but it was worth only around 3% mitigation at the time WAR was changed and, again, wasn't unique to Warrior, unlike Sentinel, Bulwark, Hallowed Ground, and the ability to block enemy attacks. Warrior's only mitigation tools that anyone could at all notice were Rampart and Flash, both Gladiator skills.

And while they certainly didn't need to copy-pasta defensive CDs or thereby line Warrior's defensive structures up with Paladin's, they absolutely did need to make WAR's sustain scale less with its own stats and more with incoming damage. Else, had it simply been tuned to compete at mid-progression or late-tier, it would consistently be inferior until and superior thereafter, even allowing their party to forgo a healer in dungeons and certain boss fights after that point. Barring gimmick solutions like much stronger raid buffs for avoiding repeat jobs, you'd ideally just double PLD until the balance point, perhaps briefly use both, and then double WAR unless there was particularly good Hallowed Ground cheese possible in the given instance. You'd have Early Tank and Late Tank more so than simultaneously competitive Tank Style A and Tank Style B.

Then you won't leave any space for any tank to shine.
Can't have a fight where one tank does better than another if they all just do the same things.

You don't need each fight to have a preferred tank. Heck, doing so means you increasingly end up with one tank choice at a time, just with rotating face.

You do, however, need them to do those things in different ways. A GNB being able to kite mob damage, pounding into a displaced focus target while avoiding the rest before bursting CD-based AoE against all to survive that through suppression from damage dealt... is still X sustain + X damage, possibly even following very similar scaling factors and profile to other tanks', yet would feel very different from a Paladin alternating turtling and reprisal or a Warrior weaving between Defiance and Deliverance abilities to survive while dishing out as much as they take, etc.

[Freyt]

I think we could kill classes, and establish a freelancer class with a level cap of 30.

[Sylpharia]

Personally I think PvP does a good job of it

[Dzian]

Jobs dont need to be perfectly balanced. well designed content will balance the jobs by default..

easiest analagy would be cars..
Car A has amazing acceleration a good top spped but not so great handling.
Car B. has slower acceleration a higher top speed and ok handling.
Car C has slower accelleration than the others a slower top speed than both. but amazing handling.

which car wins the race? depends on the track design. a long straight drag race car C wouldnt stand a chance as itd be heavily disadvntaged and unbalanced.

but a decent circuit with some tight corners and sweeping bends as well as some decent straights and it is quite literally anyones race to win.. all the cars are then balanced..

another example can be guns in a fps. often balanced by well designed maps.. a big open barren dessert well sniper rifles are gonna tear everyone to shreds. but runing around in a ferry terminal or warehouse. a sniper rifle may be heavily disadvantaged by being up close and personal with a shotgun..

key to balance is content design more than job design.

[Vatom]

A better question would be what is your jobs identity because a lot of people’s idea of how a job should look like is different

I state this because if you want to have identity everyone needs to agree upon it or SE needs to decide and stand on it

[Turtledeluxe]

Crazy idea but I'd maybe base the encounters and jobs around Final Fantasy and not WoW.

Instead what we have is an MMO that is a caricature of FF devoid of most mechanics that make it interesting.

[PercibelTheren]

I would throw out the 2 minute meta to start because it's a big culprit of why all the jobs feel so samey. Next, I would throw out the concept that the jobs need to be perfectly balanced in every regard. As long as they're all viable and able to clear the content, I really don't think a 2% DPS difference matters. It's OK to have jobs that are better suited for certain fights, as long as not perfect doesn't equal not viable at all.

[Rithy255]

I don't know about in general but here's my Ideal "tanks"

General: Rampart Removed (30/40s get to be 90s), Tank passive gets nerfed down a bit. All invuls 30s apart Holmgang = 270 / LD = 300 / Bolide = 330 / HG = 360

Paladin
Offensively - Bring back combo paths, keep the Divine might buff have more focus on GCD gameplay, I think this tank just become the interesting GCD tank with some ogcd's. Blocking attacks could also lead to "shield swipe" which would be a very small potency ogcd, Holy spirit should upgrade into holy circle should be learnt during ARR. (Remove the passive where mp cost is halved and just have all magic spells halved to begin with)
Defensively - Change how blocking works tbh it's a very out dated boring mech, Bulwark could be swapped out for something more interesting depending on how blocking would change, Removed magic attacks on the job, Holy Sheltron - 20%, still grants Knight's benediction but for 18s, Same with intervention (regen to normal sheltron added just way weaker), Cover should grant targets a small regen or mitigation and not cost gauge, likely give it a longer cooldown.

Warrior
Offensively - Just add more things to beast gauge, this job is fine being simple.
Defensively - Passive inbuilt max HP by 15% with, Short CD should be split into two that share the same recast, one being a mitigation for 15% that targets you or a ally, second should be a heal that acts like the healing effect on blood whetting (can only be used on self), the main difference being that you dont heal per enemy, Equilibrium shouldn't have a regen attached, shake it off should be swapped out for a Mitigation on party members (it makes no sense that warrior healing allies), Vengeance Upgrade should just be 40% instead of having a regen. (yes this is a lot of healing nerfs on warrior but the max base HP should help warrior out, and it still keeps most of it's sustain).

Dark Knight
Offensively - Fast paced with ogcds, I'd likely give it two combo paths, a small haste buff (somewhere) just in general something that feels different from warrior, bring back cool animations like Power slash PLEASE)
Defensively - it should Remain mostly the same, I think oblation could do with a small 150-200 potency life steal effect (Don't make it per enemy like current warrior), just because the cooldown feels kinda bad (its new excog could be changed out or reduced), Dark Mind should be 15% but grant something like a 5% physical mit, Dark missonary should grant barriers to party members instead of being a mitigation cooldown

Gunbreaker
Offensively - stays the same.
Defensively - 5% Hp buff (similar to war but way smaller), HOC should be 20% 6s and the Excog should be around 700 potency HOL should work on physical, rest should stay the same.

[Its_Kazzy_D]

I think we could kill classes, and establish a freelancer class with a level cap of 30.

If it means I don't have to have a level 90 conjurer as my cohealer for the final EW boss again, then I'm down.

[Shurrikhan]

Jobs dont need to be perfectly balanced. well designed content will balance the jobs by default..

easiest analagy would be cars..

a decent circuit with some tight corners and sweeping bends as well as some decent straights and it is quite literally anyones race to win.. all the cars are then balanced..

This requires that all content be designed in similar weighted proportion, which is a hell of a constraint to work under.

Not saying it's impossible, its no easier a task than having generally balanced jobs that nonetheless feel wholly distinct.

key to balance is content design more than job design.

It's necessarily both.