#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

[Kacho_Nacho]

Honestly it's been like that for years, i don't think SE cares since they are not even communicating about this.
Last patch note made it clear, when it comes to balance, in their opinion healers are fine as they are.
Only reason i play sage is because i like it and waiting for a dungeon is short.
I take it as a subpar dps that happens to have heal abilities to make the hotbars look full.
While in reality most of the game content can be cleared with only 4 to 5 buttons.

It truly is puzzling why SE hasn't communicated something regarding healers. What you say about sages applies to the other healers too. In many ways, all of them are a subpar damage dealers with redundant healing abilities which exist solely to fill the hotbars. Every healer in the game needs drastic revision in order for them to face the type of content the designers are creating.

[PercibelTheren]

It truly is puzzling why SE hasn't communicated something regarding healers. What you say about sages applies to the other healers too. In many ways, all of them are a subpar damage dealers with redundant healing abilities which exist solely to fill the hotbars. Every healer in the game needs drastic revision in order for them to face the type of content the designers are creating.

They have communicated one thing. "If you want to feel challenged as a healer, play Ultimate."

[KageTokage]

I don't think I'd mind the healing check in the M6S add phase as much if it was like...in a final fight of a tier instead because at present it's rougher then anything else in the current tier.

Having to deal with nearly three minutes of constant boss-grade auto attack damage is way rougher on the tanks/healers then the periodic tank busters/raidwides in the other phases/fights.

[Maltothoris]

I wonder if they will try to buff sge and sch to an extent given the massive gap between them and the pure heals on m6s. Most likely this wouldn't be the case but who knows?

It actually kinda interesting looking at in the one certain. All tanks have where the highest and lowest are 600. Then you have healers where the difference between highest and lowest are 2700.

[ForsakenRoe]

I wonder if they will try to buff sge and sch to an extent given the massive gap between them and the pure heals on m6s. Most likely this wouldn't be the case but who knows?

It actually kinda interesting looking at in the one certain. All tanks have where the highest and lowest are 600. Then you have healers where the difference between highest and lowest are 2700.

Presumably this is due to the add phase? WHM can bank Miserys to throw out on the pack, AST buffs everyone who's AOEing, but SCH can only Chain one enemy, and SGE is just SGE. SCH could be helped by doing something like having Energy Drain upgrade to Bane (allowing them to spread their DOT in the same way SGE can with E.Dyskrasia), and then having Bane able to spread Chain Stratagem. So long as the 'resets duration to maximum' effect that Bane used to have does not return, that'd prevent any 'infinite loops' from occuring. No idea how SGE could be helped, maybe reducing the AOE damage falloff on Phlegma and Psyche. Hell, remove the damage penalty on Toxikon entirely, so that using a ST shield on the Tank, then using the Toxikon it generates when breaking, is almost damage neutral in AOE (versus using 2 Dyskrasia casts), IDK

But maybe it doesn't matter, because FFlogs excludes Add damage in some fights, and doesn't exclude it in others, seemingly without reason (or if there is some logic, I don't understand how they come to the conclusion they do). So if they exclude Add damage, then once we have gear we'll just target the main boss (so that the attacks that do count to the parse, aren't penalized by AOE falloff), and we'll kill the adds that we need to kill entirely via incidental cleave damage

Unrelated, opinions on the tier: Cool mechanics design, but I expect that we'll be back to business as usual once we get gear, as we always do. The new mechanics/speed of fights do not suddenly 'solve' the Healer role's issues. In fact, with the way that mechanics are designed, I feel like Job redesign ideas (like mine, shameless plug) would actually fit even better with the new raid design direction. For example, 'BLM got changed because it needed to, to fit with how much mobility is demanded in the new raids', supposedly (It had like, 11 GCDs of straight instantcasts if you planned it out, so IDK about that one). But, what I have written for WHM would give it a damage rotation where up to 60% of its GCDs are instantcasts, so it'd be super smooth feeling (along with Aetherial Shift for getting into position quickly) in the fast pace of something like M8S

[AmiableApkallu]

But maybe it doesn't matter, because FFlogs excludes Add damage in some fights, and doesn't exclude it in others, seemingly without reason (or if there is some logic, I don't understand how they come to the conclusion they do).

To paraphrase Semirhage and maybe others (I don't know where this idea ultimately originated), the act of healing delays failure. Which is to say, the act of healing creates additional time during which the party can deal damage. And when the goal is "get the boss's HP down to zero," all that matters is damage, so creating more time in which to deal damage is surely a good thing, yes yes?

And yet, FFLogs and XIVAnalysis make no attempt to engage with this observation. There is no attempt to credit a healer whose actions extended a fight's duration with rDPS.

And so, everytime I see evidence that players are playing to FFLogs and not the actual game, I kinda cry inside.

[KageTokage]

I wonder if they will try to buff sge and sch to an extent given the massive gap between them and the pure heals on m6s. Most likely this wouldn't be the case but who knows?

It actually kinda interesting looking at in the one certain. All tanks have where the highest and lowest are 600. Then you have healers where the difference between highest and lowest are 2700.

I do feel like a large part of my struggles in 6S have to do with my pure co-healers just...not healing because I've seen one of the tanks just go from full HP to dead without their health going up on multiple occasions while I'm dumping literally everything I have into the other tank just to delay their deaths until their mits are ready again.

[ForsakenRoe]

And so, everytime I see evidence that players are playing to FFLogs and not the actual game, I kinda cry inside.

I assume it's a case of 'well, we don't want people to be able to get higher parses by padding on adds (eg DOTting all 4 of the bird adds in P3S as a healer, putting DOTs on as many non-required adds as possible in stuff like Suzaku/O6S, etc), but this fight, you can still hit the boss. I'm less concerned with whether they exclude add damage or not, and moreso the seemingly inconsistent cointoss of 'this fight the adds do count, oh but this fight they don't count', what is the point in trying to have this 3rd party competitive aspect to the game if they can't even settle on a standardized ruleset regarding 'do adds count towards the parse'?

And yeh, healer actions being unrecognized kinda sucks. If SE can work out a system wherein 'if your barrier is the thing that was the difference between living and dying, you get bonus LB', surely FFlogs could implement a similar system, wherein a barrier that keeps the party alive (and is therefore 'required') is at least partially credited? They changed the systems to credit 'damage prevented by mitigation effects' to count as HPS, after all

[Kes13a]

I do feel like a large part of my struggles in 6S have to do with my pure co-healers just...not healing because I've seen one of the tanks just go from full HP to dead without their health going up on multiple occasions while I'm dumping literally everything I have into the other tank just to delay their deaths until their mits are ready again.

that feels a lot like healing before they changed scholar and one was a cohealer back in the day. I died inside because i knew I was on my own for healing as the scholar was typically just there as green dps (until SE changed that to the screams of all the green dps scholars)

[Azurarok]

that feels a lot like healing before they changed scholar and one was a cohealer back in the day. I died inside because i knew I was on my own for healing as the scholar was typically just there as green dps (until SE changed that to the screams of all the green dps scholars)

turns out healers that refuse to heal can't be eliminated as long as the trade-off with dps exists. Pretty sure EW making free healing so accessible across the role only made the problem worse.

I'd love to go back and remove the excessive free healing we have now and just learn to deal with the occasional green dpser, though at the same time I wonder if we couldn't just have several styles, with WHM and SCH constantly weighing healing and dps while AST mostly gets by with oGCD healing and SGE gets fully dps-neutral to positive healing when played right.