#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

[Azurarok]

really just adds to the notion that healers are an afterthought

[ForsakenRoe]

You'd think if their grand idea of DT job design means "lots and lots of follow up oGCDs", they could've at least pick the ones that make sense. But then we got things like:[LIST]
Temperance => Divine Caress. Why? Why not things like Plenary Indulgence?
PoM => Glare IV. Why? Why not Assize?
Chain Stratagem => Baneful Impaction. Why? Why not Aetherflow?
Divination => Oracle. Why? And on personal note, is Oracle really thematic for AST?

Because their DT job design idea is not 'lots of followup OGCDs' when it comes to Healers, it's 'give them one more damage button, but only to use in the 2min window so it has almost zero impact on the overall rotation'. WHM's isn't even an OGCD (Glare4)

Div>Oracle is a particularly egregious offender. 'We have removed the RNG from the cards, because it didn't feel good to players that they might draw the 'wrong' card in their burst window. Players will suffer their quota of bad RNG via a system they cannot control (whether Oracle crits or not), instead of the one they had some influence over (redrawing/spreading/MA'ing cards)'

If they want to 'fix' Oracle, they could make it hit 12 times (cos it invokes symbolism of the Twelve), that way the DHit/Crit chance is smoothed out across the hits instead of the 'all or nothing' it currently is

allow me since this is very hard for you to do : LINK

With Pictures : HERE, HERE -> taken from THIS site and of course THIS.

Please elaborate on your experience while you correlate with the data presented. I will be here waiting. I am waiting here how your "feelings" correlate with the data presented and how people are playing healers there because it's more "rewarding. (according to you anyway)

Not them (or maybe I am, we're all alts of each other apparently), but A: again you're on about Retail WOW, and I was using Vanilla/Classic as an example, B: some of those links are just things like 'what is the ratio of healers to tanks google' which gives you the answer 'it's 1 Tank, 1 Healer, 3 DPS for a dungeon party' which... has already been mentioned in the thread and doesn't really prove anything, C: only the youtube video actually breaks down the data by SPEC, the others just say 'what class', and when you have the ever-popular Retribution Paladin (DPS) being logged as the same 'class' data as the not-so-played Holy Paladin (Healer), it messes the stats up. Especially for Druid, as they have FOUR specs (Caster, Melee, Tank, Healer)

Lastly, D: Here's some stats for my point about Classic. From about 2 months ago, a reddit post with some census addon data (Aliiance side):

From left to right for classes, you have:
Warrior (Tank/DPS, both work very well)
Paladin (Tank/Healer/DPS, but playing any spec but Healer is 'meme tier' so most picking it will be Healer. Brings 5min duration buffs called 'Blessings', such as increasing attack power, increasing MP regen, or decreasing threat generated)
Hunter (3 DPS specs, gets a pet companion, very popular)
Rogue (3 DPS specs, star of many Warcraft AMVs back in the day due to being able to 100-0 someone in PVP before they can even get out of CC)
Priest (2 Healer specs and one DPS, will be played as a Healer mainly due to Shadow being 'meme tier' damage (though some raids run one Shadow just for the raidbuff it brings))
Mage (3 DPS specs, the best goldfarming class and one of the fastest at levelling, always popular)
Warlock (3 DPS specs, not as popular as Mage, but it can summon allies to their location with Ritual of Summoning, and in a game where you have to run to the dungeon entrance to enter it, that's pretty neat)
Druid (Tank+DPS/Healer/DPS specs, the Tank/DPS spec is a 2-in-1 and isn't completely terrible but most raids prefer to just have 2 Warriors as the tanks. The pure DPS spec goes OOM faster than a RDM on res duty, so it's a meme. The Healer spec is also a bit of a meme (due to being HOT focused, but the HOTs don't stack with other Druids unless you use different spell ranks), but it's the most functional of the three)

And the Horde side from that same server:

Again, from left to right:
Warrior (Tank/DPS, both work very well)
Hunter (3 DPS specs, gets a pet companion, very popular)
Rogue (3 DPS specs, star of many Warcraft AMVs back in the day due to being able to 100-0 someone in PVP before they can even get out of CC)
Priest (2 Healer specs and one DPS, will be played as a Healer mainly due to Shadow being 'meme tier' damage (though some raids run one Shadow just for the raidbuff it brings))
Shaman (2DPS specs and 1 Healer, mainly played as Healer due to its incredible throughput AOE healing via 'Chain Heal'. Brings 2min duration AOE buffs via Totems, such as increasing stats, decreasing threat generation, or auto-cleansing debuffs)
Mage (3 DPS specs, the best goldfarming class and one of the fastest at levelling, always popular)
Warlock (3 DPS specs, not as popular as Mage, but it can summon allies to their location with Ritual of Summoning, and in a game where you have to run to the dungeon entrance to enter it, that's pretty neat)
Druid (Tank+DPS/Healer/DPS specs, the Tank/DPS spec is a 2-in-1 and isn't completely terrible but most raids prefer to just have 2 Warriors as the tanks. The pure DPS spec goes OOM faster than a RDM on res duty, so it's a meme)

And why not, here's a different site's chart for the server, with both factions combined:

If we then assume that the majority of Druid/Paladin/Shaman/Priest players are playing that class as a Healer, and that every Warrior is a tank (god I wish), the roles would stack up like this:

Even if we took an estimate of, say, 50% of Warriors are playing DPS Warrior only and absolutely refuse to Tank (it's probably closer to 75% that refuse to tank but let's be generous for the example), and that about 25% of each of the Healer spec players are playing their scuffed 'meme tier' specs for whatever reason (eg Boomkin, Ret Paladin, etc.), then the Tank column is still vastly lower than the Healer one. There's no Healer population issue in that particular MMO.

Of course, it's a recreation of a 20+year old version of the game and has been mathed out almost completely, such that we now know that 'Shadow Priest has horrid MP issues, if you pick Priest you should expect to be playing as Holy and Healing at endgame', so I imagine that the example doesn't count in your mind

edit: looking at one of your links again:



And in the video you linked (with the spreadsheet), I went through and added up the %s for the specs in each role, and got Tanks at 16.12% total, and Healers at 21.74% total. Bearing in mind that Tanks and Healers occupy one slot in the dungeon group of 5 for the content the data was pulled from (Mythic+), the ideal result is that those two roles make up approximately 20% each. So Healer, according to the data for that content, in that particular Season, was overperforming in pickrate slightly.

Also, these two things in the edit are referring to actual Retail WOW, not Classic. Please proofread your citations because they damage whatever argument you thought you were making

[Maltothoris]

If that’s the case, then the overwrite-able (de)buffs should be the last one they’d consider. This is how I came to a conclusion that they never consider anything that’s not 8-man savage/ult when they make these sort of decisions.

Aside from questionable pick, my other problem with these new follow-ups is the fact they are pressed so little amount of times or condensed to one specific type of period in a fight.

And let's nkt forget that in the 7.0 patch note explanation, they added " to increase attack variation, we added the lvl 92 big hits." That itself is an issue with it since especially glare 4 is the only one thatsan gcd while the others are ogcds and psyche only has a 1 minute cd.

[ForsakenRoe]

Playing through Dawntrail MSQ again to level an alt character, and I couldn't help but notice that, when playing as a DPS for the 93 Dungeon (the mountain one), Alisaie takes on the Healer duties there (despite Krile being present, and still presumably knowing how to be a White Mage?). Anyway, as a Healer-RDM, Alisaie keeps the team alive with Vercure, Vercure 3, and VerMedica2. That's all she needs, to cover the required healing for the dungeon. Beyond that, when healing isn't required, she's able to use the Ver-magics to attack (Fire/Stone/Aero/Thunder), and still has access to the melee combo finisher/gauge spender.

So my question, I guess, is: Why can't I play as a Healer with that kind of 'healing action:damage action' kit balance/ratio, if the Trusts (which are designed to be far more simple in what they do, so as to be more 'predictable' in their output) are apparently capable of it?

[Supersnow845]

In recent weeks I’ve noticed the resurgence of what I’m gonna term “the WHM problem” (yes I hate WHM how can you tell) in which an extremely large subset of the playerbase when referring to healers either positively or negatively point to a feeling of “power” or “strength” with WHM.

I’m sure you know the comments I’m referring to- the “it has so many HUGE heals” and “the blood lily just feels so satisfying” despite by every healing metric possible WHM is the absolute worst healer and people find it “easy” because playing it literally forces your cohealer to work harder to compensate for how useless WHM is.

When you have such a disconnection between people’s perception of the power of a healer and its actual relevance what incentive does square have to actually make the other healers unique and powerful; I mean SCH’s healing kit is already 80% of the way there on the “interesting and powerful front” and yet people still think playing “it goes in the square hole” “solving” every mechanic with rapture while the shield healer is running around in a panic trying to do both healers jobs at the same time is the definition of “powerful”

I’m becoming more and more convinced (similar to right back in SB) that nothing will change with healing design until something manages to pull back the curtain for these average players and shows them how garbage WHM actually is or the reverse where fight design changes so that WHM stands on its own two feet and all healers move forward together rather than the current design of WHM being an enforced burden on the shield healers who’s crying wishing for an AST or the other shield healer

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

[...]I’m becoming more and more convinced (similar to right back in SB) that nothing will change with healing design until something manages to pull back the curtain for these average players and shows them how garbage WHM actually is or the reverse where fight design changes so that WHM stands on its own two feet and all healers move forward together rather than the current design of WHM being an enforced burden on the shield healers who’s crying wishing for an AST or the other shield healer

In a similar vein, I too think that healer design will never change until they actually improve WHM instead of sentencing the job into the "for stupids"-box (something that I vehemently despise). And because WHM aren't allowed to grow, so too the other 3 because the disparity would be way too noticeable to common eyes.

To this day I'll never get why of all choices to make healers better from StB to ShB---instead of pushing WHM to stand proudly next to their SCH and AST siblings, they decided to butcher the rest down to WHM degree and sh!t never recovers since then.

Ig it kinda make sense in a way that it lessens their work because this means they're only required to make 1 job for an entire role? lmao

[ForsakenRoe]

In recent weeks I’ve noticed the resurgence of what I’m gonna term “the WHM problem” (yes I hate WHM how can you tell) in which an extremely large subset of the playerbase when referring to healers either positively or negatively point to a feeling of “power” or “strength” with WHM.

I’m sure you know the comments I’m referring to- the “it has so many HUGE heals” and “the blood lily just feels so satisfying” despite by every healing metric possible WHM is the absolute worst healer and people find it “easy” because playing it literally forces your cohealer to work harder to compensate for how useless WHM is.

If such players are motivated more by 'feeling' rather than the numbers behind the job's performance (eg how SGE/SCH have more 'effective HPS' in all content due to having so much more mitigation), then the solution in my mind is simple: rather than trying to convince the players who don't care for/understand the numbers, using numbers, convince them that the update will be fun for them via appealing to their 'feeling' of the job.

For example, take a suggestion I keep repeating:

- Dealing damage or using healing spells generates Gauge (a 0-100 gauge). Healing spells build it far faster.
- Spend 50 Gauge on a strong AOE healing action, which also gives you 3 buffs to your job gauge (I use the term 'Petals'), one for Earth, one for Water, one for Wind.
- With the relevant elemental Petal in your gauge, Stone/Glare upgrade to Quake, Aero/Dia to Tornado, and Water/Banish to Flood. These are AOE (so you can AOE DOT with Tornado, for example), and 'refund' the damage lost by using the healing GCD.

A player who cares about the numbers, will see this idea and say 'ah so I can use a damage neutral heal, and I can build up to it by doing damage. Furthermore, there's a refund attached which can be deployed at a later time compared to when the healing action is used (by a couple of GCDs, you won't want to delay 'pressing Glare' by much), and so I could theoretically use the healing action one GCD before the raidbuff window, then place the refund actions within the burst window for more damage (in the same way that we prepare a Misery outside of raidbuffs, then spend it inside as an optimization)'. Then, that leads to 'can I wrangle my healing rotation in such a way that I can do both, and get Quake, Flood, Tornado AND Misery into the raidbuff window?'

But for a casual player who 'just wants to play the game', what they see from an update like this is cool visual effects, the vaunted 'HUGE heals' that WHM is known for, and the feeling of 'power' as they obliterate dungeon trash packs with Quake/Flood/Tornado, because the animations are so meaty/'impactful'. They'd get to be told by the lore of the game that 'WHM almost ended the world, via their participation in the War of the Magi', and then also get to feel that power, and use that power

[Azurarok]

(despite Krile being present, and still presumably knowing how to be a White Mage?).

iirc she does state her conjury's not nearly as good enough to do it, so I'd imagine she's still only around lv70. CNJ Y'shtola also doesn't have any free healing tools while her dps kit acts like she has some kind of gauge for powerful spells too.

It does make me think that's the healer design they want to go with, but are way too afraid of offending someone to actually do it. The JP boards still get complaints from players who run into dps-chasing SCHs wasting every aetherflow they get on Energy Drain (which I think is a condition that got worse from the 1.5s broil), and whenever I try to bring up dpsing in there, I get shot down because it's assumed hard content will be balanced to require them to fully use that dps kit.

[Maltothoris]

The big of course is how long fights are structured like this, they all will inevitably become stale. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=498577154

Now when you go to the one website, now the values may be a bit different but it's still the same idea.

Edit: Not really that important per say, but it is hilarious that Alisaie has more healer duty supports than Urianger.

[Alice_Rivers]

On WHM, I've been playing more AST (for raids) and SCH (because I don't) and it's never more than a week before I'm revisiting my familiar WHM, it might just be that but no matter how much I want/feel the need to play/practice another healer something keeps pulling me back so WHM is clearly doing something right (even if I can't put a finger on it).