#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

[Aravell]

This would just result in toxicity, because healers are the only role that loses dps due to party making mistakes or co-healer not putting adequate amount of work.

Healer DPS has biggest variance between lower and higher skilled players already - bottom ones do 8K dps, top ones 14k. That is whopping 40% difference.

Now imagine if healer DPS was buffed, then the glare would just be higher potency loss if you had to replace it with medica II or w/e.

And the reason things function this way is because the dev team redesigned it this way. They claim that they don't expect healers to do damage in their design while also making it much harder to do good damage from ShB onwards.

On paper, it looks very easy. Spam your filler, keep your DoT up, use OGCDs to heal. But in practice, the moment something goes wrong and you have to use your GCD for anything other than your filler, you've already lost a chunk of damage.

That's what happens when they delete every other damage spell and shove all the potency into the filler spell, it makes it that much more punishing to drop a cast. The one creating this environment to be toxic in is the one that created this healer design in the first place.

[Rozeee]

snip

Not only that, the one button design just makes the bad healers stand out even more. Instead of "this healer heals/glares too much" it's "we're dying to lack of heals and still meeting enrage on a clean run".

It doesn't matter if content is perfectly tuned for the average party. If the variance is this large for even just one role, the enrage will be too lax/too tight (hint: arcadion and abyssos)

It's the most awful form of skill expression. The fail state punishes bad players by them hitting enrage, the win state punishes good players by sheer boredom.

[Bobby66]

Of course it wouldn't go well, go to literally any job forum and ask them if they'd like a nerf and the only answer you'll ever get back is a "Hell no!".

I think SE should stop caring what the playerbase thinks about nerfs, nobody will ever like getting their favourite job nerfed, but nerfs and buffs are both essential to balance. Look at the Expedient nerf, most SCH mains agreed that 20s of Sprint was too powerful and they accepted that the nerf had to happen.

Are you saying that tanks would throw a tantrum over a nerf when others would accept a nerf for the health of the game? If tanks would throw a tantrum for such a minor reason then I think SE shouldn't listen to them at all at that point.

My point is SE has shown they have a history to overall listen to tank complaints outside of DRK. That is not the case for healers overall. Given their track record if they complain generally something normally gets done about it. So any nerf probably would be short lived unless overall the tank community felt it was warranted.

[sharknado]

Not even. The M4S run with no healers had 2 deaths in it so you don't even need perfect.

Did you clear M4S with no healers? Why PF for M*S is asking for healers to join? Why people aren't moving to PF to run content without healers?

What's possible is not the norm. Blocking content from being run without healers but not changing healers or the content in any other way is not the solution here.

They claim that they don't expect healers to do damage in their design while also making it much harder to do good damage from ShB onwards.

AFAIK their stance is that healers are glare bots and are expected to broil all the way...

That's what happens when they delete every other damage spell and shove all the potency into the filler spell, it makes it that much more punishing to drop a cast. The one creating this environment to be toxic in is the one that created this healer design in the first place.

We will get +5 potency to the dot next patch...

[gllt]

It's very normal for me to be bored in leveling roulette

[Tigore]

@Benji41

I have had a similar case happen with a first 95 boss clear while the healer was dead. The "bubbles" took out the healer and other DPS, but our tank was a WAR. They used Nascent Flash on me using MCH and everything was fine. I did try to use Dismantle and Tactician to help a little bit too. Not sure if the other two players were mad or not, but I did see the light rod emote used to "cheer" for us outside the seal border, lol.

A PLD tank would likely have a similar result. Just replace Nascent Flash with Clemency. GNB might be able to pull it off with Aurora HoTs since I was keeping out of
a lot of the avoidable stuff.

Probably the best "fix" for this would be 2 part. The healing potencies of the mentioned abilities above will have to be dropped down a bit with slightly longer cooldowns introduced. Since the cooldown might make Clemency suck more doing no personal damage, it might need a counter buff to kind of make it DPS neutral by increasing the DPS dealt for the ally target and / or themselves. Possibly have the DPS buff trigger if actual healing happened with overheals not counting? Needs discussion if this might be alright.

[Silver-Strider]

Did you clear M4S with no healers?

I don't get why people ask this question as though its some sort of gotcha. It's not as, even if I did clear with no healers, it would just get dismissed as I'm part of the 1% capable of doing so. If anything, if more people do clear without healers, the question becomes more of a joke rather than an argument for your stance and works against you. If a week 2 clear is possible, it stands to reason that a week 3/4/5/6/etc would only be easier as more and more people gear out with BiS equipment to further trivialize it.

Why PF for M*S is asking for healers to join? Why people aren't moving to PF to run content without healers?
What's possible is not the norm. Blocking content from being run without healers but not changing healers or the content in any other way is not the solution here.

Skill Issue?
People don't want to play the jobs that enable no healer clears?
Too much of a hassle to change the 2 healer slots for Tank/DPS slots?
People aren't comfortable with that set up?

There's plenty of reasons for why they aren't doing it, that doesn't invalidate the ever decreasing need for healers to complete content though. All it takes is for SE to just decide "screw it" and give everyone the PvP medpacks to heal themselves with in all content and then what? What argument will you have to justify healers then? Why are we waiting for this problem to become widespread instead of nipping it in the bud, especially since it's already been given 5 years to spread its root into the game. It's only going to get worse from here on so I don't see why people continue to argue against fixing the problem as though it doesn't exist

[Sharawiwi]

@Benji41

I have had a similar case happen with a first 95 boss clear while the healer was dead. The "bubbles" took out the healer and other DPS, but our tank was a WAR. They used Nascent Flash on me using MCH and everything was fine. I did try to use Dismantle and Tactician to help a little bit too. Not sure if the other two players were mad or not, but I did see the light rod emote used to "cheer" for us outside the seal border, lol.

A PLD tank would likely have a similar result. Just replace Nascent Flash with Clemency. GNB might be able to pull it off with Aurora HoTs since I was keeping out of
a lot of the avoidable stuff.

Probably the best "fix" for this would be 2 part. The healing potencies of the mentioned abilities above will have to be dropped down a bit with slightly longer cooldowns introduced. Since the cooldown might make Clemency suck more doing no personal damage, it might need a counter buff to kind of make it DPS neutral by increasing the DPS dealt for the ally target and / or themselves. Possibly have the DPS buff trigger if actual healing happened with overheals not counting? Needs discussion if this might be alright.

Even in EW it was possible with a GNB & 3 DPS to do every 90 dungeons, thanks to corindon's heart , a 900 potency heal every 25% and a mitigation, activating either at 50% or at the end of cooldown, which you can cast on someone else.
Now it's even better, with nebuale as GNB you're truly immortal, I don't really know why we don't hear as much about it compared to WAr, because it can definitely do the same in the hand of a competent player, maybe it's because GNB is a hard job to play relative to WAR.

[sharknado]

I have had a similar case happen with a first 95 boss clear while the healer was dead. The "bubbles" took out the healer

Healer is easy to kill while also having to look at party frames

The healing potencies of the mentioned abilities above will have to be dropped down a bit with slightly longer cooldowns introduced.

To what end? If the encounter is flawless the tank can usually carry, but not on every boss. With how easy it is to kill a healer/DPS having healer dead = wipe is not the best situation If healers would be more resilient then probably yes.

If a week 2 clear is possible, it stands to reason that a week 3/4/5/6/etc would only be easier as more and more people gear out with BiS equipment to further trivialize it.

This game is very easy to cheese with specific jobs. Cheese should not affect job design/balance (unless it's the cheese itself causing imbalance).

All it takes is for SE to just decide "screw it" and give everyone the PvP medpacks to heal themselves with in all content and then what? What argument will you have to justify healers then?

Or they will copy Ivalice mechanic bringing everyone to 1HP and healers have to top everyone up few times to prevent cheese but not changing anything beside it. Still glare-botting.

It's only going to get worse from here on so I don't see why people continue to argue against fixing the problem as though it doesn't exist

Cheese isn't the root cause of it and they will not re-do the whole game by changing how they see each trinity element. And if they see that they can get away with putting a singular mechanic next savage tier they will and call it a victory.

We should rather focus on directing them in making healers fun to play as that can be done without blowing up the game. This will mean we won't be healing 24/7 but at least when we are not we have something more meaningful and interesting to do than to glare-bot.

[Silver-Strider]

This game is very easy to cheese with specific jobs. Cheese should not affect job design/balance (unless it's the cheese itself causing imbalance).

How is weaving in oGCD heals classified as cheese? MNK, RPR, DNC, SMN, PLD, WAR, and GNB all have oGCD heals that can replicate what a Healer offers. That isn't cheese, that's just using the tools the game has given to these jobs to supplement in place of a healer. If that's your idea of cheese, then Healers are the full on cow because that's all they do now.

Or they will copy Ivalice mechanic bringing everyone to 1HP and healers have to top everyone up few times to prevent cheese but not changing anything beside it. Still glare-botting.

They could also remove all the heals on every job except healers and it would accomplish the same thing, which is one of the chief complaint that the strike brings up. Everyone has too much damn healing and SE continues to add more to every job every expansion. It's a problem and has been a problem since ShB.