#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

[ForsakenRoe]

I'll be the one to say it - so go play a healer in those other games. I'm going to step back and look at the big picture here. If you love healing in a bunch of other games, it stands to reason that FFXIV does something fundamentally different with healing. It also stands to reason that other people might enjoy healing in this game, but not all of those other games. You have a bunch of options for playing a game where you like healing. Those people have only one option - this game. But your desire is to take even that away from them just so you can have yet another game where you like healing. Not a fan of that position.

Oh, and for the record, this weekend was the second one in a row where all of my queues for the Arcadion series were instant on Tank but took a few minutes on Healer. Where's the new goalpost going to be set up?

And yet, that same logic never applied when HW/SB healing was current, and people were complaining that it's too hard/inaccessible. I don't recall many voices from players who had mastered Cleric Stance dancing saying 'play another game if you can't keep up with how healing works here'. It seems very one-sided, in that players who like the current healing design are adamant about keeping it, whereas those who liked the older design (eg me) are told to pound sand

The problem with people suggesting 'go play another game', is that some players WILL go play another game. And they won't necessarily come back to this one. Eventually, all of the veterans of the role will be gone, and the game's healer population will be comprised more and more of the kind of players who are struggling with the slight bump in difficulty in levelling dungeons. Your suggestion of 'play another game' would, taken to its logical conclusion, kill this game

Meanwhile, I'm asking for a compromise position, where your preferred gameplay for healers (one nuke, one DOT) is like 95% of the effectiveness of the 'optimal' rotation (as in, if you ignored all 3 DOTs on my SCH design you'd lose less than a Broil a minute worth of damage, and I know most players are already losing more than that due to movement/healing GCDs), making the extra damage actions effectively 'optional depth for those that want it' akin to doing a nonstandard gameplay on a job for a small DPS gain, but I guess having a difference in output between someone doing the 'current' gameplay and a hypothetical 'more complex rotation' means that the person doing the 'current' gameplay would feel bad that they're not doing their full potential damage. Never mind that there's like, 5 fights per 8 months where having 'the full potential damage' actually matters (Savages and the Ultimate)

[CaptainLagbeard]

I'll be the one to say it - so go play a healer in those other games. I'm going to step back and look at the big picture here. If you love healing in a bunch of other games, it stands to reason that FFXIV does something fundamentally different with healing. It also stands to reason that other people might enjoy healing in this game, but not all of those other games. You have a bunch of options for playing a game where you like healing. Those people have only one option - this game. But your desire is to take even that away from them just so you can have yet another game where you like healing. Not a fan of that position.

If you wish the game to become ever increasingly casual, then go ahead and keep telling people to ignore problems and stop asking for complexity and difficulty.
I would personally rather they start taking steps of actually fix the game, instead of continuing downhill.

And if healers are fine, then I suppose every other role is wrongly designed and every Job needs to be trimmed down to 2-3 buttons as well...

[Azurarok]

In general FFXIV older heal kit lacked oGCDs because the system was designed around Healers balancing damage dealing and healing as seperate gameplay [...] The old healer kit was well designed in that way, there were some odd choices, cleric stance will always be controversal but overall the pre-50 healing kit made sense in the context of healers main system of them all being damage dealing casters who had to balance heals.

I get that was the historical context. I'm just saying they should've added things to keep stuff like Cure a core part of healing instead of pushing them aside.

Also Cure~Curaga's a staple to the series and it feels wrong that they're rarely used now.

WHM system with Lilys is a good compromise for GCD heals in the current game design. Bringing up WoW like I usually do, heals in that game are rarely sacrificeless too but this is normally because healers in wow have assize like DPS options, heals usually used as general regen for constant damage that also act as ways to deal damage

And yes I like how lilies give free GCD heals, but couldn't they have done stuff like making all GCD healing feed the blood lily? Make the whole kit is usable without loss instead of just 2 buttons. Add more stacks and reduce charge time on Thin Air and have it reduce cast times for mobility and MP saving instead.

SGE really should be the type that does attack + heal simultaneously since Kardia and Pneuma already are a step in that direction and it'd differentiate itself from WHM better. Tag an enemy with some kind of reverse Kardion that damages them when you GCD heal.

Damage from those two jobs only come from themselves so I think there should be more for them for dps-lossless healing

[Connor]

I

Also Cure~Curaga's a staple to the series and it feels wrong that they're rarely used

I’ve honestly thought this for so long so it’s nice to see someone else put it into words lol.

Like, you ask a Final Fantasy fan what kind of spells a Black Mage uses, they’d say ‘Fire/Blizzard/Thunder’. Which naturally are the fundamental core of Black Mage’s design.

You ask a Final Fantasy fan what kind of spells a White Mage uses, they’re likely going to say ‘Cure/Protect/Shell’. Those are the fundamental spells for any FF White Mage, but in XIV they either literally don’t exist anymore, or exist as completely irrelevant and essentially unusable spells like Cure. Cura / Curaga are more valuable, but at the same time they’re still mostly replaced by Afflatus Solace/Rapture because of Misery.

It’s sad to me that for most jobs they’ve (generally) stayed fairly faithful to what traditional ff players have come to except from the jobs, but then you get White Mage and the only ‘ff white mage’ thing they really do now is cast Holy III (Holyga? lol)

Also as an aside EN naming conventions for spells make me kinda sad. To me it’ll always be Cure/Cura/Curaga/Curaja for FF spells lol, especially with how weirdly the numbering system works (going from Holy to Holy III lol). Feels like it’d be more ‘fan-servicey’ to use the standard naming rather than numbers lol, ‘like a real Final Fantasy’. To me anyway lol

[CaptainLagbeard]

Cure 2 would probably need to have it's potency doubled to be preferable over Tetragrammaton or even Solace...

[GrimGale]

DPS have low sustain and low defense but high damage potential

TANKS have high sustain and high defense but average damage potential

HEALERS have high sustain and low defense and low damage potential

If tanks can compete with healers in the (needed) sustain department, healers should be able to compete with tanks in the damage department.

As it is now, the highest of the healers can barely reach the damage of the lowest of the tanks.

[ralphthemagician]

I just heard about this thread from a random YouTube video and thought I'd chime in my 2¢, for what it's worth, which is probably nothing.

I mainly enjoy playing healer/support in MMORPGs. I found refuge in FFXIV a few years ago and used to love playing healer in this game. Not anymore. I only started playing a few years ago, but even in that short time the way all jobs have homogenized has kind of spoiled it for me. I get that it makes the game more accessible, and I get that it makes the game easier to play solo… but the magic of the "MMO"—for me—is actually lost.

Won't happen, but I think any health regen should be removed from every non-healer class and mitigations reduced across the board. Otherwise, just get rid of the healer class all together and buff their DPS. Tanks, Magic DPS, Physical DPS, Ranged-Physical DPS and everyone gets heals—because honestly that's how it is now, only 4 of the 6 Magic DPS have really weak DPS. All the healers have really cool and fun DPS rotations. Or maybe rename "healing" to "support" and just focus on the buffs/debfuffs. You could just switch a few of the healing spells to combat buffs/debuffs and call it a day. White Mage and Scholar can play similar to Black Mage and Summoner and Astrologian and Sage can play more like Bard.

[Ayalu]

Its nice to hear new voices from outside of the typical Forum Visitors, it showes that the problem described exists and gets perceived even without the Strike.
Because some people act and tell others that its just a handful of people being loud without any substance behind the critic.
And well new people that saw it before show that this isnt the case.

[Ramiee]

I get that was the historical context. I'm just saying they should've added things to keep stuff like Cure a core part of healing instead of pushing them aside.

Also Cure~Curaga's a staple to the series and it feels wrong that they're rarely used now.

Part of the problem is the general playerbase of MMOs have gotten better, we have more resources to get better at pretty much any game in the world. In MMOs the priority is always doing as little non DPS actions as possible and as many DPS actions as possible, it's why GCD healing is removed from play if it's made possible in the game. This happens in WoW and GW2 as well, learn as much about your class and encounter as you can so you spend more time damage dealing than healing.
GCD heals will always be low priority for high end healer players because of how MMO playerbase thinks.

And yes I like how lilies give free GCD heals, but couldn't they have done stuff like making all GCD healing feed the blood lily? Make the whole kit is usable without loss instead of just 2 buttons. Add more stacks and reduce charge time on Thin Air and have it reduce cast times for mobility and MP saving instead.

SGE really should be the type that does attack + heal simultaneously since Kardia and Pneuma already are a step in that direction and it'd differentiate itself from WHM better. Tag an enemy with some kind of reverse Kardion that damages them when you GCD heal.

Damage from those two jobs only come from themselves so I think there should be more for them for dps-lossless healing

Well for WHM they should just make all non- lily heals have a chance of procing sacred sight to start with. I always believed the best way to handle WHM is to remove all oGCD heals off of it but have it have mechanics to charge it's DPS to refund the damage from that missed GCD, like how blood lolly works. It makes WHM a pretty easy entry level job because new players will be able to understand heals make my attacks stronger so I should do both.

There's tons of ways you can handle the other healers having sacrificeless heals, technically scholar is built around it since you can use your fairy to heal quite a bunch. But yes if there's going to be bloated healing kits because of the archaic design of "healers should just heal" they should at least make the healing actually fun.

[Ramiee]

The oldest excuse in the book and it’s posted by striker of all people.

What’s more predictable, that current savage content is clearable without healers, or striker is the first to rush to defend this problem and deflect to problems with the strike instead

Like I at least change my arguments up now and again, get some new material please

I don't read what they post.
It is funny that they are so against this strike but also thinks it's useless but still tries to convince people that they think the terribly designed role isn't terribly designed and that we just don't like it.
Right below a post that shows healerless run week 2 and tank only run week 2, it's pretty funny.