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  1. #1
    Player
    Kohashi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2024
    Posts
    681
    Character
    Lucaon Soho
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Maltothoris View Post
    Also look at how prevalent that MTTT is starting to become. First we had M1S with raining cats and now we have the ice phase in ex3. Heck even the stack that tries to force the swap with the tethers can still easily be ignored with invulns and of course we have reject authority.
    But how is that SE's fault? It's a solution the players found. What exactly do you want them to do? Apply a dot like p5s or p8s so you cannot simply take the same hit again. It is an EX fight only.
    Every mechanic has several ways of being solved. It's absolutely normal for the players to find and use the brain-dead strategies that offer the most consistent results. You can solve every mechanic in the "intended way" and how you see fit if you wish.
    (2)

  2. #2
    Player
    Absurdity's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    3,121
    Character
    Tiana Vestoria
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Kohashi View Post
    But how is that SE's fault? It's a solution the players found. What exactly do you want them to do? Apply a dot like p5s or p8s so you cannot simply take the same hit again. It is an EX fight only.
    Every mechanic has several ways of being solved. It's absolutely normal for the players to find and use the brain-dead strategies that offer the most consistent results. You can solve every mechanic in the "intended way" and how you see fit if you wish.
    That's how it ideally should be.

    Over the years however this has become increasingly sparse. We see it more and more in both mechanics and job design that the devs do not want player agency, they see it as a failure when we don't execute fights the "intended" way.
    Damage downs on any hit that you were supposed to dodge, body check instant wipes, completely rigid rotations and mechanics dances, things like the ice phase tether in the current extreme are by far the minority.
    (3)
    Last edited by Absurdity; 11-18-2024 at 07:56 PM.

  3. #3
    Player
    Kohashi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2024
    Posts
    681
    Character
    Lucaon Soho
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Absurdity View Post
    That's how it ideally should be.

    Over the years however this has become increasingly sparse. We see it more and more in both mechanics and job design that the devs do not want player agency, they see it as a failure when we don't play the game the "intended" way.
    Damage downs on any hit that you were supposed to dodge, body check instant wipes, completely rigid rotations and execution of mechanics, things like the ice phase tether in the current extreme are by far the minority.
    and it is. Join a blind pro group and find your own way to solve the same mechanic.

    Just because people adopt Hector, Rinon, Kobe, or whatever other guide maker says, SE is not removing the player's agency. The only intended way SE wants you is to solve the mechanic and not stand in bad, the rest is up to you. It's absolutely normal for you to be penalized if you fail to resolve a mechanic.

    In addition, every single game that I have played had this "rigid" (optimal) rotation that offered the biggest and most consistent damage or ways to solve mechanics. TERA, WOW, Dragon NEST, Blade and Soul, Guild Wars 2 (just to name only a few), hell even League of Legends which is a MOBA also has a very rigid way of handling lanes and farming as well as skirmish encounters.

    I am not even sure what exactly people want at this point apart from complaining.
    (0)

  4. #4
    Player Mortex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Posts
    967
    Character
    Rigor Mortex
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Kohashi View Post
    But how is that SE's fault? It's a solution the players found. What exactly do you want them to do? Apply a dot like p5s or p8s so you cannot simply take the same hit again. It is an EX fight only.
    Every mechanic has several ways of being solved. It's absolutely normal for the players to find and use the brain-dead strategies that offer the most consistent results. You can solve every mechanic in the "intended way" and how you see fit if you wish.
    Like how they wanted in uwu for Garuda to be awoken in the bubble phase and people just taking 2 stack on a caster for the tether from the adds to do it almost at the end of the phase completely ignoring the “new mechanics”.
    (0)

  5. #5
    Player
    Kohashi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2024
    Posts
    681
    Character
    Lucaon Soho
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Mortex View Post
    Like how they wanted in uwu for Garuda to be awoken in the bubble phase and people just taking 2 stack on a caster for the tether from the adds to do it almost at the end of the phase completely ignoring the “new mechanics”.
    I have only seen Garuda's In/out mechanic a handful of times, I very rarely see Ifrit's dashes to the point I have no clue how to solve it now (lol). Ultima probably has less skip since it actually leaves the arena for a while.
    (0)

  6. #6
    Player
    BunnyQueen's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2022
    Posts
    205
    Character
    Flora Kosaki
    World
    Golem
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 100
    They need to go back and adjust all dungeons level sync, hard sync all stats, boost standard damage, make more damage unavoidable. Boom both tank and healer are more engaging.
    (0)
    #FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

  7. #7
    Player
    AmiableApkallu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2021
    Posts
    1,190
    Character
    Tatanpa Nononpa
    World
    Zalera
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by BunnyQueen View Post
    They need to go back and adjust all dungeons level sync, hard sync all stats, boost standard damage, make more damage unavoidable. Boom both tank and healer are more engaging.
    It's not only the quantity of damage that could do with some tweaking. It's also the pacing.

    Predictable damage can provide only so much engagement. Predictable means it eventually becomes rote.

    Crit autos need to make a come back. Random chip damage to random party members. Non-fatal mechanics where the likely outcome is that people avoid some but not all of the outgoing damage. Etc.
    (0)

  8. #8
    Player
    KageTokage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    7,093
    Character
    Alijana Tumet
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Ninja Lv 100
    It's awkward that I felt more satisfied healing Byakko unreal then any of the current savage fights simply because you're actually allowed to cover for mistakes due to virtually none of the mechanics being immediately lethal and you can potentially survive things like the expanding AoEs overlapping, too few people in stack markers, or the add being too healthy by layering mitigation and timing heals.

    Granted, the fight is easier as a consequence but it made me actually feel like I was playing my role better.
    (3)

  9. #9
    Player
    Aravell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    2,044
    Character
    J'thaldi Rhid
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 100
    The thing is, "balance so every job is viable" is a giant lie. The reason some jobs are not viable in certain fights in the first place is because of the move towards rigidity over flexibility.

    Back in HW, if we had extended movement phases, BRD can choose to drop Minuet or spam Feint for less of a damage loss than simply not attacking. Even as recently as in EW, standard BLM rotation was said to be garbage for TOP p6, so BLM players worked around it with alternate lines.

    The reason we have jobs that suck in certain fights rests squarely on the fact that the dev team forced every job into only one correct way of playing, there's no flexibility, there's no creativity, the job either sucks for that fight or it doesn't, so they try and "solve" this problem of their own creation by making the jobs that suck more like the jobs that don't suck.
    (10)

  10. #10
    Player
    Supersnow845's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2021
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    6,917
    Character
    Andreas Cestelle
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    BLM especially is constantly getting hamstrung by the fact that the devs only design for hard mechanics these days is arena wide marathons and they really just don’t seem to know how to actually deal with casters

    It’s like they design every mechanic for melee and tanks which instantly invalidates phys ranged advantage then tries (and often fails) to shove the casters into this design and it just doesn’t work a lot of the time
    (2)
    As a healer main in this game for nigh on 14 years all I can say is that I’m tired. My role has been eroded of complexity and expression for 3 expansions. I’ve watched the tanks do my role for me for 2 expansions and my feedback and critiques continue to fall on deaf ears.

    I have no idea who modern healers are designed for but I know now it’s not me. This is the first expansion I’m truly considering dropping the healer role and not returning, so if that was the goal- congratulations I guess

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