#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

[Maltothoris]

Indeed, the freecure trait is a trap while meeica 2/3 is just extremely niche for tue most part, in part because they just keep adding ogcds to healers and other classes.

Of course, now we know the no healer top certainly hit a nerve or two in regards to lb gauge generation now being nil if you have duplicate clsses. It most certainly isn't the only reason but I'm sure it started conversation around it.

[OliviaLugria]

The lb gen for ulti is really just dunking on such a small subset of people it's funny

[Absurdity]

Of course, now we know the no healer top certainly hit a nerve or two in regards to lb gauge generation now being nil if you have duplicate clsses. It most certainly isn't the only reason but I'm sure it started conversation around it.

Why fix the actual underlying issue when you can slap a bandaid on the problem?

I'm just waiting for the no healer clear where they replace them with jobs that aren't duplicates so we ultimately end up with an enforced party composition of 2 tanks, 2 healers and 4 dps, lol.

[Alice_Rivers]

I stand by my use of the word trap to describe Medica 2 insofar as I detailed in that post. That's not to say that it is without use, far from it, when there's a partywide DoT or a long gap between large hits or you have to care about that one idiot who insists on being as far away from you as the game allows and really deseres his fate but for the coming mechanic. When it's useful, it's very useful, but that doesn't change the fact that it appears to be an obvious thing to keep up all the time, wasting vast quantities of MP - Thereby being a trap.

Coming back to the current topic of discussion though - I don't think there's anything wrong per se about healers being "the girlfriend/wife" role, I do however think it wrong for that to become an excuse to water a role down. Keep it simple at it's core? Yes. Keep a low skill floor? By all means, but insult people's inteligence? Nah. And yes, I'm saying that the current healer-tank-content relationship is insulting the inteligence of healer players. When you havehealers regularly asking "why am I here?" you know you're doing it wrong.

[Kacho_Nacho]

I stand by my use of the word trap to describe Medica 2 insofar as I detailed in that post. That's not to say that it is without use, far from it, when there's a party wide DoT or a long gap between large hits or you have to care about that one idiot who insists on being as far away from you as the game allows and really deserves his fate but for the coming mechanic. When it's useful, it's very useful, but that doesn't change the fact that it appears to be an obvious thing to keep up all the time, wasting vast quantities of MP - Thereby being a trap.

Now, the more knowledgeable healers pointed it out to me, I can't help to view Medica II & III as a trap. But, it's a trap with some caveats.

First, there is no doubt that the spells have a place in the toolkit of white mages. They are meant to use their gcd heals.

The trap lies in the over-reliance on Medica II and III. As you say, it seems a no brainer to keep the party-wide rolling reg up.

That's the actual trap. It's not necessary and does nothing but overheal the party while draining your MP. To say it another way, the trap is the belief that a healer has to keep everyone's health bars at 100%.

Coming back to the current topic of discussion though - I don't think there's anything wrong per se about healers being "the girlfriend/wife" role, I do however think it wrong for that to become an excuse to water a role down. Keep it simple at its core? Yes. Keep a low skill floor? By all means, but insult people's intelligence? Nah. And yes, I'm saying that the current healer-tank-content relationship is insulting the intelligence of healer players. When you have healers regularly asking "why am I here?" you know you're doing it wrong.

I don't view healers as the girlfriend/wife role. I view as the role people who enjoy being the supporter play. Almost all the healers I've known are individuals who suffer from health issues. So, there is definitely an empathic personality angle to consider when looking at the players who enjoy being healers.

I agree it is wrong to use the idea of healers being the girlfriend's/wife's job as an excuse to keep the role watered down. But, I feel the #FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE is swimming against a strong current.

Square Enix and the Japanese forums just don't understand what we are saying. Everything we write is misconstrued because of their strong built in worldview.

We ask for more dps options, they say we should play dps if we want to deal damage. We ask for challenge, we are told to do ultimates, and etc...

At this point, I don't have any real hope for 8.0. I think we're going to be very disappointed by what Square Enix comes up with.

[Alice_Rivers]

To open, I didn't actually accuse anyone of viewing healers as anything, I just saw that stand out to me and made what I thought to be a valid point on it.

The way I see it, from SE's perspective, they're stuck between a rock and a hard place. They had complicated healers and people didn't get on with them so they oversimplified healers, now they have that and a happy JP customer base on one side and on the other you have an English speaking (and maybe others, I haven't looked) saying they want harder healers but can't seem to decide on what "harder" means - Does it mean a rotation? Does it mean Cleric Stance? Both? Does it mean more dps buttons? Higher healing requirements? How high? WoW? If I were SE I might be inclined to cut my losses and just accept unhappy EN forum healers.

Personally, as someone who wants to see productive movement on the subject I would suggest SE run an ingame poll, then publish the data by Data Centre for us to discuss and maybe find a direction of travel. Maybe this could be the first of a series of polls that decide where things go, what people like/don't like, maybe even broad whys for those.

[Kacho_Nacho]

To open, I didn't actually accuse anyone of viewing healers as anything, I just saw that stand out to me and made what I thought to be a valid point on it.

The way I see it, from SE's perspective, they're stuck between a rock and a hard place. They had complicated healers and people didn't get on with them so they oversimplified healers, now they have that and a happy JP customer base on one side and on the other you have an English speaking (and maybe others, I haven't looked) saying they want harder healers but can't seem to decide on what "harder" means - Does it mean a rotation? Does it mean Cleric Stance? Both? Does it mean more dps buttons? Higher healing requirements? How high? WoW? If I were SE I might be inclined to cut my losses and just accept unhappy EN forum healers.

Oh, I don't feel you were accusing anyone of anything. We both are just pointing something out that we've noticed. I agree Square Enix painted themselves in the corner with regards to healers. I should have been clearer that I feel the English forum posters are going to be the ones disappointed by what Square Enix comes up with in 8.0. I feel the Japanese forum posters will be happy overall.

Personally, as someone who wants to see productive movement on the subject I would suggest SE run an ingame poll, then publish the data by Data Centre for us to discuss and maybe find a direction of travel. Maybe this could be the first of a series of polls that decide where things go, what people like/don't like, maybe even broad whys for those.

I would love to see that. I used to play Dofus and Ankama came up with a poll which asked their players how each class currently rates and how they should ideally rate on on a scale of 1 to 10 based upon five parameters, The Ability To Deal Damage, The Ability To Survive, The Ability To Apply Buffs, The Ability To Affect The Mobility Of Themselves Or Others, and The Ability To Apply Debuffs.

This gave Ankama a pentagon shaped diagram for each class indicating what areas to adjust. I feel Square Enix should adopt a similar approach.

Here's one for Fecas, a tank class.


Here's one for Eniripsa, a healer class.


Here's one for is for Ouginaks, a damage dealing class.

[Maltothoris]

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...0942c5fec5303e

Well the patch notes are out now. The Mp changes are just to SCH/SGE reducing their shield mp cost by 100. Also, whm and sge getting the buffs that I thought they were going to get back when I thought there would be a patch 7.07 or a 7.08.

Edit: Well the made esuna instant as well and SGE, as of now doesn't have an reasons behind its buffs atm.

[Pyth]

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...0942c5fec5303e

Well the patch notes are out now. The Mp changes are just to SCH/SGE reducing their shield mp cost by 100. Also, whm and sge getting the buffs that I thought they were going to get back when I thought there would be a patch 7.07 or a 7.08.

WHM changes are so disappointing. These are changes that should have been given last patch. Healers really get paid dust

[Maltothoris]

The other thing that's funny is they forgot SGE as of now.

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/jobgu.../#battleaction

AS of now there is no SGE section which I know they will update.