#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

[ForsakenRoe]

I was thinking about WAR's Shake it Off last night, and how ridiculously strong and 'one size fits all' it actually is. It gets it's 300p instant heal at 76, before that it's a 500p total regen. After 76, though, it goes to the current 800p total, plus a shield for 15% of the target's Max HP. All on a 90s CD. For comparisons:

• WHM's Medica 2/AST's Aspected Helios, for the majority of levelling (pre-85 trait) is 700p total (200p, plus 5 ticks of 100p). So, in content between 76 and 85 (such as TEA), a WAR has an action that out-heals a 'pure healer'.
• AST's Collective Unconscious is 500p (plus 10% mit) on a 60s CD. Celestial Opposition is 200p, plus 500 over 15s (total 700), on a 60s CD. Earthly Star is 720p when fully charged, on a 60s CD.
• SCH's Whispering Dawn is 7 ticks of 80p, totalling 560p.
• SGE's Holos is probably one of the most direct comparisons, being 300p shield, 300p healing, and 10% mit, but on a 120s CD.
• SGE's Pneuma is 600p, or 900 when boosted by Zoe, also on a 120s CD.

Or how about BloodWhetting (400p per attack, you can get 3 within its 6s Duration, plus a 300p shield upon use, 25s CD). Even when using it in Single Target (so, 1200p healing), you get comparisons like these:

• WHM's Cure 2/AST's Benefic 2, post level 85, is 800p, and costs damage (because it's a GCD)
• AST's Essential Dignity scales up to a maximum of 900p, on a 40s CD, compared to Bloodwhetting's 25s
• WHM's Divine Benison is 500p shielding, on a 30s Recharge time.
• AST's Celestial Intersection is 200p heal, 400p shielding, on a 30s Recharge time.
• SCH/SGE's Adlo/Eukrasian Diagnosis, are 300p healing, 540p shielding, for a total of 840p 'effective health'. At the cost of damage, since they're GCDs
• SCH's Lustrate and Excog are 650p and 750p respectively. SGE's Druochole and Taurochole are 650 and 750p respectively. Excog/Taurochole have 45s CDs, and all four take a resource you obtain once per 20s (on average)

And that's not to mention, if you use Nascent Flash on someone in the party, not only do THEY get the healing, the WAR still does too! This means that WAR can output 2400p of healing (split between themselves and another ally) every 25s. For free.

The TLDR of this is that 'Shake it Off and Bloodwhetting are the Swiss Army Knife of FFXIV actions'. It's destructive to the Trinity that a Tank has a skill that can heal for more than some of the Healer's skills. I don't know what SE were thinking when they decided on these potencies for WAR, but all I can assume is 'one of the devs who worked on WAR, happens to be a WAR main'. Some suggest that we should have 'more healing required', as the way to 'fix' Healers. But with potencies like this on WAR, I don't think we fully grasp the sheer amount of additional 'healing required' we'd actually need, to burden WAR back down from godhood. As long as Bloodwhetting is able to heal 'once per enemy hit' instead of 'once per action used', it's going to remain 'king of the dungeon'

[Absurdity]

The TLR of this is that 'Shake it Off is the Swiss Army Knife of FFXIV actions'. It's destructive to the Trinity that a Tank has a skill that can heal for more than some of the Healer's skills. I don't know what SE were thinking when they decided on these potencies for WAR, but all I can assume is 'one of the devs who worked on WAR, happens to be a WAR main'.

Which is still very questionable, because outside of it's "one size fits all"-buttons the actual gameplay loop of the job is one of the most bland and unbelievably boring out there.
Yeah sure, the job is overtuned.
But I could just make a job that spams nothing but it's 1-2-3 filler as the gameplay, that filler then has 800-1200-2000 potency. It would be very strong, but would it actually be well-designed?

[Rithy255]

Snip

Good thing to keep in mind is Tank healing potencies are weaker then healer potencies, healers (and casters) have a passive that boost their healing by 30%.

Regardless of that shake it off is still a really strong skill (bloodwhetting too), I think PLD/WAR could have their aoe barriers reworked so that they give out a regen once the barrier breaks for 50-100 potency (50 potency if it's too strong at 100), they should remove the general bursty heal effects from both.

[Absurdity]

Good thing to keep in mind is Tank healing potencies are weaker then healer potencies, healers (and casters) have a passive that boost their healing by 30%.

Regardless of that shake it off is still a really strong skill (bloodwhetting too), I think PLD/WAR could have their aoe barriers reworked so that they give out a regen once the barrier breaks for 50-100 potency (50 potency if it's too strong at 100), they should remove the general bursty heal effects from both.

I always like the idea of adding a skill element to these effect, it's why I vastly prefer the way Nascent Flash worked in ShB.
So my idea for Shake It Off, if we want to keep the healing aspect, was to make it give the party x% life leech for a few seconds, meaning that it could either be quite good or completely meh depending on when you use it and how well your team members can utilize the window.

[Tunda]

I was thinking about WAR's Shake it Off last night, and how ridiculously strong and 'one size fits all' it actually is. It gets it's 300p instant heal at 76, before that it's a 500p total regen. After 76, though, it goes to the current 800p total, plus a shield for 15% of the target's Max HP. All on a 90s CD. For comparisons:

• WHM's Medica 2/AST's Aspected Helios, for the majority of levelling (pre-85 trait) is 700p total (200p, plus 5 ticks of 100p). So, in content between 76 and 85 (such as TEA), a WAR has an action that out-heals a 'pure healer'.
• AST's Collective Unconscious is 500p (plus 10% mit) on a 60s CD. Celestial Opposition is 200p, plus 500 over 15s (total 700), on a 60s CD. Earthly Star is 720p when fully charged, on a 60s CD.
• SCH's Whispering Dawn is 7 ticks of 80p, totalling 560p.
• SGE's Holos is probably one of the most direct comparisons, being 300p shield, 300p healing, and 10% mit, but on a 120s CD.
• SGE's Pneuma is 600p, or 900 when boosted by Zoe, also on a 120s CD.

Or how about BloodWhetting (400p per attack, you can get 3 within its 6s Duration, plus a 300p shield upon use, 25s CD). Even when using it in Single Target (so, 1200p healing), you get comparisons like these:

• WHM's Cure 2/AST's Benefic 2, post level 85, is 800p, and costs damage (because it's a GCD)
• AST's Essential Dignity scales up to a maximum of 900p, on a 40s CD, compared to Bloodwhetting's 25s
• WHM's Divine Benison is 500p shielding, on a 30s Recharge time.
• AST's Celestial Intersection is 200p heal, 400p shielding, on a 30s Recharge time.
• SCH/SGE's Adlo/Eukrasian Diagnosis, are 300p healing, 540p shielding, for a total of 840p 'effective health'. At the cost of damage, since they're GCDs
• SCH's Lustrate and Excog are 650p and 750p respectively. SGE's Druochole and Taurochole are 650 and 750p respectively. Excog/Taurochole have 45s CDs, and all four take a resource you obtain once per 20s (on average)

And that's not to mention, if you use Nascent Flash on someone in the party, not only do THEY get the healing, the WAR still does too! This means that WAR can output 2400p of healing (split between themselves and another ally) every 25s. For free.
'

If everyone is getting heals and shields why someone want to play healer? This role is a complete mess

[ForsakenRoe]

Good thing to keep in mind is Tank healing potencies are weaker then healer potencies, healers (and casters) have a passive that boost their healing by 30%.

Bastard trait, it always slips my mind. Still, that puts the WHM Medica 2 comparison value from 700p, to 910, pre-level-85. Which is still alarmingly close to WAR's 800p from SIO. That's the issue at hand, that WAR's actions encroach on the potency level of Healer actions, despite not being a Healer.

I also forgot to list Equilibrium, which, thanks to the HOT trait, becomes a total of 2700p selfhealing, for free, every 60s

If everyone is getting heals and shields why someone want to play healer? This role is a complete mess

Say it louder for the guys at the back. Why did MNK need a selfheal HOT on Riddle of Earth? You mitigate damage when you use it to defend against an attack, that's already the 'bonus for using it well', it didn't need a HOT too. Now in DT it's going to give access to a followup move that does 500p of AOE healing. Why? Monk already supported Healers by being able to grant Mantra, this new AOE heal is completely unnecessary. RPR got its 500p Regen from breaking Arcane Crest reduced to 250p because it was so good. Now we're just repeating the same mistakes on MNK?

[Aravell]

RPR got its 500p Regen from breaking Arcane Crest reduced to 250p because it was so good. Now we're just repeating the same mistakes on MNK?

If you look at the history of the game so far, mistakes have to be repeated 2-3 times before potential changes are to be discussed.

[Tunda]

Bastard trait, it always slips my mind. Still, that puts the WHM Medica 2 comparison value from 700p, to 910, pre-level-85. Which is still alarmingly close to WAR's 800p from SIO. That's the issue at hand, that WAR's actions encroach on the potency level of Healer actions, despite not being a Healer.

I also forgot to list Equilibrium, which, thanks to the HOT trait, becomes a total of 2700p selfhealing, for free, every 60s



Say it louder for the guys at the back. Why did MNK need a selfheal HOT on Riddle of Earth? You mitigate damage when you use it to defend against an attack, that's already the 'bonus for using it well', it didn't need a HOT too. Now in DT it's going to give access to a followup move that does 500p of AOE healing. Why? Monk already supported Healers by being able to grant Mantra, this new AOE heal is completely unnecessary. RPR got its 500p Regen from breaking Arcane Crest reduced to 250p because it was so good. Now we're just repeating the same mistakes on MNK?

I disagree all dps should have some kind of mitigation or heal.. like healer should have some kind of dps and tank some dps..

But healers issue is they dont have anything other than heals + 5% of their kit into dps

[Ramiee]

I disagree all dps should have some kind of mitigation or heal.. like healer should have some kind of dps and tank some dps..

But healers issue is they dont have anything other than heals + 5% of their kit into dps

I think having a selfish mitigation is okay, but sharing mitigation especially in the form of healing is insanely dumb on DPS. If they have mitigation it should be in the form of debuffs on the boss or support like mantra to combo with the healers, my general rule on DPS and Tanks being able to heal others is it should sacrifice damage. Clemency and Improvisation (if reworked slightly) are ok for heals because you have to stop attacking to do them, the ability of being able to heal groups in oGCD heals should be a healer role exclusive thing.

[ForsakenRoe]

I disagree all dps should have some kind of mitigation or heal.. like healer should have some kind of dps and tank some dps..

Do Second Wind and Bloodbath no longer count? Or Manaward, Radiant Aegis or Vercure?