Updated benchmark

[Evergrey]

hi. It turns out that studying Photoshop is still a science. I have some results now, just my character to start with. hyur midlander face 1. It turns out that they changed everything, eyelashes, cheeks, eyebrows, eyes, even the pupil, lips, nose. That's what I got. Now I'm not surprised why I feel like it's a different character. Here are a couple of gifs and photos for you.
Let's start with the nose. The holes of the nose are different, the nose is wider.
\
the lips are completely different, the smile disappears. What is the artistic intent?

the shape of the eyes is different, the pupil is larger.





This is me trying to attach the old nose eyes and lips to the new character. And she looks a lot more like an old character to me.

I know the words from a 3rd person won't mean much, but I really think that your character looks really good in it's updated, non-edited form.
I don't usually comment on peoples updated characters because I know it's not my opinion that matters, I just really think that she looks really good.
And I do hope that whatever happens, more changed being done or not, that you'll one way or another will be happy with the character that you'll play.

And I don't wanna sound smug or anything, but I think you accidently made a double post.
I tried looking for anything that differentiate them but couldn't find any.

[SchwarzwaelderTorte]

It turns out that they changed everything, eyelashes, cheeks, eyebrows, eyes, even the pupil, lips, nose.
Let's start with the nose. The holes of the nose are different, the nose is wider.
the lips are completely different, the smile disappears. What is the artistic intent?
the shape of the eyes is different, the pupil is larger.

I think it would be helpful if you could be more specific in your impressions, so it could become more useful feedback.
After all, all the parts have changed, it's a graphical update.

But can you be more detailed in your descriptions? "It's different" doesn't really say much. What did you like before, and what do you not like now? What made you decide on these options, and how have the changes affected the impression of your character? That kind of thing.

Also, try to take your screenshots from the same angle with the same lighting (use the background as a guide), otherwise it's difficult to see what changed, because you notice the difference in lighting and brightness a lot more than the rest, and it's visually distracting.

(It's also worth noting that the character's head moves a lot in the idle animation, so for example in your gif you might have a different impression of the nose just because you see it at a slightly different angle. It's something I've been trying to be mindful of in my own feedback)

[CidHeiral]

Well done, that post is exactly the sort of thing the devs can use to make changes. The response above mine had some excellent suggestions, especially taking pictures at the same angle and in the same lighting. I recommend taking them into account and posting a translated version of that in the JP thread as well with a bullet point list of each item that is wrong and how you would like to see it changed.

[vekkro]

I've noticed a couple of quirks on my female highlander. Face 2's eyebrows seemed to have gotten 50% brighter and almost match the skin color now. Looks like the angle is softer too.

Not too worried about skin color because that can be adjusted since it seems it got a bit paler. But my eyebrows almost disappearing is a tad annoying lol. I wish they would make them like the other fem highlander faces and just make it match exactly the hair color instead of this weird greyish blonde that blends in with the skin

Image for reference

[Tahli]

A closer comparison of the eyes on F Moon Miqo Face 2, Eyes 6, Brow 2 between benchmarks. I really liked how in the first benchmark, the eyebrows were a softer color, and not as thin on the inner part. Looks kinda like drawn-on angry eyebrows in the newer one. Having the heavier eye makeup was my preference, sad that they reduced that without adding it as a facial feature option. And the iris and pupil themselves looked less uncanny in v1.

Commenting on this one more time with some better pictures/comparisons. Images taken in character creator of current game, Benchmark 1 and Benchmark 1.1, all in direct sunlight of La Noscea setting.
Female Miqote (Keeper of the Moon), Face 2, Eyebrow 2, Eyes 6.



I really felt like the first benchmark was most flattering on my character's features. I would like for the eyebrow shape/shading to be more like how it was in Benchmark 1, because I think the shape and color is truly beautiful. But if not that, then at the very least, I think the latest 1.1 eyebrows should be shaped closer to how they are in the current game: thicker at the base, thinner at the tail, slightly lighter in color, and angled softer so as not to give a drawn-on angry eyebrow impression. Eyebrow 2, specifically, is supposed to be the most gentle of the eyebrow options.

And the eyes, as you can see, have much harsher "lines" making up the patterns of the iris now, and it looks much less natural than the earlier versions. Keepers of the Moon have large pupils, so only that outer portion of the iris is visible on us, and it would be appreciated if the color popped more like it used to.

I do think some of the shading/lighting in the new benchmark is a little extreme, and might be giving Female Miqote an uncanny valley effect. Shadows are very prominent, and lighting is very bright on skin.

[Print_Screen]

Figured I'd add my comparison here in case the devs read this. I'm not completely happy with the eyes, eyebrows and overall shape of my character's face in the benchmark.

Female Highlander
Face 1
Jaw 1
Eye shape 3
Eyebrows 1
Facial features 1, 2, 3
6.58 vs updated benchmark

Side:


Front:


The view from the front is mostly the same, but from the side I notice a few differences. I don't like that the outer corners of the eyes are rounded down, and that the eyebrows are now smaller. The shape of the jaw and cheeks also seems different, but that might be an illusion caused by the lighting.

[Morravn]

I know I'm a bit late but wanted to add my thoughts.

First off, I wanted to thank the devs for all the feedback they've incorporated so far. My character looks so much more like herself in the new benchmark!
(Face 4, eyes 4, eyebrows 3, nose 1, mouth 2)



That being said, I do think it's still worth mentioning that there remain some significant differences in her that don't stay true to her original design. The biggest issue is the size of the lips. Overall, the lips are still too big. The lower lip remains weirdly thickened, giving her mouth a distinctly different shape:



As I hope can be seen, this feature stands out explicitly when the characters are compared side by side. Compared to the original (left), the lips of the benchmark character (right) look swollen:



I have to reiterate that I'm so thankful for the improvements that have been made. However, this still feels like a 'dollified' version of my character. The sharpness of the original face remains lost (largely because of the relaxation of her eyebrows in combination with the puffy lips), so it still feels like botox has been forced on her, even if she's not been subjected to as much botox as in benchmark 1. The determined mood of the original face isn't there, which I am going to miss if this is the end result.

[Loggos]

Thank you for sharing. I think this example demonstrates very well how some changes (from my non-technical understanding) go far beyond "trying to stay as faithful to the original designs as possible (but some nuances might be lost)". The mouth shape is straight-up a completely different design. The new one and the old one look nothing alike. It doesn't feel like an adaption that got slightly altered by upscaling at all.

[Khryseis_Astra]

Thank you for sharing. I think this example demonstrates very well how some changes (from my non-technical understanding) go far beyond "trying to stay as faithful to the original designs as possible (but some nuances might be lost)". The mouth shape is straight-up a completely different design. The new one and the old one look nothing alike. It doesn't feel like an adaption that got slightly altered by upscaling at all.

Yes, mouths are the most obvious, across most of the races. It’s not just different textures or lighting, they’re straight up different shapes in many cases! In other cases, it looks like they just changed where on the lips that the color gets applied, which still has the effect of making things look completely different.

[CipherNine]

I actually thought more people would be talking about it, but I guess not many people play as Femroes.

If you look at roeydagyns concept art, any promotional art, or even meet roes in the current version of the game, you can easily see on their bulkiness and very rough faces with square chins, narrowed jaws and noses, very deep wrinkles in the root and nasion areas of the nose bridge, etc. The problem is... just gone in the latest benchmark. The overall shapes of the faces are the same, but the details that created the shapes and complexity of the faces are not.


Even a quick comparison of the images shows that the face on the left is more flat and the face on the right is more rounded. I understand that because of the change in materials and rendering, the images will look a little different, but it's more than that.


The left face looks more organic, and when you look at it, your eyes are probably focused on the character's eyes/nose. You can't focus on the same parts of the right face. Your eyes start wandering around the face to many different places without really stopping on anything. It's not because the new face has more detail.


On the left face, the eyebrows flow into the bridge of the nose. Eyes have additional wrinkles to separate them from the nose, creating complexity and catching the viewer's attention. The rest of the face is flat and has less detail, creating a strong focus on the eyes. These details are missing from the right image. That's why you can't really focus on anything on the right face and jump from element to element.


Details of the nose bridge and eye sockets have simply disappeared.


Details like these add complexity to the shapes of the face, create focal points, guide lines and attract the viewer's attention, without them... there is nothing.


I don't even have to draw red lines on it. It's just so obvious. But wait, there is more.


Even if you try to focus on more soft and rounded faces complete ditching rough features of the face (features which made roegadyn roegadyn) the right face still looks off.


It's not just couple small things, which looks a little bit different with graphical update. It complete different composition of the face created by different shapes and features which were definite for roegadyns are just gone.


Do you remember roegadyns with their unique faces? This is them now. More Huyrs than Huyrs themselves.