Crazy Idea: Split SCH from ARC and make it a 30+ job like HW

[Sjol]

Even though it didn't originate in HW, if they changed the story up just a little bit, you could have it be a job that starts at 30 just like the HW jobs. You could also remove the prereq that you have a job at 50. It would be weird, but it would finally split the SCH and SMN jobs from the same XP track, which I'm sure a lot of people love, but it does make it the very odd job/class out.

An alternative would be to give it an alternative class (a new one) to start from but that's a ton more work.

Can't change titles (but it should read ACN)

[Aneshda]

Or just leave it as it is?

[CaptainLagbeard]

How about no?

[fulminating]

How about splitting smn off from arcanist and introducing it at 90 when the rabbit offhandedly mentions that no one does summoning right and the player can be even more of a donut steel. Sch at least in lore keeps the tactical thread from acn, so is more of a natural progression.

[Supersnow845]

Yeah honestly SCH follows ACN better than SMN, SMN makes -5 lore sense at this point, it can be its own class

[Sjol]

Yeah honestly SCH follows ACN better than SMN, SMN makes -5 lore sense at this point, it can be its own class

How so? It didn't seem to me that SCH followed ACN particularly while SMN did. With SMN you're still creating/summoning things from your own aether that only exist as long as you exert effort, while Eos and Selene exist without you -- you literally just find them, and they can do things on their own from a lore perspective.

The tactician angle of SCH doesn't even really come from the ACN school, but instead your collaboration with MAR. None of the abilities to my recollection for ACN mention anything about tactics or strategy.

[rawker]

How so? It didn't seem to me that SCH followed ACN particularly while SMN did. With SMN you're still creating/summoning things from your own aether that only exist as long as you exert effort, while Eos and Selene exist without you -- you literally just find them, and they can do things on their own from a lore perspective.

The tactician angle of SCH doesn't even really come from the ACN school, but instead your collaboration with MAR. None of the abilities to my recollection for ACN mention anything about tactics or strategy.

I'll do Snow a favor and answer this... the pet. Lily healing and casting actions originating from her is the core of the old ACN class... which EW SMN does not do... even remotely

[Sjol]

I'll do Snow a favor and answer this... the pet. Lily healing and casting actions originating from her is the core of the old ACN class... which EW SMN does not do... even remotely

Admittedly, I think the SMN's pets don't stick around because they're huge. I imagine they play tested SMN with pets that stuck around, and the various aspects were coming from them, but it was just too big on the screen with multiple SMNs. Even with one, you still got the demand to be able to shrink them. This may be one of those compromises. Though that doesn't mean it's not a job with pets, it just means it's not mechanically a pet job. The distinction being input and control mechanics that are part of the game vs. in-world story and lore.

And I LOVE mechanical pet jobs. Necromancers, beastmasters, hunters, rangers, mechanics. If it has a pet, I'm on board. But I still understand the designers need to compromise to get to something that satisfies as many people as possible -- not make them happy or ecstatic -- but satisfies. People wanted to summon big bads. I remember when the new rework came out and so many people were saying, "finally, I'm a real summoner now".

And it's in line with most of the FF franchise where summons weren't something you controlled. They were just something you hit from time to time and watched a minute and a half cutscene as all the knights came by.

[rawker]

And I LOVE mechanical pet jobs. Necromancers, beastmasters, hunters, rangers, mechanics. If it has a pet, I'm on board. But I still understand the designers need to compromise to get to something that satisfies as many people as possible -- not make them happy or ecstatic -- but satisfies. People wanted to summon big bads. I remember when the new rework came out and so many people were saying, "finally, I'm a real summoner now".

And it's in line with most of the FF franchise where summons weren't something you controlled. They were just something you hit from time to time and watched a minute and a half cutscene as all the knights came by.

Then I guess I am mistaken that you do not like pets. For that, I apologize.

To answer the last line, and I think I mentioned this in a thread somewhere, the evolution of summoning in FF went towards pets:

• FFVIII - summons had HP.
• FFX - summons take the slot of party members and are able to command what to use.
• FFXI, FFXII, FFXIII - summons have become persisting entities that follow you.

ARR and HW SMN were building up to have primals summon-able as the story progressed.

If they removed the dots from ACN, for as long as the pet mechanics remained, they can simply reintroduce it specifically to the jobs. Just look at Bio.. it is now a SCH spell.

[Azureskies01]

Fixing a problem that doesn't exist, just low IQ things.