Relic Weapons. CONCERNS/SUGGESTIONS

[Grimwald]

On some points i am with the OP, when they released the weapons i had a real hype because i had the old FFXI feeling about Dynamis Relics... then i realised how useless the most of them are and how short the relic quest itself is... people are right of they say they also want more solo stages... in XI u had the chance of completing 90% of the relic solo by buying the Coins for each stage (for the people the had the money) and you could have used the power of a Dynamis Linkshell which u sponsored, for all the Coins they dropped.

lets have a look:

FFXI:
Best MNK Weapon to good old times:


Different Weapon Weapon, great use but cant mach up with the Relic:


is it just me? Were the relic far better then any other weapon in XI? compare the XIV weapon: Sphairai vs Garuda (Teamplayer) or GC Weapon (for solo/casual players).

Its easy to say relics arent for everyone, but they are... you can say w/e you want. Its like in XI... some take 2 weeks others will take 6 Months and some others will take a year to finish it.


For me a REAL Relic Weapon has to be unbeatable, not even the second best Weapon has the right to be on top with the relic one (not even 1 dps more on the most weapons now), and to obtain a relic you should have to waist more then 1 or 2 Weeks, it should take atleast a half year for People they playing 7 days a Week and atleast 5-6hours a day.

or make it short:

less RNG, more Skill based and time sink Quests


just my 2 cents

Square didn't really call them relic weapons, and these weapons are currently the best in the game, AND Yoshida confirmed that they will be upgradeable in future content and will scale with the level increases that come.

...so, they're pretty good at least for a start.

[Almalexia]

Square didn't really call them relic weapons, and these weapons are currently the best in the game, AND Yoshida confirmed that they will be upgradeable in future content and will scale with the level increases that come.

...so, they're pretty good at least for a start.

As it stands, Sphairai is the least impressive relic of the 7. It's technically the best for MNK, but it's not leagues ahead of the competition.

[yukikaze_yanagi]

As it stands, Sphairai is the least impressive relic of the 7. It's technically the best for MNK, but it's not leagues ahead of the competition.

Evasion it's a downwer, but who cares ! I'm my main, and i'll take it

[Arkune]

As it stands, Sphairai is the least impressive relic of the 7. It's technically the best for MNK, but it's not leagues ahead of the competition.

You can compare every Weapon on the current Relics you have in XIV all of the arent that great... i can only see 2 Weapons they are good but the stats doesnt make it looks like its superior awesome and thats DRG and BLM.

[Arkine]

Want a beer? A cookie? A massage on your feets too sir? You are asking for the game to give you everything free and with no effort. Then what is the meaning of play this game? Or may I say, for what do you play this?
Because once you would have everything, you would do.... nothing?

"Complain about luck is complete bullsh*t" <--fixed for you.

I'm sorry, but you lack the comprehension skills required to fix anything for anybody.

I asked for measurable progress, that means that every time you beat content you get closer to obtaining a reward.

You know which content fits my statement to a T?

Garuda.

I'll give you a minute to pick your jaw off the floor.

Done?

Heres what happens when/if you beat Garuda: (pay attention, this is important)

You get a Headdress. (Two(2) if you speed run)

EVERY TIME!

but you need 40 to get a weapon, that's 40 fights per weapon, and I very much doubt that you're so much of a badass that 40 victories is equal to getting something handed to you, we're talking 140~280 runs for a 7/7.

Now I'll give you a star for understanding how to bold up text. ☆ <-- all yours.

luck should only work for you and never against you.

Now you're killing Garuda and working your way towards 40 seals, this is all effort, you earned this, but suddenly! you see a Garuda's Scream in your rewards! oh look at that you got lucky, this isn't going to happen very often, and you're already half way through your original set, are you going to stop?

Probably not, you're going to get it finished for another weapon.

That's measurable progress and that's how luck works for you, and its great.

We need more of this.


That is what I want.

===========================

Now lets look at how luck works against you PLUS no measurable progress:

400 Cutter's Cry runs, at a rate of 5 a day, 7 days a week for a total of 80 days.

That's almost 3 months of doing just Cutters Cry every day for about 3 and a half hours.

Where is your Darklight Cuirass? you don't have! not because you didn't put in enough time and effort. NOPE! but because you're not lucky enough to have it.

All your time effort and mad skillz got you nothing.

On the other hand some elf(hate elves) just finished his first ever Vale run on his WAR with a veteran group and just got his Heavy Darklight Armor and is now hitting on Lalafells with it. (the scoundrel!)

That is the kind of world you think is fair, and I'm spoiled for disagreeing with you.

Who is speaking the effort on double meld? I'm speaking to put effort on level a craft/gather, craft-gather the materials, turn it on a weapon then add the materias. That's effort. I think you missunderstood me.

Edit: if you have the money to sink it on buying the weapon and doble meld even on first try, you still got the money somehow no?

You level the craft > you gather the materials > you buy the materia > you meld it > you double mel- BOOM!!!! Screw you and your effort, this is RNG territory!

You try again. BOOM!!!

Again BOOM!!!

BOOM!!!

0/21



Meanwhile in Ul'dah.

The same Elf from earlier just got his Triple melded T4 Pants with 28STR 30VIT on his first try.

1/1

He must have put in more effort than you.


Hint: He didn't.

===============

[Cthulhu]

Meanwhile in Ul'dah.

The same Elf from earlier just got his Triple melded T4 Pants with 28STR 30VIT on his first try.

1/1

He must have put in more effort than you.


Hint: He didn't.

Yes, yes he did. You know how?

Hint: He's an Elezen. Do you have any idea how much effort it takes to be this damn sexy?

[Wycor]

I'm sorry, but you lack the comprehension skills required to fix anything for anybody.


Garuda.

I'll give you a minute to pick your jaw off the floor.

Done?

Heres what happens when/if you beat Garuda: (pay attention, this is important)

You get a Headdress. (Two(2) if you speed run)

EVERY TIME!

but you need 40 to get a weapon, that's 40 fights per weapon, and I very much doubt that you're so much of a badass that 40 victories is equal to getting something handed to you, we're talking 140~280 runs for a 7/7.

Sorry what? who is laking comprehension? I'm speaking about "you want luck to always favor you" you don't only say that i lack comprehension that you go straight to another argument with garuda as "how things should be" skiping the whole problem here.

Now I'll give you a star for understanding how to bold up text. ☆ <-- all yours.

I'm taking it because i'm going to give it back to you right now.

Now you're killing Garuda and working your way towards 40 seals, this is all effort, you earned this, but suddenly! you see a Garuda's Scream in your rewards! oh look at that you got lucky, this isn't going to happen very often, and you're already half way through your original set, are you going to stop?

Probably not, you're going to get it finished for another weapon.

That's measurable progress and that's how luck works for you, and its great.

We need more of this.

What? So you are making a statement where "luck always favor you" on a system (gona use your expample) Garuda where you can do the run and go out with nothing. Sorry but... isn't that the same as doble meld? If you are lucky you get the "totem" or the doble meld BUT if you aren't lucky you get nothing.

See the contradition or you still can't see the negative part on the bolded parts that you seem to like that much?


===========================

Now lets look at how luck works against you PLUS no measurable progress:

400 Cutter's Cry runs, at a rate of 5 a day, 7 days a week for a total of 80 days.

That's almost 3 months of doing just Cutters Cry every day for about 3 and a half hours.

Where is your Darklight Cuirass? you don't have! not because you didn't put in enough time and effort. NOPE! but because you're not lucky enough to have it.

All your time effort and mad skillz got you nothing.

On the other hand some elf(hate elves) just finished his first ever Vale run on his WAR with a veteran group and just got his Heavy Darklight Armor and is now hitting on Lalafells with it. (the scoundrel!)

That is the kind of world you think is fair, and I'm spoiled for disagreeing with you.

You stated that garuda system is perfect with luck since you get rewarded by your effort which is not and now you are arguing about how bad is cutter's cry(example) because it has a negative part and no 100% reward. Isn't the same as Garuda? ifrit? eveyrthing not only ingame but life? or did they changed the meaning of luck? Is good or bad but not always good.

Definition of luck.

You level the craft > you gather the materials > you buy the materia > you meld it > you double mel- BOOM!!!! Screw you and your effort, this is RNG territory!

You try again. BOOM!!!

Again BOOM!!!

BOOM!!!

0/21


Meanwhile in Ul'dah.

The same Elf from earlier just got his Triple melded T4 Pants with 28STR 30VIT on his first try.

1/1

He must have put in more effort than you.


Hint: He didn't.

WELCOME SIR! Please come in, we have a free sport for one more person with the butt hurt.

Because you seem to like pictures.

He didn't? He did the effort and you too. He tried the meld and you too. He didn't broke it but you did. You saw him doing 1/1 meld but you probably missed 100 that he broke. You complain about luck while he has this face now.



I'm doing it right?

Thanks for your time.

[Arkine]

Sorry what? who is laking comprehension? I'm speaking about "you want luck to always favor you" you don't only say that i lack comprehension that you go straight to another argument with garuda as "how things should be" skiping the whole problem here.

False.

I said Luck should work for you, not against you.

What I meant is, only luck you can sometimes get is good luck, never bad luck.

Just like Garuda.

Every Victory = 100% drop on 1 headdress. (this is confirmed)
Luck decides to step in = a weapon.

This is measurable progress, you get something every time you succeed.

But we're here for the luck part of this example.

Luck here ONLY work FOR YOU.

Every time luck decides to work it works positively.



Luck working against you:

Ifrit
You win = you'll more than likely get dark matter. (yay?)
If you're lucky = 1 totem.
If you're very lucky = a weapon.

Here we see how you get nothing unless you get lucky. this is what I'm against.

Luck here can work against you (you get nothing) or for you (You get a drop).

Here's how you phrased it.

luck to always favor you

Seems to me like you interpreted it as:

Ifrit
Weapon every time, be done in 7 runs.

Whiched caused you to wig out. (As Buffy would phrase it)

I did not say or mean anything that is anything like the above situation.


Comprende?

What? So you are making a statement where "luck always favor you" on a system (gona use your expample) Garuda where you can do the run and go out with nothing. Sorry but... isn't that the same as doble meld? If you are lucky you get the "totem" or the doble meld BUT if you aren't lucky you get nothing.

See the contradition or you still can't see the negative part on the bolded parts that you seem to like that much?

Not gonna lie.

I'm not 100% sure on what you're trying to say.

But just to recap:

Everytime you beat Garuda you get a Headress. only luck you can have is good luck which is getting a weapon. = You always progress and sometimes you get "Good Luck"

This is good.

Everytime you beat Ifrit you only get rewarded if you're lucky = You never progress unless you get lucky, your victory is meaningless without getting lucky.

This is bad.

===========================


You stated that garuda system is perfect with luck since you get rewarded by your effort which is not and now you are arguing about how bad is cutter's cry(example) because it has a negative part and no 100% reward. Isn't the same as Garuda? ifrit? eveyrthing not only ingame but life? or did they changed the meaning of luck? Is good or bad but not always good.

Getting a headress every time is rewarding your effort, you fought and you won and you got a headress for that.

Sometimes you get lucky and get more rewards.(Weapons)

Not the same as CC and Ifrit where its something like this:

You win = you get no rewards unless you get lucky. bad luck is the default outcome here.


What I'm asking for is that every instanced content we have follows the Garuda method.

He didn't? He did the effort and you too. He tried the meld and you too. He didn't broke it but you did. You saw him doing 1/1 meld but you probably missed 100 that he broke. You complain about luck while he has this face now.

I'm doing it right?

Thanks for your time.

You figured out how to insert images, yes.

Can't say the same about the rest of discussion, no.

You cannot add extra parameters to my Elf, he did no more that 1 meld in this scenario, luck worked in his favor and was rewarded.

You did 10 times the effort, paid 10 times the money and spent 10 times the time he did and you got nothing to show for it.

Only because he got lucky and you did not.


I'll simplify this even further.

The mentioned Elf is completely fictional(hes not real), but we'll change it up to Mermaid to avoid further confusion.

To set an example of an entirely possible situation for how making luck the only factor that matters = bad.

He/She did not do any melding while I wasn't paying attention, that's not how it usually works.

Elf Mermaid Abomination I created bought the following:

Felt Trousers. 50,000Gil

Ironman's Will Materia VI 100,000Gil
Ironman's Will Materia VI 100,000Gil
Ironman's Will Materia VI 100,000Gil

Catalyst 5,000Gil
Catalyst 5,000Gil
Catalyst 5,000Gil

Total Cost: 365,000Gil

Result: Triple Melded Felt trousers.


What you bought:

Felt Trousers.
Felt Trousers.
Felt Trousers.
Felt Trousers.
Felt Trousers.
Felt Trousers.
Felt Trousers.
Felt Trousers.
Felt Trousers.
Felt Trousers.

Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI
Ironman's Will Materia VI

God knows how many catalysts.

Total Cost: 3,000,000gil?

Result: Nothing.

There is no way to argue for this system, the effort to reward ratio is completely random.
There is no "You didn't put in enough effort" because that value (once again) is unknown and completely random.

Not to sound like an extremist leader of a revolution in a "Republic City", but wouldn't system where we're equal be better?

You do a set number of tasks to fill in a melding meter to increase the success rate.

Maybe...

Spirit bond 500,000exp to get a guaranteed success on a double meld.

Spirit bond 1,000,000exp to get a guaranteed success on a triple meld.

Just as an example, while keeping the current system for those that prefer gambling be better than having no choice in the matter and leaving it entirely in luck's hands?


Done hammering this point in.

Adios.

[Crimzon]

Square didn't really call them relic weapons, and these weapons are currently the best in the game, AND Yoshida confirmed that they will be upgradeable in future content and will scale with the level increases that come.

...so, they're pretty good at least for a start.

http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com...61cf1bf68fa674

It looks to me like they called them relic weapons. As they titled this dev post "Relic Weapon Revival", and use that term to describe them about a dozen times in the write up. Also, the quest is "A Relic Reborn". Not sure what other confirmation you need to verify that that is what these weapons are.

As for comparing these to FFXI relics, the amount of time needed to obtain them and the difficulty to obtain them is obviously much less....so far. But consider that this is basically 'stage 1' of what the final counterparts will be when there is a level cap raise...then it is understandable that they dont currently blow other weapons out of the water...yet.

They are still best in slot.

As for people complaining about the RNG of the double meld stage, if your really 1 of the people who want 'measured progress' like Garuda and dont wanna play the gambling game of hitting your double meld...you have that option. You can buy it off the Market Wards...just go farm 1-2 million gil or however much you are capable each time you have some time and make your measured progress towards that 15M mark or however much the weapon costs. There are options here.