Combat system is beyond saving.

[ZiraZ]

guess barry won

[EusisLandale]

I can't quite remember- I wonder if I missed the time when this was the case in regards to Tanking

When was it that Tanks had to make macros to mark the kill order of dungeon trash so the DPS wouldn't attack an enemy the Tank wasn't attacking and pull aggro from them?

I honestly can't say I've ever seen tanks do that in this game, and I've been playing since the end of ARR.
I only ever saw that in WoW. Sheep this, trap that, then kill order. I'm not even sure if they still do that though, I quit ages ago.

[ty_taurus]

Note that the number is still MUCH higher then in Stormblood or anything before that. Also note that numbers DO tend to drop during an expansion (Shadowbringers being an exception because of the flood of people from WoW and content creators joining in.) and peak back up when a new one drops, because many just come for the story and don't give a crap about patch content. (Also note that chart only goes up to Q2 of LAST YEAR and doesn't include the last two entire quarters of 2023. Or well... since SE does March to March technically it doesn't include October 2023-March 2024) I think they will be just fine if a few doomposters leave because they can't handle growing pains.

A good chunk of current players started the game after the systems you are defending were removed, and are totally fine with how they are, or believe it's workable.

It also says thats based on characters with new achievements... I've gone months without getting new achievements, but I've still been subbed and logged in almost every day to just hang out with friends and decorate my house.

The rise in population has nothing to do with the simplification of job design and everything to do with the increase in FFXIV's marketing budget and general praise of the main story quest. If we still had the general level of gameplay complexity that existed in stormblood or even heavensward, we wouldn't have a smaller population, because how easy or complex the combat is is not the main selling point for most people.

Most players are perfectly fine with the combat system the way it currently is, but I would bet money that they'd also be completely fine if it was the way it was in past expansions as well, because again, their focus isn't on the combat system. And that's okay. Everyone is entitled to play for their own reasons, but that's exactly what the problem is with the modern combat system is it's sacrificing the people who play for the combat system in order to make an already extremely accessible game more accessible. Like, the people who aren't here for the combat system aren't struggling, so this continued push to simplify and streamline makes no sense to me, because it doesn't seem like its targeting anyone at all.

[LordMcMutton]

I honestly can't say I've ever seen tanks do that in this game, and I've been playing since the end of ARR.
I only ever saw that in WoW. Sheep this, trap that, then kill order. I'm not even sure if they still do that though, I quit ages ago.

Odd... Maybe it was specifically something done in lower-level content?

I definitely remember doing it, as I distinctly recall the stress it caused

[Cynric]

I honestly can't say I've ever seen tanks do that in this game, and I've been playing since the end of ARR.
I only ever saw that in WoW. Sheep this, trap that, then kill order. I'm not even sure if they still do that though, I quit ages ago.

A lot of newer tanks did this in ARR, and some tanks in roulettes would.

[Rekh]

I can't quite remember- I wonder if I missed the time when this was the case in regards to Tanking

When was it that Tanks had to make macros to mark the kill order of dungeon trash so the DPS wouldn't attack an enemy the Tank wasn't attacking and pull aggro from them?

Mostly in realm reborn, but also through heavensward and specially early stormblood; early stormblood was designed so that melee dps would have to throw enmity to the tank or things like that. It was fun, it made people look like they were using their brain and how to be a specialist in their chosen jobs. Even if it was a simple mechanic to understand (enmity that is). It also made tanks who used aoe and cycled enemies to keep their enmity stand out as being skilled and proficient.

The game took effort, even in "casual" content.

[kuroashi_sanji]

The HW DRK has been the best job design to date. Is so sad to look to drk today, a trash clone of WAR, and seems it will be a clone of GNB on DT. And the worst is, we will never see another job with such good design like that again, so it seems.
Such waste....

[NanaWiloh]

Do not miss tanks throwing threat gen and defense out the window for damage. Nor do I miss trigger happy dps who could not control their threat to save starving lala. Dont think anyone misses the full cleric stance healer trying to heal high incoming damage and failing.

[VeolE]

I'll be brutally honest, HW and SB was peak era, even though I never played HW, but I sure as hell played during SB. I loved DRK due to aesthetic, lore, and the gameplay during the time with abyss drain combo spam, along with quietus + blood price. It was a GOOD satisfaction once you pull it off right and makes you unkillable at times during multiple mobs. And that NICE change to soul survivor (bonus points for the animation as well). Was niche during it's time, but now you can apply it to still get value from it whether they're alive now.
Same goes for WAR with steel cyclone spam with inner release for those extra heals, and swap back to DPS stance for Decimate. Along with the awareness combo with Raw intuition? To get free parry procs? Yes please, I love that combo, but now that's GONE. And How I miss the good ol' tank stance. IT WAS ACTUALLY FUN! WHEN YOU CAN ACTUALLY OPTIMIZE IT.
But they TOOK EVERYTHING FROM ME, my DRK became an inferior WAR during SHB and double down on the 2min rotation + gameplay.

Hell, I even have fun with AST with it's cards, but took that away from me as well, along with SCH with it's dots + bane. And, I don't even know WHY they remove Aero 3 from WHM, but here we are, can't have FUN with all of these simplicities and homogenization.

I love SAM, but they removed Kaiten. Why? "Button bloat" But you got 4 other skills that could be "Merged and condensed" to NOT be a button bloat.

And SMN?


Yeah, it just speaks for itself, especially with the job class showcase.

And another thing, why the removal of cone AoEs for Tenka Gokken and WAR overpower? Still doesn't make any sense to me...
This game went to my Favorite MMO and now to my Least favorite MMO. Due to these changes alone, and I came for the combat and story, but all I got left is just the STORY.

Edit: I was also a Mid-core type of person as well, doing EX's and stuff, while optimizing the gameplay and adapting to it when I was new.

[Doopliss]

Do not miss tanks throwing threat gen and defense out the window for damage. Nor do I miss trigger happy dps who could not control their threat to save starving lala. Dont think anyone misses the full cleric stance healer trying to heal high incoming damage and failing.

Hm. Nah. I'd still take dealing with all of those by either offering advice, or making use of the kick button for griefing, than dealing with gameplay that's been scrubbed clean of any passion. Bad players existed then and continue to exist now. The skill ceiling being on the floor simply makes them look more negligent than before.

I, for one, think a significantly worse problem is making Healers an essentially optional role in a far larger chunk of current content than ever before.