Please let SMN keep Resurrection

[Souljacker]

SE has no idea what these jobs even are in this game. There's no class fantasy, everything is a weird amalgamation of stuff from other jobs in earlier games or something completely out there. Like, AST having a bunch of corsair abilities or WHM being tree huggers. In this game's early quest to be as unlike FFXI as possible, a lot of traditional, comfortable job lore was lost.

And I'm not saying SE is the worst developer in the world over it, but they backed themselves into a corner with a lot of the design and carving out unique identities for jobs is almost impossible... because so few of them are *actually* one job.

Should SMN have raise? I don't think so. I think that the way this game's predecessor was, hit the job fantasy squarely in the bullseye while allowing other jobs to 'borrow' as needed\as content allowed. WHM with all the raise levels, with a basic raise low enough level that any job subbing it could get access. Other healers got access naturally and so did RDM (white magic) and PLD(holy warrior), but couldn't learn the highest levels and got it much, much later. That was a WHM skill. That made WHM unique while not barring other jobs from access.

But we can't have that here because now, everyone demands every job performs equally. So folks will complain about homogenization but at the same time don't want 'their' job to be the one that doesn't get Raise... I think the team at SE is doing the best they can with the feedback they are given.

[Aelin_Ashryver]

I'd be down for removing raise from caster entirely

[Minali]

I raised a ton of people with my summoner raise over the years and it was nice being able to help out and all and prevent a wipe once or twice.

However... I'm not super mad should they remove it. It doesn't really feel like it has anything to do with Summoner as a concept, Swiftcast is usually used with Slipstream or the Ruby actions when synced down below Slipstream, and if things go south so badly a summoner slow raise is the only thing that might prevent a wipe, maybe wiping and starting over would be a better idea. Unless the healer can throw out a healer LB3 right after they're back, it often also just prolongs the inevitable.
That said, I don't play any hardcore content, I guess when you play savage or an ultimate you are happy about every extra raise you can get...?

[SarriaKadijah]

Meh. I'm in favour of removing the rez, precisely for this reason:

> having an SMN that can re-raise at lower levels can absolutely make or break the run.

Wiping should not be considered an abnormality.

I don't think wipes should be an abnormality, but I think that it is more fun to be able to recover from a near wipe. And in Light Parties, this means having DPS who can cover tank or healer abilities, even if temporarily. Having a DPS who can raise covers a healer going down, and having DPS who can either take a few hits (melee with Arm's Length, which is shared with Tanks, BLM with their shield) or can kite things (ranged phys) covers losing a Tank. It's not always going to be enough to save the run, and I would never say as much, but removing the potential entirely I think would be worse.

[Gember]

I know this thread is about keeping it, but I actually don't agree with it. I am a healer main, so I can understand the importance of raise in a prog setting, but I also understand how annoyed Red Mages and Summoners can get always being the "Res caster" than an actual DPS. They get punished by bad gameplay, and it shouldn't be on their shoulders to do something that belongs to a healer role, mainly. If I can find a middle ground... if they do keep the raise; it should have a heavy cooldown, something like the Blue Mage raise cool down. It shouldn't be easily accessible by an easy swiftcast in my opinion. That way, a raise from a Red Mage or Summoner is more tactical than just spamming it when someone KOs in the group.

[Ramiee]

nothing in the game has a "one use per run" kind of mechanic, so that's not really a viable suggestion.

Variant Raise II

[KisaiTenshi]

Considering I made this thread with the intent of showing my support for KEEPING Resurrection, I obviously completely disagree. Also nothing in the game has a "one use per run" kind of mechanic, so that's not really a viable suggestion

I'd rather keep Resurrection, but maybe as a DPS it's utility should be altered along with RDM's to discourage stepping on the healer's toes. Back in ARR, you couldn't even use it during battle until level 28. Maybe that's what is called for, that swiftcast gets removed from DPS instead.

Or you know, just increase the CD on DPS "heal" skills.

[Minali]

I'd rather keep Resurrection, but maybe as a DPS it's utility should be altered along with RDM's to discourage stepping on the healer's toes. Back in ARR, you couldn't even use it during battle until level 28. Maybe that's what is called for, that swiftcast gets removed from DPS instead.

You do realize Swiftcast can be put to use with other casts as well...? I usually pair it with slipstream unless it's a new duty or the healer is new. Pre Slipstream I pair it with Ruby. And I'm sure BLM who has no raise in general has some nice uses for this as well. (Although I haven't played BLM a lot after reaching lvl 90, so take this with a grain of salt.)

[KisaiTenshi]

You do realize Swiftcast can be put to use with other casts as well...? I usually pair it with slipstream unless it's a new duty or the healer is new. Pre Slipstream I pair it with Ruby. And I'm sure BLM who has no raise in general has some nice uses for this as well. (Although I haven't played BLM a lot after reaching lvl 90, so take this with a grain of salt.)

It was just pointing out that "swiftcast" on healers tend to be exclusively used for the revive skills since only revive has a long cast. If a heal skill is on a DPS, either it needs to be immune from swiftcast, (Eg a oGCD skill with a longer CD) so that healers get the chance to use their skill first (sometimes it feels insulting to see a RDM raise someone while the healer hasn't had a chance to) but I'd rather see SMN/RDM still have the ability to do so because it still has utility in things like raids and trials

[eternalmagic]

I definitely agree with not having casters step on healer's toes, and also for SMN and RDM to not be simply dumbed down to "caster backup rez" as that is something I completely understand. I would be totally fine with changes made that increase a CD or something along those lines. I think what I meant initially was less "oh god we need it to prevent a wipe"--it's more along the lines of "let's last a little longer" than anything, and not really something to be spammed just because I have the ability to rez. Would much prefer tweaks like that over removing it entirely.