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  1. #1
    Player
    Local_Custard's Avatar
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    Mar 2023
    Location
    Ul'dah
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    379
    Character
    Rhel'a Tayuun
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Culinarian Lv 83

    getting to harder content/trying to imrpove

    Greetings!
    I have previously spoken about wanting to try harder content and I have decided the very first piece of hard content I will try is the binding coils of bahamut savage series and work in chronological order of release date. However, before I can run I need to learn to walk.
    I have been thinking of doing most casual content that is normally a snoozefest at min ilvl if I have competently done it before. Would this be a good idea?
    What else might I do it prepare for harder content?
    For reference, I want to get better with astrologian and get to know the job intimately.
    For reference this is my skill level: I have gotten to know much of AST's kit and learned to at least do it at an average level. Though, I may forget uptime with refreshing the dot or using earthly star consistently. I have some bad healer habits to trim.
    One of my worst habits is freezing up whenever faced with mechanics I do not understand well/at all. I might entirely stop casting or I might act too slowly for what the mechanic is asking of me. This is why I am thinking of trying min ilvl normal content first. There are mechanics I may not have seen because of power creep. I also hurt my growth by becoming too comfortable with a piece of content because it does not solve my freezing up problem.
    Honestly, I'm kind of frustrated because it feels like I'm not improving fast enough and running into a plateau of skill. I really want to get better- but for some reason I'm not.

    edit: why is my title so janky in spelling
    (2)
    Last edited by Local_Custard; 05-16-2024 at 05:49 PM.
    I love the men in this game

    I finally return to the game! Current goal: getting all my jobs to 90

  2. #2
    Player
    sindriiisgaming's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2023
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    1,430
    Character
    Sugar And'spice
    World
    Twintania
    Main Class
    Reaper Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Local_Custard View Post
    Greetings!
    I have previously spoken about wanting to try harder content and I have decided the very first piece of hard content I will try is the binding coils of bahamut savage series and work in chronological order of release date. However, before I can run I need to learn to walk.
    I have been thinking of doing most casual content that is normally a snoozefest at min ilvl if I have competently done it before. Would this be a good idea?
    What else might I do it prepare for harder content?
    For reference, I want to get better with astrologian and get to know the job intimately.
    For reference this is my skill level: I have gotten to know much of AST's kit and learned to at least do it at an average level. Though, I may forget uptime with refreshing the dot or using earthly star consistently. I have some bad healer habits to trim.
    One of my worst habits is freezing up whenever faced with mechanics I do not understand well/at all. I might entirely stop casting or I might act too slowly for what the mechanic is asking of me. This is why I am thinking of trying min ilvl normal content first. There are mechanics I may not have seen because of power creep. I also hurt my growth by becoming too comfortable with a piece of content because it does not solve my freezing up problem.
    Honestly, I'm kind of frustrated because it feels like I'm not improving fast enough and running into a plateau of skill. I really want to get better- but for some reason I'm not.
    The binding coils savage uses systems and mecanics many players complained were simply to hard. If you use it as a stepping stone, yes you will improve.. but it's genuinely so difficult to clear you might aswell jump into shiva savage (which Ironically was what I did) it took over a year to clear it but now I'm a very solid raider. People were still joining it because it was current content. This is another issue you'll have in coils - people. And that your job is only level 50. So your kit will be a brutal sanitised and maybe even unviable mascot of itself. Its better to start with endwalker ex - savage if you want to improve
    (2)
    Last edited by sindriiisgaming; 05-16-2024 at 05:27 PM.

  3. #3
    Player
    Valence's Avatar
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    Oct 2018
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    4,024
    Character
    Sunie Dakwhil
    World
    Twintania
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 100
    You can directly jump into coils, especially if you're not doing them minimum ilvl / no echo. The first tier is especially forgiving due to overgear and powercreep on top of easier fights overall. Coils are not harder than extreme trials but perhaps T9 at best which can be closer to savage stuff. This is the entry gate to challenging content (you can also do ARR ex trials or even later expansions as well).

    If you think your mastery of a job toolkit isn't there yet, doing more casual content in order to train muscle memory and reactions is never a wrong thing to do. Freezing up when faced with new complex mechanic is normal, and probably healthier than someone tunneling on their rotation no matter what. When progging difficult content it's not necessarily bad to stop DPSing and focus on actually learning the mechanic first. Once you're past it, you can start doing your job things again during it the next times you get through.

    But if you want to get better, the best way is just to jump into harder content. It's always going to be demanding enough that it will force you to improve, and you'll find the more casual content you're used to to become very trivial in comparison.
    (3)

  4. #4
    Player
    Local_Custard's Avatar
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    Mar 2023
    Location
    Ul'dah
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    379
    Character
    Rhel'a Tayuun
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Culinarian Lv 83
    Quote Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming View Post
    The binding coils savage uses systems and mecanics many players complained were simply to hard. If you use it as a stepping stone, yes you will improve.. but it's genuinely so difficult to clear you might aswell jump into shiva savage (which Ironically was what I did) it took over a year to clear it but now I'm a very solid raider. People were still joining it because it was current content. This is another issue you'll have in coils - people. And that your job is only level 50. So your kit will be a brutal sanitised and maybe even unviable mascot of itself. Its better to start with endwalker ex - savage if you want to improve
    Yeah I've been thinking of that. I'm going to go up in hardness in increments (binding coils min ilvl will happen before I do binding coild savage but first I do other content at min ilvl bc I'm all curious what that would look like. Newer content will likely not look too different compared to crystal tower min ilvl). I'll be looking to recruit people in my fc to try this tho.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valence View Post
    You can directly jump into coils, especially if you're not doing them minimum ilvl / no echo. The first tier is especially forgiving due to overgear and powercreep on top of easier fights overall. Coils are not harder than extreme trials but perhaps T9 at best which can be closer to savage stuff. This is the entry gate to challenging content (you can also do ARR ex trials or even later expansions as well).
    yeah I want to try them synced first for sure. Would help me get comfortable with the mechanics. Good to know this is a good stepping stone at least!

    If you think your mastery of a job toolkit isn't there yet, doing more casual content in order to train muscle memory and reactions is never a wrong thing to do. Freezing up when faced with new complex mechanic is normal, and probably healthier than someone tunneling on their rotation no matter what. When progging difficult content it's not necessarily bad to stop DPSing and focus on actually learning the mechanic first. Once you're past it, you can start doing your job things again during it the next times you get through.
    Ah. I have been told I won't be ready for savage content if I continue to freeze up... So I thought it was a bad habit of mine. I do tend to do that. On average it takes me 3 times to get comfortable with content I am unfamiliar with. Granted this number is for normal level of content. I cannot say how long it'll take me to learn savage or harder levels of content. Maybe double or triple that. Though, I have the benefit of having older hard (savage, extreme, ultimate) raids long figured out by other people so I can always look at those strategy guides.

    But if you want to get better, the best way is just to jump into harder content. It's always going to be demanding enough that it will force you to improve, and you'll find the more casual content you're used to to become very trivial in comparison.
    I can only hope that my trauma-induced perfectionist mindset will not prevent me from moving forward when I die more than 3 times (likely 12 if not dozens of times). Maybe Harder content will help me get comfortable with failing repeatedly. I tend to go defeatist very easily...
    (1)
    I love the men in this game

    I finally return to the game! Current goal: getting all my jobs to 90

  5. #5
    Player
    sindriiisgaming's Avatar
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    Gridania
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    Sugar And'spice
    World
    Twintania
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    Reaper Lv 100
    I can only hope that my trauma-induced perfectionist mindset will not prevent me from moving forward when I die more than 3 times (likely 12 if not dozens of times). Maybe Harder content will help me get comfortable with failing repeatedly. I tend to go defeatist very easily
    You should discard the idea of perfection immediately. It doesnt exist. It's a tredmil that you'll be chasing forever as your goals continously change. Eventually it will get to a point where you dont even recognise what you were originally after
    (4)
    Quote Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming View Post
    your titanmen, hes titanmen IM TITANMEN are there anymore titanmens i should know about?

  6. #6
    Player
    Somnolence's Avatar
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    Jul 2019
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    418
    Character
    Ixa X'phele
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Local_Custard View Post
    Ah. I have been told I won't be ready for savage content if I continue to freeze up... So I thought it was a bad habit of mine. I do tend to do that. On average it takes me 3 times to get comfortable with content I am unfamiliar with. Granted this number is for normal level of content. I cannot say how long it'll take me to learn savage or harder levels of content. Maybe double or triple that. Though, I have the benefit of having older hard (savage, extreme, ultimate) raids long figured out by other people so I can always look at those strategy guides.
    The trick for overcoming this is learning how scripted the encounters in this game actually are, so when you learn a raid it becomes just identical sequences of key presses and movement patterns.

    For ARR and HW most mechanics are triggered based on boss HP %, but after SB its strict timeline.

    You can get the feel for this by just doing enough content. Then you mind will learn how to map encounters in terms of "after this mech I can do 5 malefics then have to heal raidwide with these abilities then I have 3 malefics, dot refresh and 4 malefics until next mechanic" etc.

    If you really want to start with old content, most datacenters should have discord communities that do old content synced or are beginner focused, don't know about NA ones specifically.
    (1)

  7. #7
    Player
    Valence's Avatar
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    Oct 2018
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    Character
    Sunie Dakwhil
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    Twintania
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    Machinist Lv 100
    Also I'm not sure if you actually meant the Coils in general or the savage version of the second tier (only the second tier has one)? The savage version is probably a lot more demanding, but I haven't tried it. Probably way closer to serious savages of today.

    Freezing up depends what you mean. If your brain goes blank and you can't do anything, it's a problem. But stopping everything to focus on understanding and executing a mechanic properly isn't bad practice.

    Honestly, difficult content in this game when it's actually current or at least not from older expansions that have been made obsolete by too many changes, can require even top groups to bang their heads against a wall repeatedly, especially if you start going into ultimates or the current savage fights at any time. If you don't deal well with going against a piece of content again and again and again you'll probably have to find where your limit lies within said challenging content.
    (1)
    Last edited by Valence; 05-16-2024 at 05:51 PM.

  8. #8
    Player
    Local_Custard's Avatar
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    Mar 2023
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    Ul'dah
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    Character
    Rhel'a Tayuun
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Culinarian Lv 83
    Quote Originally Posted by Valence View Post
    Also I'm not sure if you actually meant the Coils in general or the savage version of the second tier (only the second tier has one)? The savage version is probably a lot more demanding, but I haven't tried it. Probably way closer to serious savages of today.

    Freezing up depends what you mean. If your brain goes blank and you can't do anything, it's a problem. But stopping everything to focus on understanding and executing a mechanic properly isn't bad practice.
    maybe I should clarify: I'll be doing normal coils synced first then min ilvl and then do the savage version... eventually. That last step will come someday in the future. I'll try to work towards soon but I first need to get better at AST.

    It's a bit of a mixed bag tbh. I freeze up and try to understand what is going on. I will likely fail first and not understand why I failed unless someone explained it to me (as a small example, I wondered whyI died to a stack marker and soon found out there was another stack marker I did not see that happened to be just far enough away that everyone else lived but close enough that is clipped me)(an average example is a mechanic I have not seen often enough to remember and then dying to it from improperly responding). My brain is rarely blank- I'm cursed with needing it active 95% of the time otherwise I'll get bored and go crazy or do things in the background. Sometimes when a new mechanic happens I do the equivalent of a chicken running around in a panic. This often involves not casting at all and doing everything in my power to not get hit. Or... not moving in the right direction and taking an L. Or panicking internally but not reacting fast enough-
    the final days is a big example of this with the planets colliding
    (1)
    I love the men in this game

    I finally return to the game! Current goal: getting all my jobs to 90

  9. #9
    Player
    Somnolence's Avatar
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    Jul 2019
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    Character
    Ixa X'phele
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Local_Custard View Post
    maybe I should clarify: I'll be doing normal coils synced first then min ilvl and then do the savage version... eventually.
    Synced savage coils are just pre-nerf versions of some coil raids; there are no "normal" coils, there were no separation back then so they are all savage.

    They are very hard since the old job kits had more abilities while now all of them are barebone at 50. There is no reason to do it synced besides challenge.
    (1)

  10. #10
    Player
    Local_Custard's Avatar
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    Mar 2023
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    Ul'dah
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    379
    Character
    Rhel'a Tayuun
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Culinarian Lv 83
    Quote Originally Posted by Somnolence View Post
    Synced savage coils are just pre-nerf versions of some coil raids; there are no "normal" coils, there were no separation back then so they are all savage.

    They are very hard since the old job kits had more abilities while now all of them are barebone at 50. There is no reason to do it synced besides challenge.
    Oh- good to know. ...Why do we have less things on level 50 kits than we did in previous expansions?
    (0)

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