Stop the Grind-to-the-Endgame madness!

[HiirNoivl]

OP seems to be wanting more content. That's understandable.

Right now the ratrace to the end exists because a lot of contents will become unavailable this winter. There's little content to do, so most people just want to do the content they haven't finished, like CC or AV or Garuda. This creates "newbie discrimination" because newbies can't do that content and other players just won't want to play content that they're already finished with.

Whether or not it creates "fascistic behavior" is another thing. Some folks want to run a tight ship even if PUG. Others are more flexible. But some folks are never flexible and you'll just have to deal with that, content or no content. However, that doesn't make the people that (example) reject a WHM for not having any AF fascistic. You're way off base with your "slacker vs. lifehaver" comment. It just opens up that Hardcore vs. Casual thread topic again. Not having enough time is part of the reason that I won't accept everyone who sends me a /tell into a party. Other days I can I have time with new folks and help them do content/play their job. Some days I have precious little time and won't be bothered. Show some respect for others and their time, please.

[Griffster]

OP seems to be wanting more content. That's understandable.

Right now the ratrace to the end exists because a lot of contents will become unavailable this winter. There's little content to do, so most people just want to do the content they haven't finished, like CC or AV or Garuda. This creates "newbie discrimination" because newbies can't do that content and other players just won't want to play content that they're already finished with.

This. Since returning to this game after and "extended break" My focus has been trying to level quickly, and do content that will disappear. The GC quests among others are a priority when I am not trying to level like crazy. I am fortunate that my LS has a group of folks that will help me finish content they are long since done with. If not for that, I am not sure how I could have accomplished a few things.

[Neptune]

Speaking of an end to grinding, what I find funny is how the casual player community adjusts their play style to the difficulty level of the content. Instead of focusing their time and effort, they react to the challenge of coordinated gameplay by turning around and running back to level 1 where they can grind up again, as if that is accomplishing anything. Rinse and repeat.

To me this is, like, certainly not a healthy situation. I blame both sides for that, but what's nice about the concept of this thread is that it would knock that problem out, regardless of change on either side.

[Deathmask]

This will be a short one. I long for a game in which the steps forward are packed with excitement and opportunities for fun. Not a rat-race to the end; the end being the only place where you will be considered someone by your fellow-players. End anti-newbie discrimination, make every level count. Slow down the pace of advancement. Smell the flowers. Struggle with difficult mobs at every level. Enter awesome events at every step.

This is actually more casual-player-friendly than accelerating and stultifying the game, so that almost anybody can get to the "fun-filled end."

End-obsessed game design fosters fascistic behavior in the community. Plus, it rewards the slacker that doesn't want a life, whereas it penalizes the player with the regular life. Making the advancement mechanics super-easy, the way the developers of this game sometimes seem to believe they should, does not improve the chances for anybody: The "Über" get to the end and get bored too early, the casuals never catch up, and are still discriminated.

Fill the world with one thousand Shposheas, only more complex and more attractive; make getting to level 10, 15, 20, 30 real challenges away from the repetitive levequests, and gratify us with oportunities that open up at every stage: Environmental puzzles, mysteriously coded scrolls, incomplete maps, a bit of Myst in Eorzea.

R

Bravo! I too long for a game where i can feel that leveling is a huge satisfaction and not a chore to be bypassed and getting from level 7 to level 8 will make me sleep dreaming about it. FFXI was like that at the beginning.

[Velhart]

I don't know, maybe it is just me, but how do people enjoy killing the same mob over and over all day in comparison to actually experiencing content to progress to 50? Like Yoshida said, this is an MMORPG, meaning....there needs to be RPG elements in here, and quests are very RPG friendly. This is a Final Fantasy game, we need to be engaged with it's story the whole way through. Yoshida sees this and wants to make sure it still retains Final Fantasy's elements of success in an online game. I believe his ideas will make that a reality.

[Andrien]

I have to agree with everything Duelle said in this thread



The thing about FFXI is that I had to solo mostly on BLM, and BLU killing the samething for hours because most prefer speed and that high exp chain number, and if I'm lucky my friends will let me kind of leech on PLD when level cap went up. Still they wont take PLD to do events even though its my preferred job to play on. I didn't even bother myself with leveling most of the jobs because I kept with what was most useful to xp, and to do contents with, and that is bad.

The direction the dev team is going with in FFXIV is the right track in terms of freedom of choice in my opinion. I can make a fair prediction that with content finder, and questing no one will be forced to play a certain role they don't enjoy because we'll have options and can take on challenges at your own pace.

[Kiote]

I really do hope Yoshida has found a way to advance through content that isn't the WoW quest grind. Final Fantasy is supposed to be an engaging story yes, but mob grinding has been an significant part of the series since the first game. Yes you can finish the game by just playing through the content, but you can not max out your character by doing so. I really do not want Yoshida to pollute this game with Walls of Text asking you to kill 9 guys only to proceed to the next wall of text asking you to kill nine guys. Its just Grinding XP, but you have to do it alone. If he has done what I hope he has, content will be very long quests that will advance your levels as you progress through them. Not 9 short quests to kill 9 guys full of text no one reads..

[Maxthunder]

I really do hope Yoshida has found a way to advance through content that isn't the WoW quest grind. Final Fantasy is supposed to be an engaging story yes, but mob grinding has been an significant part of the series since the first game. Yes you can finish the game by just playing through the content, but you can not max out your character by doing so. I really do not want Yoshida to pollute this game with Walls of Text asking you to kill 9 guys only to proceed to the next wall of text asking you to kill nine guys. Its just Grinding XP, but you have to do it alone. If he has done what I hope he has, content will be very long quests that will advance your levels as you progress through them. Not 9 short quests to kill 9 guys full of text no one reads..

As of right now I have no faith in Yoshi and the reason being is: leveling with quest and dungeon (instances). I dont like quest leveling and I dont like instanced content. I prefer different place to camp and kill mobs. If Yoshi tends to do quests and dungeons to level that they stand to lose more players. Utimately if Yoshi dosent balance all content open world, exp grinds at camps, quest etc FFXIV will be the 1st Final Fantasy title to sink like a ship!

[Hyrist]

As of right now I have no faith in Yoshi and the reason being is: leveling with quest and dungeon (instances). I dont like quest leveling and I dont like instanced content. I prefer different place to camp and kill mobs. If Yoshi tends to do quests and dungeons to level that they stand to lose more players. Utimately if Yoshi dosent balance all content open world, exp grinds at camps, quest etc FFXIV will be the 1st Final Fantasy title to sink like a ship!

And, if those systems were added on top of already additional systems, would you be as upset?

You can grind for EXP. You can Quest for EXP, you can Raid for EXP. It sounds like he's jut creating options for people and that there's finally sufficient reward for those who prefer to spend their time out adventuring rather than hitting up the same monster types again and again. I mean, that's ok if that's your thing, but for too long other methods have been inefficient for leveling purposes.

Yoshi makes a presumption for what players will be doing in the game, but by no means dose he think 100% of the playerbase will follow the formula. It's a statistical impossibility.

Your faith is your own to give, but I have the distinct idea that the tone implicated by that interview you are hung up about is not correct. And even if it is, you have your alternatives. Who knows, you may even change your views and like it after experiencing it.

Try not to be so locked down in your opinions before sampling the actual product.

[Shurrikhan]

And, if those systems were added on top of already additional systems, would you be as upset?

You can grind for EXP. You can Quest for EXP, you can Raid for EXP. It sounds like he's jut creating options for people and that there's finally sufficient reward for those who prefer to spend their time out adventuring rather than hitting up the same monster types again and again. I mean, that's ok if that's your thing, but for too long other methods have been inefficient for leveling purposes.

Yoshi makes a presumption for what players will be doing in the game, but by no means dose he think 100% of the playerbase will follow the formula. It's a statistical impossibility.

So then I guess the question becomes, given limited and shared resources, what is the quality methodology in adding content: covering the largest percentage of the playerbase for a content any-way-you-like community or really acing some key aspects? What lines of thought might make the most out of those resources?

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Edit: Though this is probably obvious from most posts I've written, I would never suggest a sheer cost-efficiency mindset for ideas made on the forums, especially since making ideas would normally cost SE time (and therefore money) but is here free.