Feature Request/Suggestion - English (JP) Language option in Launcher

[Chajii]

You ever notice how some people load in faster than others in Praetorium? That's a biproduct of that.

In total the difference between the shortest (JP) and the longest (EN) is only about a minute.

Actually learning a language is more complicated than just memorizing a bunch of words and their appropriate context, which is what a lot of these resources only teach.

Of course learning a language is more than just memorising stuff, you would also have to interact with the language regularly such as reading books, listening to music and watching videos in the targeted language, learning resources are only there to help you understand the language, you have to build your vocabulary bank and such through other means.

You do realize that English is the only language option with the most amount of revisions that literally do not exist in other languages of the game, right? If you talk to most NPCs, view item descriptions, or read various other things in German or French and compare it against a machine translation of the Japanese script, you'll find that it's more consistent in that regard than it is in English.

If it is as you stated that German and French localisations are better in your opinion, consider trying those 2 languages as they are easier than learning Japanese to a English speaker.

Telling people who are dissatisfied with the localization to just 'learn Japanese' is not a valid rebuttal to their criticisms, nor is it a valid dismissal of suggestions for how their criticisms can be accommodated (such as adding a separate EN language option).

If you are dissatisfied with the localisation, you could ask for improvement of the localisation (such as why the tooltips of Sacred Soil and Passage of Arms can't be written normally as 10% mitigation like other 3 languages).

Telling people to 'learn Japanese' is simply a suggestion, I could even suggest a person that is satisfied with the EN localisation to learn Japanese and suggest them to try out the game in JP; suggesting people to try the game in JP (with the step of learning Japanese) is merely giving an option.

You specifically might not consider it as worthy of the effort you have to put in but some others might actually consider it as a good reason to start learning a language (I am mentioning this because you stated that you yourself are already playing in JP, hence this suggestion wouldn't apply to you specifically).

[Telkira]

If it was actually free to provide then you'd already be getting it, as that would improve the quality and desirability of the product at no cost to the company. The fact that it's not already in the product demonstrates that there's a meaningful associated cost.

A lot of other features could be described just the same way, such as corrections to various parts of the game's text content, many of which do get posted here, meet the criteria of a defect, but do not get fixed, at least not until much later or until the right person viewing the thread takes a look and escalates it.

What I'm providing is feedback that - hopefully - will drive some sort of internal discussion and change, because it would make the game better.

In total the difference between the shortest (JP) and the longest (EN) is only about a minute.

It's a little bit longer than that, but it's still very much noticeable. And given how literally nobody likes being forced to sit thru the same cutscenes over and over, it still makes it go a tad faster when everyone runs it with that setting enabled.

Of course learning a language is more than just memorising stuff, you would also have to interact with the language regularly such as reading books, listening to music and watching videos in the targeted language, learning resources are only there to help you understand the language, you have to build your vocabulary bank and such through other means.

Right - but even with all of that, it's still a difficult task for a lot of people. If SE could help bridge that gap by accommodating these preferences, then it would be astronomical in helping appeal to fans who want a faithful, authentic experience while also garnering good will with said fans.

If you are dissatisfied with the localisation, you could ask for improvement of the localisation (such as why the tooltips of Sacred Soil and Passage of Arms can't be written normally as 10% mitigation like other 3 languages).

I would, but simply having a translation would solve that issue along with many others, like the ones in my OP. What I'm suggesting would instill a philosophy of "content consistency" so that way these functional aspects, like spell/weaponskill/ability descriptions being consistent across languages, and not fluffed up in English.

Telling people to 'learn Japanese' is simply a suggestion, I could even suggest a person that is satisfied with the EN localisation to learn Japanese and suggest them to try out the game in JP; suggesting people to try the game in JP (with the step of learning Japanese) is merely giving an option.

It's not 'just a suggestion', though, especially when it's done in bad faith.
Any time someone has issues with the way Japanese media is localized, those who are content with it just dismiss their criticisms with 'learn japanese' instead of actually sitting there and thinking "okay, this is different and that may be a problem" and refusing to think about the art that they consume as being flawed.

You specifically might not consider it as worthy of the effort you have to put in but some others might actually consider it as a good reason to start learning a language (I am mentioning this because you stated that you yourself are already playing in JP, hence this suggestion wouldn't apply to you specifically).

Learning Japanese is something that I would like to do, believe me, but as I've said before, not everyone has the luxury of just being able to pick up and learn a whole new manner of communication. It's just not feasible for most people, when it's more than feasible for SE to diversify their offerings to give people content that is consistent across the board.

[AmiableApkallu]

If SE could help bridge that gap by accommodating these preferences, then it would be astronomical in helping appeal to fans who want a faithful, authentic experience while also garnering good will with said fans.

You've not experienced FFXIV until you've played it in the original Klingon.

[Telkira]

Dunno how I missed this, but I'm going to address it.

Maybe you should rewatch that localization panel, because the process that Kate and Koji-Fox describes should make it clear that there is not some "directly translated" version of the entire script that exists early in the localization process that could just be used "instead", the English translation/localization is only able to be implemented after all the revision and checks are done.

I think you should be the one to re-watch it. They flat out said that actual translation is the first task, with revisions coming later down the line (assuming the Japanese writers don't make sudden revisions, then the process repeats wherever/however necessary).
They're not making localization revisions as they go along, they have to have and maintain a 'master translation' to build from that's as direct as can be.
There are notes that are kept, discussions, consultations, meetings, everything is tracked and recorded, otherwise they wouldn't have a game.



What I'm suggesting is that they take that initial translation and just create a language option based solely on that, with no arbitrary revisions.
As I've said, the work is mostly done, it just needs to be looked through and tested.

When something like an anime has separate subtitle and dubtitle/closed-caption options that's because those two scripts were written at different points and in separate processes, dubtitle scripts aren't created by directly modifying an existing subtitle script, they are two separate scripting processes that are made from scratch and translating from the source language, with the resulting differences being due to the additional considerations and objectives that translators have to take into account when creating a dub script.

A 'dubtitle' is literally just a transcription of the dub, and does differ from the sub because subs are usually translated directly from Japanese. When the 'dub' script is made, it's done by adapting/revising/'localizing' the Japanese script into English. The Japanese content always comes first, and then the script for the dub follows.

[Telkira]

Bumping this. Given the contentious nature of 'localizing' something vs. translating, I feel that this thread is more important than ever.

[Akria]

Original Post.

Honestly, I agree with you, and I don't understand why you're getting so much pushback for this suggestion.

Not only is the English localization objectively harder to read, but a lot of their localization rewrites also often get in the way of story, and sometimes I feel like they're even disrespecting the work the writers have put in by changing things so drastically. I saw a comparison between a very important cutscene involving [SPOILER] Minfillia and the Warriors of Darkness [/SPOILER] and it completely blew my mind with just how messed up the localization rewriting was in that scene.

I'm lucky because I happen to speak French as fluently as I speak English, and after taking 2 years to get through the MSQ in English I've decided to re-do the story in French to see the difference and it's so much easier to read, it's not even funny.

No "ye olde French", no unintelligible Urianger, way less liberties taken, things are more to the point. I'm still in ARR patches currently, yet MSQ just feels so much easier to get through. I only wish that my fellow English-speaking players could have a similar experience.

I would have caught up with Endwalker in less than a year had I played in French from the start, since the main reason it took so long is that I had to parse my way through the absolute word salad that we have in English. It was giving me headaches and I often had to take breaks to even realize what was being said. My sub time would have literally been used more effectively, and it's something I regret a lot.

People keep suggesting to "learn Japanese if you hate it so much" and it's just not a fair thing to say at all. The idea that people should learn a whole other language just to get the accurate, easier to read version of the story is ridiculous.

Personally I just wish they never took such liberties altogether, yet here we are... So your suggestion is probably the best case scenario, especially considering that not that much work would need to be put in when it comes to the implementation.

However, this issue has always been quite bad, and not just with this game, but with tons of games from Japan. I hope I can one day learn Japanese so I don't have to gamble on middlemen interfering with the original work.

Thank you for posting about this, it was quite a good read. I will be sharing this around with my friends and see what they think. Have a good day/night wherever you are.

[Kfarc]

I would also like to ask for an option for that. I think it was in Yakuza/Like a dragon games where since adding dubbing they started doing a double text localization. One for dubbing + subtitles and one for OG Japanese dubbing and text that fits closer to said original dialog. So it was done somewhere else before and if English translation team of FF14 would so kind to add it, I would be very greatfull.

[Telkira]

I would also like to ask for an option for that. I think it was in Yakuza/Like a dragon games where since adding dubbing they started doing a double text localization. One for dubbing + subtitles and one for OG Japanese dubbing and text that fits closer to said original dialog. So it was done somewhere else before and if English translation team of FF14 would so kind to add it, I would be very greatfull.

I would love nothing more than that. That's the norm for anime produciton, idk why it can't be that way for games too.

[MeeDeggiThePunisher]

I've always hated dubtitles but accepted them in video games. Doing two text tracks for the English dub and JP sub is a big ask.

[Kuroka]

Playing on German, i shiver on the though of having to play English, the localization is just too hard, the liberties too far... (And we dont even start about a certain VA lol).

IDK why so many english translations are so obsessed with changing things, censor or adept em for more sensitive ppl...